What is Ray Allen worth next year?

[PLamb]

If we sign Ray Allen next year, big if there, it should be on a two year deal with the 2nd year being partially guaranteed but easily guaranteed fully through attaining certain goals in the first year

The contract as a whole shouldn't be more than $12-14 million for the 2 years

But what I would do is negotiate with him during the off season, let the money flow elsewhere for a while and when teams have used their cap space do a sign and trade with Ray to get some talent

Of course Ray is pretty smart and will probably just go sign elsewhere if he sees Boston dragging their feet though

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

$12-14 million for two years not $12-14 million per year for two years

$6-7 million per year

Maybe $7 million next year and $6 million the following year with only $2 million guaranteed

$2 million more guaranteed if he plays more than 55 games in 2010-11

The last two guaranteed if he can attain two of the following three conditions in 2010-11.....Average more than 15 PPG, shoot better than 45% from the field, shoot better than 36% from three

[Roy Hobbs]

If we sign Ray Allen next year, big if there, it should be on a two year deal with the 2nd year being partially guaranteed but easily guaranteed fully through attaining certain goals in the first year

The contract as a whole shouldn't be more than $12-14 million for the 2 years

But what I would do is negotiate with him during the off season, let the money flow elsewhere for a while and when teams have used their cap space do a sign and trade with Ray to get some talent

Of course Ray is pretty smart and will probably just go sign elsewhere if he sees Boston dragging their feet though

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

$12-14 million for two years not $12-14 million per year for two years

$6-7 million per year

Maybe $7 million next year and $6 million the following year with only $2 million guaranteed

$2 million more guaranteed if he plays more than 55 games in 2010-11

The last two guaranteed if he can attain two of the following three conditions in 2010-11.....Average more than 15 PPG, shoot better than 45% from the field, shoot better than 36% from three

For clarification, in the NBA incentives can not be based upon games played.  The performance incentives, though, would be allowed. I believe -- but am not 100% certain -- that the same rules apply to guarantees of salary.

[PLamb]

If we sign Ray Allen next year, big if there, it should be on a two year deal with the 2nd year being partially guaranteed but easily guaranteed fully through attaining certain goals in the first year

The contract as a whole shouldn't be more than $12-14 million for the 2 years

But what I would do is negotiate with him during the off season, let the money flow elsewhere for a while and when teams have used their cap space do a sign and trade with Ray to get some talent

Of course Ray is pretty smart and will probably just go sign elsewhere if he sees Boston dragging their feet though

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

$12-14 million for two years not $12-14 million per year for two years

$6-7 million per year

Maybe $7 million next year and $6 million the following year with only $2 million guaranteed

$2 million more guaranteed if he plays more than 55 games in 2010-11

The last two guaranteed if he can attain two of the following three conditions in 2010-11.....Average more than 15 PPG, shoot better than 45% from the field, shoot better than 36% from three

For clarification, in the NBA incentives can not be based upon games played.  The performance incentives, though, would be allowed. I believe -- but am not 100% certain -- that the same rules apply to guarantees of salary.

That's fair

But at his age and with the history of SGs games falling off so fast I would definitely want some sort of league allowed incentive package in there guaranteeing the final year

Also, anyone think of giving a three year deal, and I have read some suggestions of such, are just giving money away in that final year

SGs don't last until they are 37 and 38 years old and perform at a high level, they just don't

MJ and Reggie yes

Almost everyone else in the history of basketball, nope

[Who]

If we sign Ray Allen next year, big if there, it should be on a two year deal with the 2nd year being partially guaranteed but easily guaranteed fully through attaining certain goals in the first year

The contract as a whole shouldn't be more than $12-14 million for the 2 years

But what I would do is negotiate with him during the off season, let the money flow elsewhere for a while and when teams have used their cap space do a sign and trade with Ray to get some talent

Of course Ray is pretty smart and will probably just go sign elsewhere if he sees Boston dragging their feet though

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

$12-14 million for two years not $12-14 million per year for two years

$6-7 million per year

Maybe $7 million next year and $6 million the following year with only $2 million guaranteed

$2 million more guaranteed if he plays more than 55 games in 2010-11

The last two guaranteed if he can attain two of the following three conditions in 2010-11.....Average more than 15 PPG, shoot better than 45% from the field, shoot better than 36% from three

For clarification, in the NBA incentives can not be based upon games played.  The performance incentives, though, would be allowed. I believe -- but am not 100% certain -- that the same rules apply to guarantees of salary.

I thought Marcus Camby got paid a bonus for managing to play in a certain number of games. During his stay in Denver.

Edit: Here's a link

http://nba.fanhouse.com/2008/02/12/camby-to-pull-500k-bonus-for-50-games/

[Fafnir]

If we sign Ray Allen next year, big if there, it should be on a two year deal with the 2nd year being partially guaranteed but easily guaranteed fully through attaining certain goals in the first year

The contract as a whole shouldn't be more than $12-14 million for the 2 years

But what I would do is negotiate with him during the off season, let the money flow elsewhere for a while and when teams have used their cap space do a sign and trade with Ray to get some talent

Of course Ray is pretty smart and will probably just go sign elsewhere if he sees Boston dragging their feet though

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

$12-14 million for two years not $12-14 million per year for two years

$6-7 million per year

Maybe $7 million next year and $6 million the following year with only $2 million guaranteed

$2 million more guaranteed if he plays more than 55 games in 2010-11

The last two guaranteed if he can attain two of the following three conditions in 2010-11.....Average more than 15 PPG, shoot better than 45% from the field, shoot better than 36% from three

For clarification, in the NBA incentives can not be based upon games played.  The performance incentives, though, would be allowed. I believe -- but am not 100% certain -- that the same rules apply to guarantees of salary.

I thought Marcus Camby got paid a bonus for managing to play in a certain number of games. During his stay in Denver.

Was his contract before the last CBA?

[Who]

If we sign Ray Allen next year, big if there, it should be on a two year deal with the 2nd year being partially guaranteed but easily guaranteed fully through attaining certain goals in the first year

The contract as a whole shouldn't be more than $12-14 million for the 2 years

But what I would do is negotiate with him during the off season, let the money flow elsewhere for a while and when teams have used their cap space do a sign and trade with Ray to get some talent

Of course Ray is pretty smart and will probably just go sign elsewhere if he sees Boston dragging their feet though

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

$12-14 million for two years not $12-14 million per year for two years

$6-7 million per year

Maybe $7 million next year and $6 million the following year with only $2 million guaranteed

$2 million more guaranteed if he plays more than 55 games in 2010-11

The last two guaranteed if he can attain two of the following three conditions in 2010-11.....Average more than 15 PPG, shoot better than 45% from the field, shoot better than 36% from three

For clarification, in the NBA incentives can not be based upon games played.  The performance incentives, though, would be allowed. I believe -- but am not 100% certain -- that the same rules apply to guarantees of salary.

I thought Marcus Camby got paid a bonus for managing to play in a certain number of games. During his stay in Denver.

Was his contract before the last CBA?

Note: Updated last post to include link of games played bonus

What year was the previous CBA agreed upon?

I believe Camby opted out of his contract after being traded to Denver. The first summer. And then signed a new deal. Either 2003 or 2004.

Edit: Looking at his salary history on basketball reference.com, it may have been 2002.

Edit: It was the summer of 2004 -- found a press release

http://www.nba.com/nuggets/news/press_release_archive.html

http://www.nba.com/nuggets/news/sign_camby_071604.html

[Chris]

I would be shocked if he signs for more than 2 guaranteed years with the C's, regardless of the money.  I think they can come up with a fair figure, if he is willing to take 2 years, whether it is at $5 million per, or $10 million per (most likely some place in between).  But if he wants more than 2 years, he will likely have to look elsewhere.

[the_Bird]

I would be shocked if he signs for more than 2 guaranteed years with the C's, regardless of the money.  I think they can come up with a fair figure, if he is willing to take 2 years, whether it is at $5 million per, or $10 million per (most likely some place in between).  But if he wants more than 2 years, he will likely have to look elsewhere.

Celtics aren't going to offer ANY contracts longer than 2012 to anyone not named "Pierce" or MAYBE "Perkins."  Summer of 2012, a.k.a. The Summer of Durant, is the team's chance to potentially retool. 

Ray will get offered an extension for probably 2yr/$16M.  Seems about right to me.  Could be a little more, could be a little less, above the MLE but far, far below what he's making now.

[P2]

I see Ray taking a pretty serious discount to sign with Boston, particularly if we offer him more than a year. Who is going to pay Ray $8-10mil a year for more than one year? Which team?

You're contradicting yourself.

[Fafnir]

I would be shocked if he signs for more than 2 guaranteed years with the C's, regardless of the money.  I think they can come up with a fair figure, if he is willing to take 2 years, whether it is at $5 million per, or $10 million per (most likely some place in between).  But if he wants more than 2 years, he will likely have to look elsewhere.

Celtics aren't going to offer ANY contracts longer than 2012 to anyone not named "Pierce" or MAYBE "Perkins."  Summer of 2012, a.k.a. The Summer of Durant, is the team's chance to potentially retool. 

Ray will get offered an extension for probably 2yr/$16M.  Seems about right to me.  Could be a little more, could be a little less, above the MLE but far, far below what he's making now.

Durant will not be there in 2012, no MVP caliber player is going to play two extra years to get to FA when his current team is offering a huge extension.

He's not going to pass on an extension earlier than that almost no player does, he'll sign a big deal with the Thunder.

[Chris]

I would be shocked if he signs for more than 2 guaranteed years with the C's, regardless of the money.  I think they can come up with a fair figure, if he is willing to take 2 years, whether it is at $5 million per, or $10 million per (most likely some place in between).  But if he wants more than 2 years, he will likely have to look elsewhere.

Celtics aren't going to offer ANY contracts longer than 2012 to anyone not named "Pierce" or MAYBE "Perkins."  Summer of 2012, a.k.a. The Summer of Durant, is the team's chance to potentially retool. 

Ray will get offered an extension for probably 2yr/$16M.  Seems about right to me.  Could be a little more, could be a little less, above the MLE but far, far below what he's making now.

Agreed.  And I think that is fair from both sides.  It may even be slightly over market-value (depending how he does the rest of the season), but is a nice reward for what he has done in Boston, while not killing their rebuilding efforts.

[ThaPreacher]

i think they can get more out of ray next year than PP...pierce looks completely shot

Paul Pierce, "completely shot"  ROF****, 
Clearly, he is struggling due to some nagging injuries.

Ray Allen: 

There is a great need to resign him.  It is difficult getting pure shooters that can play defense and move without the ball.

The question is how much.
Well, 5 mill a year at 3 years is what we want.  That allows Boston to make other moves.
How much does Ray want to win?


Paul Pierce 5 mil a year for 3 years. (with player option for 4th season)
Ray Allen 5 mil a year for 3 years.

Brian Scalabrine:  100 dollars and a one way ticket to Europe

[Fan from VT]

I would be shocked if he signs for more than 2 guaranteed years with the C's, regardless of the money.  I think they can come up with a fair figure, if he is willing to take 2 years, whether it is at $5 million per, or $10 million per (most likely some place in between).  But if he wants more than 2 years, he will likely have to look elsewhere.

Celtics aren't going to offer ANY contracts longer than 2012 to anyone not named "Pierce" or MAYBE "Perkins."  Summer of 2012, a.k.a. The Summer of Durant, is the team's chance to potentially retool. 

Ray will get offered an extension for probably 2yr/$16M.  Seems about right to me.  Could be a little more, could be a little less, above the MLE but far, far below what he's making now.

Durant will not be there in 2012, no MVP caliber player is going to play two extra years to get to FA when his current team is offering a huge extension.

He's not going to pass on an extension earlier than that almost no player does, he'll sign a big deal with the Thunder.

There is one scenario in which I could see this happening. What if his team doesn't improve that much, and Durant decides he wants to really be on the big stage, AND the new CBA means his max contract won't be that much more than his QO? he could then take his qo and test UFA for not that much of a discount.

Also, you can sign an extension after year 3, but you still have to be on at least 4 years of rookie scale. it's just one year extra of reduced pay to hit ufa.

[Fafnir]

I would be shocked if he signs for more than 2 guaranteed years with the C's, regardless of the money.  I think they can come up with a fair figure, if he is willing to take 2 years, whether it is at $5 million per, or $10 million per (most likely some place in between).  But if he wants more than 2 years, he will likely have to look elsewhere.

Celtics aren't going to offer ANY contracts longer than 2012 to anyone not named "Pierce" or MAYBE "Perkins."  Summer of 2012, a.k.a. The Summer of Durant, is the team's chance to potentially retool. 

Ray will get offered an extension for probably 2yr/$16M.  Seems about right to me.  Could be a little more, could be a little less, above the MLE but far, far below what he's making now.

Durant will not be there in 2012, no MVP caliber player is going to play two extra years to get to FA when his current team is offering a huge extension.

He's not going to pass on an extension earlier than that almost no player does, he'll sign a big deal with the Thunder.

There is one scenario in which I could see this happening. What if his team doesn't improve that much, and Durant decides he wants to really be on the big stage, AND the new CBA means his max contract won't be that much more than his QO? he could then take his qo and test UFA for not that much of a discount.

Also, you can sign an extension after year 3, but you still have to be on at least 4 years of rookie scale. it's just one year extra of reduced pay to hit ufa.

One year of reduced pay, and two years of huge risk if he has a catestrophic knee injury. (Shaun Livingston-esqe)

[LooseCannon]

I don't get the reasoning of some people.  Given the cap situation, your choice of a roster spot is Ray Allen signed at something above the MLE for 2-3 years or a vet minimum player.  Using the MLE is independent of that choice.

I do think Ray Allen wants financial security and stability for what he expects to be his last major contract.  If he hits the free agent market, he runs the risk of being forced to sign for the MLE or worse when he could be, at worse, the third-best player on a lot of teams out there.

Hypothetically, let's say his value is $10 million/year for the next two years.  I think Ray Allen would be willing to sign for less (but not an outright insulting offer) to stay in Boston and have a deal done early so that he doesn't have to founder on the market waiting for all the big name players to sign before teams turn to him as Plan C or D.