This past trade deadline will prove to be a watershed moment for this team,,,

[buzz]

You're right, but the sad part is we got nothing anybody wants. We had it in ray's expiring. Now we don't even have that. Wyc blew it. Danny has always said he would have broken up the original Big Three. I fully believe he would've done the same here. that stuff about "I like this team" that he and Doc spew is nothing but spin and the party line based on the circumstances which Wyc has created and over which danny and doc have no control. Wyc pays the bills including D and D's salaries. He's the puppet master.

We have $30m in expiring contracts in each of the next two seasons.

I understand we really needed to make a move, but if nothing beneficial was there, why force it?

Can you imagine a year from now, and Chris Paul goes on the block, and we can't make an offer of Rondo/Pierce for Paul/Okafor because we have $40m of our payroll locked into 3 mediocre 35-year old power forwards in KG/Jams/Sheed?

Patience, grasshopper.

We weren't that close to winning it all this season to make a bad trade like that one.

[FatjohnReturns]

Great post. I do believe Wyc held up the Ray for Butler and Jamison deal.

Antawn Jamison would have been a horrible decision, Caron was excellent but that contract is NOT WORTH IT. It's bad business.

You sure about that? Caron is due
2009-2010   $9,780,970
2010-2011  $10,561,960

With career averages of 16 ppg with 6 boards and 3 assists.
"but that contract is NOT WORTH IT"  this is false.

[csfansince60s]

Great post. I do believe Wyc held up the Ray for Butler and Jamison deal.

Antawn Jamison would have been a horrible decision, Caron was excellent but that contract is NOT WORTH IT. It's bad business.

Hey X, while I agree it was a bad contract, I don't think it would have necessarily been a bad decision. The Mavs got Haywood and Butler, maybe we wouldn't have had to swallow Jamison, but if we had, we would have been contenders for the next two. Now we're pretenders. That last year of Jamison's contract would have been the one to hurt the most, but if he and Butler would have gotten us at least one more title and a chance at another one or two, that bad contract may have been worth it and made the decision a not so horrible one..

[buzz]

Uh huh. His last 3 years in Golden State he didnt miss a game. He played in all 82 games and averaged 20 ppg and 7 rpg 1999 thru 2002 and thats horrible? I am having a hard time understanding what your talking about.

Oh... you mean the 3 seasons that they won 57 games combined?

The only people Jamison fools are the fantasy sports crowd.

Can't dribble, can't pass, can't defend, can't win.

Guy is a garbageman statpadder, much like current Warrior Corey Maggette... another career loser.

[FatjohnReturns]

You're right, but the sad part is we got nothing anybody wants. We had it in ray's expiring. Now we don't even have that. Wyc blew it. Danny has always said he would have broken up the original Big Three. I fully believe he would've done the same here. that stuff about "I like this team" that he and Doc spew is nothing but spin and the party line based on the circumstances which Wyc has created and over which danny and doc have no control. Wyc pays the bills including D and D's salaries. He's the puppet master.

We have $30m in expiring contracts in each of the next two seasons.

I understand we really needed to make a move, but if nothing beneficial was there, why force it?

Can you imagine a year from now, and Chris Pul goes on the block, and we can't make an offer of Rondo/Pierce for Paul/Okafor because we have $40m of our payroll locked into 3 mediocre 35-year old power forwards in KG/Jams/Sheed?

Patience, grasshopper.

We weren't that close to winning it all this season to make a bad trade like that one.

"We have $30m in expiring contracts in each of the next two seasons"  What good is that when we have a very small window to be contenders. We had a 20 million expiring this year and what could that have got us Heinrich and Thomas cmon. Once KG is done the window will be closed for a long time.  

[FatjohnReturns]

Uh huh. His last 3 years in Golden State he didnt miss a game. He played in all 82 games and averaged 20 ppg and 7 rpg 1999 thru 2002 and thats horrible? I am having a hard time understanding what your talking about.

Oh... you mean the 3 seasons that they won 57 games combined?

The only people Jamison fools are the fantasy sports crowd.

Can't dribble, can't pass, can't defend, can't win.

Guy is a garbageman statpadder, much like current Warrior Corey Maggette... another career loser.

You're right, but the sad part is we got nothing anybody wants. We had it in ray's expiring. Now we don't even have that. Wyc blew it. Danny has always said he would have broken up the original Big Three. I fully believe he would've done the same here. that stuff about "I like this team" that he and Doc spew is nothing but spin and the party line based on the circumstances which Wyc has created and over which danny and doc have no control. Wyc pays the bills including D and D's salaries. He's the puppet master.

We have $30m in expiring contracts in each of the next two seasons.

I understand we really needed to make a move, but if nothing beneficial was there, why force it?

Can you imagine a year from now, and Chris Pul goes on the block, and we can't make an offer of Rondo/Pierce for Paul/Okafor because we have $40m of our payroll locked into 3 mediocre 35-year old power forwards in KG/Jams/Sheed?

Patience, grasshopper.

We weren't that close to winning it all this season to make a bad trade like that one.

"We have $30m in expiring contracts in each of the next two seasons"  What good is that when we have a very small window to be contenders. We had a 20 million expiring this year and what could that have got us Heinrich and Thomas cmon. Once KG is done the window will be closed for a long time.  

Uh huh. His last 3 years in Golden State he didnt miss a game. He played in all 82 games and averaged 20 ppg and 7 rpg 1999 thru 2002 and thats horrible? I am having a hard time understanding what your talking about.

Oh... you mean the 3 seasons that they won 57 games combined?

The only people Jamison fools are the fantasy sports crowd.

Can't dribble, can't pass, can't defend, can't win.

Guy is a garbageman statpadder, much like current Warrior Corey Maggette... another career loser.

Oh I understand now. Your judging Jamison as a player based on how many games the Warriors won those years. That makes perfect sense.
thank you

[buzz]

You sure about that? Caron is due
2009-2010   $9,780,970
2010-2011  $10,561,960

With career averages of 16 ppg with 6 boards and 3 assists.
"but that contract is NOT WORTH IT"  this is false.

Caron's contract was fine, the problem was that Jamison's was attached to it.

Even if we let Ray walk this summer, we are already right at the lux tax. Meaning that we were going to have to pay dollar-for-dollar on any contracts we took in return. That's why Ainge said we had to get ONE young player plus expirings.

Call Wyc the Puppet Master if you want, but it is totally unreasonable to expect an owner to take a $30m lux tax hit on a team he KNOWS will not contend.

Why in the world would you do that? It's something the Knicks would have done under Isiah.

[FatjohnReturns]

So assuming Ray would resign like Big Z will do for Cleveland. Then adding Jamison and Butler to the current roster we could not contend? Is that what your saying?

[Tai]

Uh huh. His last 3 years in Golden State he didnt miss a game. He played in all 82 games and averaged 20 ppg and 7 rpg 1999 thru 2002 and thats horrible? I am having a hard time understanding what your talking about.

Oh... you mean the 3 seasons that they won 57 games combined?

The only people Jamison fools are the fantasy sports crowd.

Can't dribble, can't pass, can't defend, can't win.

Guy is a garbageman statpadder, much like current Warrior Corey Maggette... another career loser.

Dude, I don't know if Jamison will solve all the Cavs' problems, but I'd easily a deduct a TP from you without hesitation for that post. I don't even care how you feel about Corey Maggette, although I disagree with you.

Jamison's not good because he was on a bad team? Don't insult us.

[buzz]

"We have $30m in expiring contracts in each of the next two seasons"  What good is that when we have a very small window to be contenders. We had a 20 million expiring this year and what could that have got us Heinrich and Thomas cmon. Once KG is done the window will be closed for a long time.  

But KG is done.

Once he came up lame last year in that game vs Memphis and instantly signaled for the sub, our contending window was almost 100% closed with this group. If it wasn't obvious then, it most certainly was by this past trading deadline.

I mean, maaaybe adding Monta and Jackson for Ray gives you a shot this year, but Butler and Jams? Heck no.

[buzz]

Dude, I don't know if Jamison will solve all the Cavs' problems, but I'd easily a deduct a TP from you without hesitation for that post. I don't even care how you feel about Corey Maggette, although I disagree with you.

Jamison's not good because he was on a bad team? Don't insult us.

Full disclosure here. Warriors are my stepclub and I watched most of those games in question.

Jamison is maybe 60% as good as Antoine was.

Don't let the stats fool you.

[FatjohnReturns]

KG is not done. He hasnt given up yet and he takes these loses hard.

[buzz]

So assuming Ray would resign like Big Z will do for Cleveland. Then adding Jamison and Butler to the current roster we could not contend? Is that what your saying?

Well... a buyout for Ray is different than a buyout for Big Z, given that he was still due about $7m guaranteed after the deadline. You would be asking another team to pay $6m out of pocket to buy him out.

But no, I don't think that roster wins us anything. We are really just not that close right now and actually have a losing record in the last 35 games.

Furthermore... we would be saddled with Jamison's contract the next few seasons, would would prevent us from keeping Ray, probably Caron in a year, or our MLEs... while also complicating trades.

No thanks.

[buzz]

Oh I understand now. Your judging Jamison as a player based on how many games the Warriors won those years. That makes perfect sense.
thank you

It's better to cite stats off of 19-win teams as if they are debate enders?

All I know is that I have watched hundreds of the guy's games. I don't need to go look up a box score or his player page to tell you what his game is.

Ask yourself this... have you ever heard a Warriors fan say that they wish they still had Jamison?

Or Troy Murphy, for that matter.

I sure haven't.

[FallGuy]

Nobody we could have gotten for Ray would have made us a contender this year with PP and KG in decline. To win a title you need at least one elite player, probably two (the Pistons being the exception). We no longer have a single elite player.

Take it apart. Put it back together.

Sooner the better.