Can the Celtics win another series if their Center doesn't score?

[Chris]

Woah woah woah.  That list has Andrea Bargnani at #14 ahead of Marcus Camby.  Pretty tough to take it seriously at all given that.

Marcus Camby has been pretty bad at one on one defense for a while now. He's a good rebounder and shot blocker, but he goes for the block too often and lacks the strength to defend the paint by himself.

Yeah, He is most certainly not a good low post defender, but he is a good weakside defender, and in the right system he can be very effective. 

[Fafnir]

Also does this account for recieving help from a double team?

My guess is that Bargs got help more often than Marcus did.

[pearljammer10]

Thing is, in order for this team to be good, they dont need Perk to score the basketball. Perkins isnt a scorer, as long as he keeps playing defense and rebounding im fine with that. He has had some nice blocks down there on the defensive end in this series.

[Chris]

Thing is, in order for this team to be good, they dont need Perk to score the basketball. Perkins isnt a scorer, as long as he keeps playing defense and rebounding im fine with that. He has had some nice blocks down there on the defensive end in this series.

All true.  But he needs to give them something on offense.  The Cavs are too good to play 4 on 5 against.  If Perk cannot convert the easy laydowns or offensive rebounds, then it makes it significantly easier for the Cavs to take the other 4 guys away.

If they don't have to respect Perk, it allows the Cavs big men to shadow Ray coming off picks into the corner, blocking the passing lanes.  It allows them to cut off the routes to the basket for Rondo and Pierce.  It allows them to double KG in the post, or at the elbow.  And so on.

While Perkins does not win games with his offense, against a championship level defense, he can absolutely lose games if they don't get anything from him offensively.

And that isn't even talking about how much more the turnovers hurt.

[BballTim]

Woah woah woah.  That list has Andrea Bargnani at #14 ahead of Marcus Camby.  Pretty tough to take it seriously at all given that.

  Actually it's not. Camby's not much of a 1v1 defender on the inside. Al used to destroy him when he was on the Celts.

[coco]

I think the Celtics are a better team when Perk isn't looking to score.

Defense and rebound, that's all I need from Perk

[Chris]

I think the Celtics are a better team when Perk isn't looking to score.

Defense and rebound, that's all I need from Perk

Well, I think there is a difference between looking to score, and converting on easy scoring chances within the flow of the offense.

I agree that Perk should NEVER look to score, but the problem lately is that he has not been converting what should be easy baskets.

[Mr October]

Woah woah woah.  That list has Andrea Bargnani at #14 ahead of Marcus Camby.  Pretty tough to take it seriously at all given that.

  Actually it's not. Camby's not much of a 1v1 defender on the inside. Al used to destroy him when he was on the Celts.

Agreed. I've never thought of Camby as even an OK post defender. He is a tremendous help defender - that's how he gets the vast majority of his blocks.

...

And, on topic, yeah, Perkins has to at least score on the shots he gets within 3 feet of the basket. I have faith in him against Cleveland though. He'll be matched up against 2 guys that are slower than him. I think the pesky speed of the Miami bigs and guards swarming him is affecting his game.

Also Perkins clearly has some nagging injuries affecting him (and throughout the second half of the season). Hopefully he can hold together.

C'mon baby, hold together.

[Greenbean]

Absloutely. What everyone else said basically. If he is playing elote defense and rebounding the ball, we are getting enough from him. I actually thought he could have scored in game 3 but he was consistently making the extra pass rather than forcing the ball.

Think of the Spurs. In their championships post-Robinson, they always had a big defensive minded center that they didnt rely on to score.

I will say that if Perk is getting open looks that means the ball is moving though. It's a good sign if he is getting open dunks. Not a great sign if the ball is dumped into him early in the shot clock and stiks in his hands.

[Roy Hobbs]

First, to answer the question:  yes, we can win.  The team is at its best when Perk is doing the dirty work, and the rest of the team is scoring.

That said, one of the things I thought was interesting in yesterday's game was that there were a few times when Perk had good position, and was calling for the ball, where Rondo just ignored him and passed around the perimeter.  When Perk has a mismatch inside, I'd prefer to see the ball fed to him.  Overall, I can't fault the game plan or Rondo's decision making, but that's one area I'd like to see improved.

[BballTim]

I think what you see is what you are going to get...Perk has reached his ceiling(imo),and thats not good enough in todays NBA..As we go into each season,the younger centers around the league will continue to get better and from what ive seen Perk is close to what he will be.I never felt he was a starter type center in the first place but with having the Big 3...(a healthy)KG's help defense  disguised Perks weaknesses at times in the past. 

  I've been hearing that Perk's reached his ceiling since he averaged 4 points and 5 boards a game. He's only 25 and despite his recent play his offensive game showed improvement this year. I don't think it's unusual for centers to still be improving at his age.

[Who]

Woah woah woah.  That list has Andrea Bargnani at #14 ahead of Marcus Camby.  Pretty tough to take it seriously at all given that.

Bargnani is a good-to-very good post defender. The only thing holding him back is consistent effort. He is very effective against big name post scorers but takes far too many plays off against lesser players.

It's just the rest of Bargnani's defensive game which is pathetic -- all other areas of one-on-one defense (mid post, high post, perimeter shooting bigs, defending high post passers, defending face up bigs), pick and roll defense (very poor), transition defense (very poor), switches (very poor), defensive rotations (very poor) -- which overall makes him a huge defensive liability ... but he does have one defensive strength and that is post defense.

You should check out his defense against Tim Duncan when he held Timmy to 8-22 shooting and absolutely shut him down in the fourth quarter. It was a tremendous exhibition of post defense from Bargnani.

[housecall]

First, to answer the question:  yes, we can win.  The team is at its best when Perk is doing the dirty work, and the rest of the team is scoring.

That said, one of the things I thought was interesting in yesterday's game was that there were a few times when Perk had good position, and was calling for the ball, where Rondo just ignored him and passed around the perimeter.  When Perk has a mismatch inside, I'd prefer to see the ball fed to him.  Overall, I can't fault the game plan or Rondo's decision making, but that's one area I'd like to see improved.

Are you meaning in this series only you'd like to see that area improved or do you mean for the future plans for the team?If you mean the future,are you suggesting they look into the possibility of a different(new)center?...was it a diplomatic way of saying im not pleased with Perk's overall play for the future on this team as a starter?

[Roy Hobbs]

First, to answer the question:  yes, we can win.  The team is at its best when Perk is doing the dirty work, and the rest of the team is scoring.

That said, one of the things I thought was interesting in yesterday's game was that there were a few times when Perk had good position, and was calling for the ball, where Rondo just ignored him and passed around the perimeter.  When Perk has a mismatch inside, I'd prefer to see the ball fed to him.  Overall, I can't fault the game plan or Rondo's decision making, but that's one area I'd like to see improved.

Are you meaning in this series only you'd like to see that area improved or do you mean for the future plans for the team?If you mean the future,are you suggesting they look into the possibility of a different(new)center?...was it a diplomatic way of saying im not pleased with Perk's overall play for the future on this team as a starter?

I was mostly just talking about yesterday's game, and what I'd like to see going forward in the playoffs.  I'm not saying that Perk should see a lot more touches, but there were opportunities when he should have been fed the ball.

Regarding Perk's play overall, I've been a bit disappointed this year, but a lot of that is probably related to injuries.  I don't think that KP necessarily needs to be a major scoring threat, so long as he plays good defense and rebounds (which hasn't necessarily been a strength, either.)

I would like to see the team get a post presence on offense, just to give teams another look.  That doesn't necessarily need to be at the center position, but I'd like to see somebody who can consistently score down low.

[housecall]

I think what you see is what you are going to get...Perk has reached his ceiling(imo),and thats not good enough in todays NBA..As we go into each season,the younger centers around the league will continue to get better and from what ive seen Perk is close to what he will be.I never felt he was a starter type center in the first place but with having the Big 3...(a healthy)KG's help defense  disguised Perks weaknesses at times in the past. 

  I've been hearing that Perk's reached his ceiling since he averaged 4 points and 5 boards a game. He's only 25 and despite his recent play his offensive game showed improvement this year. I don't think it's unusual for centers to still be improving at his age.

6yrs.in the league has more to do with it than a player's age...after 5yrs.you should be close what you will be.example:Al Horford from yr one to yr two we can see the maturity in his game to the point of him making the all star team.Last season Al didn't have a consistent shot,but over the summer he developed a couple low post moves that work well.
 I agree with you that Perk did come into the seson with more upside to his overall game,but it seems that he lost some of it during the regular season.