Author Topic: In praise of Big Baby  (Read 6150 times)

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #15 on: May 24, 2010, 04:55:12 AM »

Offline Bahku

  • CB HOF Editor
  • Bill Sharman
  • *******************
  • Posts: 19771
  • Tommy Points: 3632
  • Oe ma krr pamtseotu
Yeah I've always loved Perk too, but most of the games lately he has been substituted a lot either by Rasheed or Baby. Too many fouls. Baby's numbers are always higher than his and he's not even a center, though he has been asked to play that part when Perk is out, along with Sheed when he is not in foul trouble.  
That's what I love about Baby. He can wear many hats and do a good job at all of them.
After reading a whole season of BBD bashing here, it is awfully quiet lately. Rasheed too, who has been excellent, even in the 3 pointers, which everyone bashed him for here.
And what about Ray Allen and the trade him calls? What about Tony Allen and the Haiku bashing?
What about the Doc bashing?
Is this purely a bashing blog or what? Because it sure seemed like it during the season. That's why I quit coming.  

And almost every defensive assignment he has is a good deal taller than he is, which makes it even more amazing that he gets the numbers he does ... I love his energy and intensity.

As far as the "bashing", I think there's a difference between being critical and just bashing. Last fall, I was one of Sheed's biggest supporters, even though I knew what baggage he brought with him. But I have been critical of him at times about the threes, because his 3-point shooting was just plain horrendous at times ... there were multiple games where he was 1-for-12 or even worse, and yet he wouldn't commit to playing the post, (where he's most effective), or moving his feet on defense. He has really turned it on for the playoffs, but I wish he felt that the regular season was important enough for that as well. He's been big in the post-season to this point, and I think the criticism has diminished.

Tony Allen has received a lot of criticism in the past also because he set a very bad precident, and many people were very doubtful about him turning things around, which he finally has. He got into a great deal of trouble a few years ago, made many poor decisions, had gang ties, chronic injuries ... it was very hard on us here in Boston because he was given many, many chances, and he just plain was apathetic about it. It looks like he's finally begun to grow up and make the most of what he's been given here, and no one's any happier about it than I. I really felt he'd completely given up last year, and just didn't care about anything ... I'm glad I was wrong.

Why anyone would ever want to trade Ray is beyond me, but it seems to be the newer/younger mindset, (not everyone, of course), that think trading is what you do when someone's in a slump ... Ray's not shooting well, trade him ... Paul's numbers are low, trade him ... somebody sneezes, trade him ... it's absurd, but it's so prevelent now. I hate that team loyalty and die-hard fans are becoming casualty of the new process, but what can we do? When it comes to game-winning big shots, clutch free-throws, moving without the ball, and just plain being a class act, Ray is like gold in the bank ... I love the guy and hope he retires as a Celtic.

The most discouraging thing for me as a Celtic fan are the trade threads ... whenever the team is not doing well, everyone's got an answer with a trade deal, and it gets old. There have been so many times when 7 of the top 10 threads are trades ... it makes me crazy. Trades should be a very last option, when everything else has been exhausted, not the first option, as most people think. But it gives people something to talk about, too, and I think that's a big part of it.

There is a lot of bashing at times, Mmbaby, because I think people use it as a way to vent. But you have to separate constructive criticism from the rest, because sometimes, whether we like it or not, our players don't do their best, or try their hardest, and being human like the rest of us, they are not above that criticism. I think a big part of Tony Allen's turnaround was because of the criticism he received, much of it deserved, so it's not always as bad as it seems.

I've also found personally that when posts are getting me down, I just gravitate toward the people here who I know are positive and optimistic, and most people here are just that. You happen to be one of those positive people, so I hope you won't stay away ... that doesn't do anything but punish the people here who like you and miss you ... we shouldn't let the bashers ruin it for the other 99.9%. ;)
« Last Edit: May 24, 2010, 05:03:33 AM by Bahku »
2010 PAPOUG, 2012 & 2017 PAPTYG CHAMP, HD BOT

* BAHKU MUSIC *

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #16 on: May 24, 2010, 06:47:23 AM »

Offline hwangjini_1

  • Dennis Johnson
  • ******************
  • Posts: 18379
  • Tommy Points: 2764
  • bammokja
He's playing well and provides the energy off the bench that this team needs.  Things I like about his play:

-He attacks the hoop on offense and gets to the line.

-He's boxing out on the defensive end.

-He's pushing Dwight away from the hoop.

As someone stated above he most certainly benefits from Pierce & Rondo, as well as Ray's spacing, but hats off to him for making the most of it.  I worry about how he'll matchup with the Lakers though, but I know he'll at least try hard.

Good post and thread.

What has also impressed me is big baby's mid-range jump shot. It is money and makes the second unit much stronger on offensive.

However, I know this thread is a BB love fest, but let's not get carried away either.

Much as I like BB, his game under the basket will forever be a problem since he is short for a power forward and gets his shot blocked time and time again.  BB is a great bench player, but he not about to pull a team to a championship. 
I believe Gandhi is the only person who knew about real democracy — not democracy as the right to go and buy what you want, but democracy as the responsibility to be accountable to everyone around you. Democracy begins with freedom from hunger, freedom from unemployment, freedom from fear, and freedom from hatred.
- Vandana Shiva

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #17 on: May 24, 2010, 06:49:47 AM »

Offline Celtics Fan

  • Jaylen Brown
  • Posts: 620
  • Tommy Points: 38
Hello my brothers in Green and white. So happy to join you all tonight. Well I just got through watching the FAKERS AND SUNS and let me tell you Baby Haters out there something. He play harder than any of those bums on the Suns bench and Lakers. Mental toughness you cant teach man. His shot is ugly but he hit it and he has some nice low post moves. Be happy brothers he is playing good right now during the biggest stage man, hell he was balling in the 2008 championship and 2009 playoffs. I think some of you are to spoiled also man. Point blank we have what it takes to win it all this year. Next year lets go young in the draft and sign Ray and Paul back..

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #18 on: May 24, 2010, 07:10:43 AM »

Offline moiso

  • Tiny Archibald
  • *******
  • Posts: 7691
  • Tommy Points: 447
He's playing well and provides the energy off the bench that this team needs.  Things I like about his play:

-He attacks the hoop on offense and gets to the line.

-He's boxing out on the defensive end.

-He's pushing Dwight away from the hoop.

As someone stated above he most certainly benefits from Pierce & Rondo, as well as Ray's spacing, but hats off to him for making the most of it.  I worry about how he'll matchup with the Lakers though, but I know he'll at least try hard.

Good post and thread.

What has also impressed me is big baby's mid-range jump shot. It is money and makes the second unit much stronger on offensive.

However, I know this thread is a BB love fest, but let's not get carried away either.

Much as I like BB, his game under the basket will forever be a problem since he is short for a power forward and gets his shot blocked time and time again.  BB is a great bench player, but he not about to pull a team to a championship. 
Yep.  He is a great bench player and he can be a short term starter.  Gotta love his motor.  Even when he was struggling earlier in the year the effort was always there.  He definitely does some things that a championship team needs off the bench.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #19 on: May 24, 2010, 07:31:47 AM »

Offline thirstyboots18

  • Chat Moderator
  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8791
  • Tommy Points: 2584
I have often been a Big Baby critic.  However, I agree, Glen Davis is a terrific bench player (and, like Scal, he is willing to sacrifice and do whatever is asked of him).  His flaws are just more visible than a lot, but then so are his strengths.  I can get behind someone with the nickname "Dancing Bear"   ;D .  As long as "Dancing Bear" is helping us win games  with his strength and enthusiasm, I will be cheering for him. 
Yesterday is history.
Tomorrow is a mystery.
Today is a gift...
   That is why it is called the present.
Visit the CelticsBlog Live Game Chat!

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #20 on: May 24, 2010, 10:36:10 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

  • Johnny Most
  • ********************
  • Posts: 20738
  • Tommy Points: 2365
  • Be the posts you wish to see in the world.
He's playing well and provides the energy off the bench that this team needs.  Things I like about his play:

-He attacks the hoop on offense and gets to the line.

-He's boxing out on the defensive end.

-He's pushing Dwight away from the hoop.

As someone stated above he most certainly benefits from Pierce & Rondo, as well as Ray's spacing, but hats off to him for making the most of it.  I worry about how he'll matchup with the Lakers though, but I know he'll at least try hard.

Good post and thread.

What has also impressed me is big baby's mid-range jump shot. It is money and makes the second unit much stronger on offensive.

However, I know this thread is a BB love fest, but let's not get carried away either.

Much as I like BB, his game under the basket will forever be a problem since he is short for a power forward and gets his shot blocked time and time again.  BB is a great bench player, but he not about to pull a team to a championship. 

I agree, Baby's a long way from All-Star territory; I wrote the post because he's been mostly terrific during this run.  BBD has a broad skill set for a big, hustles his butt off every game, and steps up in big games.  Those to me go a long way in making up for deficiencies, especially the last one after what we've seen from our opponents these past 2 series.  And I think he's been getting blocked much less these playoffs - he got blocked 4 times early in Game 2 against Miami, but rarely since.

I started the season really annoyed at Davis, and I'm ending it as a fan again.  Feels good.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #21 on: May 24, 2010, 12:51:27 PM »

Offline mmbaby

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 881
  • Tommy Points: 53
Well, it's good to see some of you manning up to your clearly wrong assessment of Big Baby Davis these past 3 years. But yet...you still have to be the critic. The yes, but.....attitude. Baby has absolutely proven he's a starter and can more than handle the job. And for who? The Celtics, in my opinion, the best team in the NBA. When he becomes an allstar, will you say, well I always liked him.
Come on, man up some more and admit the truth.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #22 on: May 24, 2010, 12:59:52 PM »

Offline mmbaby

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 881
  • Tommy Points: 53
Oh I forgot to say thank you to Bahku for your kind words. It is hard to avoid the debates with the doubters and bashers when they, as fans, are ragging their own players to death. I understand about conversation, debate and constructive assessments, but the name-calling is so elementary school toned.
I have known from the start that BBD is headed for greatness and got personally attached for my statements. All I'm saying is MAN UP!
Not to you, of course. You are one of the fairest and nicest guys here. So again, thanks for the encouragement.
Tonight is going to be fun! Can't wait.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #23 on: May 24, 2010, 01:05:10 PM »

Offline mmbaby

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 881
  • Tommy Points: 53
Oh and welcome to the blog, Celtics Fan and I like the way you straight-talk. TP to you.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #24 on: May 24, 2010, 01:15:24 PM »

Offline thirstyboots18

  • Chat Moderator
  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8791
  • Tommy Points: 2584
If I am being critical of Glen Davis, you are also being critical of me and my opinion.  I said Glen Davis is a terrific bench player.  Maybe I should have added "on this team"...Last year he started on this team and we found just how much we missed someone of KG's length, skill and basketball IQ.  Davis did an admirable job when he was called, but he was not a starting caliber power forward, and Pierce and Ray Allen got worn out trying to make up for the intangibles KG brings.  Davis is good, but he is what he is...and that is a power forward/center who is not quite tall enough to compete with the big boys on the elite teams night after night.  They say, "You can't teach hustle" (Glen Davis has that in abundance) and you can't teach hight"!

Glen Davis is big and strong, and that is an advantage off the bench for bursts of time.  But it is not enough for a starter on a Championship team.  We absolutely need someone who can establish position and/or shoot over oponents in the power forward/center position, IMO.  (And, incidentally, mmbaby....I never "man up"  ha ha ha)
Yesterday is history.
Tomorrow is a mystery.
Today is a gift...
   That is why it is called the present.
Visit the CelticsBlog Live Game Chat!

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #25 on: May 24, 2010, 01:28:54 PM »

Offline mmbaby

  • Jayson Tatum
  • Posts: 881
  • Tommy Points: 53
Hahaha, well you are entitled to your opinion and maybe I should have said woman-up? I think my meaning was clear over the semantics. I don't think his height is going to be an issue for him as he was able to block out Howard admirably over and over again.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #26 on: May 24, 2010, 01:46:35 PM »

Offline thirstyboots18

  • Chat Moderator
  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8791
  • Tommy Points: 2584
Hahaha, well you are entitled to your opinion and maybe I should have said woman-up? I think my meaning was clear over the semantics. I don't think his height is going to be an issue for him as he was able to block out Howard admirably over and over again.
OK..I guess we will just have to agreeably disagree!  You are correct, he did block Howard...did a great job on him!  We need that.  However, if we make it to the finals we will not be playing Howard and adjustments will have been made by our opponents...they are scouting us, too.  If the Lakers reach the finals, they have a lot of length in their front court.  That is why, IMO, the Celts signed Rasheed Wallace's 6'11"/7' frame to a contract...and that is where height is going to be a big factor.  Dancing Bear's enthusiasm and strength will still be useful, though.

(On a personal note, I am glad to see more women get involved in a great sport and on a great blog!  Keep posting.)
Yesterday is history.
Tomorrow is a mystery.
Today is a gift...
   That is why it is called the present.
Visit the CelticsBlog Live Game Chat!

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #27 on: May 24, 2010, 01:57:25 PM »

Offline celts55

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2694
  • Tommy Points: 580
He's playing well and provides the energy off the bench that this team needs.  Things I like about his play:

-He attacks the hoop on offense and gets to the line.

-He's boxing out on the defensive end.

-He's pushing Dwight away from the hoop.

As someone stated above he most certainly benefits from Pierce & Rondo, as well as Ray's spacing, but hats off to him for making the most of it.  I worry about how he'll matchup with the Lakers though, but I know he'll at least try hard.

Good post and thread.

What has also impressed me is big baby's mid-range jump shot. It is money and makes the second unit much stronger on offensive.

However, I know this thread is a BB love fest, but let's not get carried away either.

Much as I like BB, his game under the basket will forever be a problem since he is short for a power forward and gets his shot blocked time and time again.   BB is a great bench player, but he not about to pull a team to a championship. 

While I agree that he struggles to not get his shot blocked at times under the basket, I don't know that it will be forever a problem. There have been a number of under sizes forwards in the history of the NBA. Barkley, Unseld, Silas, etc, who learned how to carve out space and were sucessful under the hoop. Glen is still young and had a chance to learn. He's already doing a better job of kicking out the ball after he gets an offensive rebound instead of taking it up agains't 3 guys. I think if he works hard at it, he could certainly learn how to get off his shot.

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #28 on: May 24, 2010, 02:05:09 PM »

Offline thirstyboots18

  • Chat Moderator
  • Don Nelson
  • ********
  • Posts: 8791
  • Tommy Points: 2584
You are right, and he could develop a hook shot and a little more range.  When that day comes, I will revisit this with a changed opinion.  As of right now, I stand by my opinion that he is an excellent bench player, but not a starter, although he can fill in for one on occasion.
Yesterday is history.
Tomorrow is a mystery.
Today is a gift...
   That is why it is called the present.
Visit the CelticsBlog Live Game Chat!

Re: In praise of Big Baby
« Reply #29 on: May 24, 2010, 02:14:07 PM »

Offline celts55

  • Jim Loscutoff
  • **
  • Posts: 2694
  • Tommy Points: 580
You are right, and he could develop a hook shot and a little more range.  When that day comes, I will revisit this with a changed opinion.  As of right now, I stand by my opinion that he is an excellent bench player, but not a starter, although he can fill in for one on occasion.

Oh I agree with you. I was just responding to the statemant that he will forever be getting his shots blocked. I wasn't suggesting that he's a starter on a championship team, he's a very nice bench player.