Take back Posey???

[BballTim]

So, how many combinations at PG + SG/SF are significantly superior to a Darren Collison + James Posey combination? And how likely are the Celtics to acquire one of those combinations via free agency?

And is it worth the risk of turning down a Collison + Posey deal if it were ever put on the table?

  Does Collison really do that much for us? Isn't he just going to back up Rondo?

[Who]

So, how many combinations at PG + SG/SF are significantly superior to a Darren Collison + James Posey combination? And how likely are the Celtics to acquire one of those combinations via free agency?

And is it worth the risk of turning down a Collison + Posey deal if it were ever put on the table?

  Does Collison really do that much for us? Isn't he just going to back up Rondo?

I like Collison's game. Good defender, solid rebounder, does a good job running his team's offense. Very good athlete. He has struggled with his shot so far in the NBA but he was a very good shooter in college. Lot of potential to improve. I see him as one of those borderline starters/backup guards like a Chris Duhon, Jarrett Jack or Steve Blake down the road. I think a comparable talent would cost around $4-5 million.

While I don't think a backup point guard is much of a priority this season, I do think it is one for next season. I do not think it's a good option to bring back House for another season. Collison can fill that need, that backup point guard role.

[Who]

So, how many combinations at PG + SG/SF are significantly superior to a Darren Collison + James Posey combination? And how likely are the Celtics to acquire one of those combinations via free agency?

And is it worth the risk of turning down a Collison + Posey deal if it were ever put on the table?

  Does Collison really do that much for us? Isn't he just going to back up Rondo?

Do you think the Celtics will spend their MLE next season?

I expect them to spend it again. After re-signing Ray Allen. Either on a wing player to replace Marquis Daniels or on a guard, or splitting it and trying to do both.

Financially, there isn't much of a difference between spending the MLE & change to fill the backup PG and wing spots and bringing back Posey + Collison in a trade. I think the value of having Collison's rookie contract reduces the burden of Posey's contract.

[BballTim]

So, how many combinations at PG + SG/SF are significantly superior to a Darren Collison + James Posey combination? And how likely are the Celtics to acquire one of those combinations via free agency?

And is it worth the risk of turning down a Collison + Posey deal if it were ever put on the table?

  Does Collison really do that much for us? Isn't he just going to back up Rondo?

Do you think the Celtics will spend their MLE next season?

I expect them to spend it again. After re-signing Ray Allen. Either on a wing player to replace Marquis Daniels or on a guard, or splitting it and trying to do both.

Financially, there isn't much of a difference between spending the MLE & change to fill the backup PG and wing spots and bringing back Posey + Collison in a trade. I think the value of having Collison's rookie contract reduces the burden of Posey's contract.

  With KG/Paul/Ray/Sheed I don't think we really need an aging unathletic backup wing. I'd rather see us get someone athletic at that spot. Plus Posey won't be as good then as he is now and he's not as good now (IMO) as he was in 08-09. If we had Posey and Collison they'll run us about $8M we'd still need another backup sg/sf IMO.

[wiley]

I don't know if it's smart, but I'd be very happy and feel more confident if Posey and Collison hopped on board.

Posey would not represent minor insurance, but major insurance, should KG or Sheed not be quite right healthwise.

Rememember, during our championship run, we finished games with Posey playing the 4 and Garnett at the 5 more often than we finished with Perk and Garnett....Perk's better now than then, but when you need offense or floor spacing, etc....Posey  could step back into that role.

If you ask me, Rondo, Ray, Pierce, Daniels, Posey, Baby, Sheed, Perk could win a championship. 

I also think we could win a championship without Paul or Ray, if KG and the rest of our bigs are healthy....

Posey would be key in the case of injury to Ray, Paul, Sheed or KG.....not to mention Daniels or Baby....

[Celtics17]

I agree with you on Posey's value. I hate to say it but I disagree that we can win a title with any of our starting 5 out. If they are not healthy or hurt but effective then it's possible but still not likely. We will have to go through Atlanta or Orlando and/or Cleveland then probably L.A. to win and I dont think we can do it with any of our starting 5 out for more then 2 games. I hope you are right though and I am not.

[Who]

There is a fair number of interesting for the Celtics with their MLE this summer
 

• Mike Miller is the player that stands out for me in that MLE bracket. I don't think any of the guards are worth the full, or nearly the full MLE. Not that interested in the rest of the MLE wing crops either.
• Splitting the MLE has a couple of interesting options. Roger Mason Jr at guard. Luke Ridnour would be nice too if he slipped through the cracks and was available for that type of money. A couple of nice wings in Raja Bell + Rasual Butler + Kyle Korver. Maybe a return of Marquis Daniels if he can't get a big money deal.
• Anthony Carter looks the best minimum contract type of guard. So between him and House for that spot if the Celtics spend their MLE on a wing. Very little interest in the rest of the options.
• Keith Bogans, Bobby Simmons and Ime Udoka stand out amongst the wings. Also interested in Carney in a secondary role off the bench on the wing.

I'm still undecided between Posey + Collison versus spending the MLE.

[Who]

So, how many combinations at PG + SG/SF are significantly superior to a Darren Collison + James Posey combination? And how likely are the Celtics to acquire one of those combinations via free agency?

And is it worth the risk of turning down a Collison + Posey deal if it were ever put on the table?

  Does Collison really do that much for us? Isn't he just going to back up Rondo?

Do you think the Celtics will spend their MLE next season?

I expect them to spend it again. After re-signing Ray Allen. Either on a wing player to replace Marquis Daniels or on a guard, or splitting it and trying to do both.

Financially, there isn't much of a difference between spending the MLE & change to fill the backup PG and wing spots and bringing back Posey + Collison in a trade. I think the value of having Collison's rookie contract reduces the burden of Posey's contract.

  With KG/Paul/Ray/Sheed I don't think we really need an aging unathletic backup wing. I'd rather see us get someone athletic at that spot. Plus Posey won't be as good then as he is now and he's not as good now (IMO) as he was in 08-09. If we had Posey and Collison they'll run us about $8M we'd still need another backup sg/sf IMO.

I'd rather have someone athletic at that backup wing spot too.

Not a lot of guys of interest for the full MLE (Travis Outlaw?) but there's a few interesting guys in that second bracket ... Rasual Butler + Raja Bell + Marquis Daniels.

I'd be very interested in Azubuike or Mo Evans if they opted out of their contracts. Doubt Mo Evans will though. Hard to say about Azubuike.

Posey + Collison

I think I'd be okay with a minimum contract wing option to be a second wing off the bench alongside Posey. Someone like Rodney Carney, or a Keith Bogans or Ime Udoka. Someone with more quickness + defensive ability.

Collison + Carney/Bogans/Udoka + Posey + BBD + Sheed

I think a Collison + Posey trade is a good option. Still not convinced it's the best option, versus the MLE next summer, but I do like it.

[BASS_THUMPER]

no to posey..

i  still belive in loyalty..run wit the team that got u that ring

besides his game has fallen off..

[BASS_THUMPER]

757..aint that a plane...?

[More Banners]

Some thoughts on our current roster, this proposed deal, and the MLE:

Ray Allen won't get more than the MLE anywhere else, so there is not much need for us to pay much more than that.  He won't get a long deal at his age, and probably doesn't want to move again.  I've posted elsewhere that he would be a nice scorer off the bench at some point, possibly soon.  I predict he stays for around the MLE in $$$, plus man hugs from Posey, which I suspect he likes more than he'd ever let on.

I would be very happy if this year, if not this minute, were the end of the Eddie House experiment.  He's too one-dimensional.  Let's not worry about resigning House.  He's a minimum guy for whomever wants him.

Tony Allen:  Goodbye, the sooner, the better.  He might actually play well in NO, though.  They might need a guy like him.  Fare well, TA, fare well.

I'd keep Scal for the minimum next year in the ML Carr/Cheerleader role in which he excels, assuming he isn't gone in a trade for Pose or someone else.  Plus, his hustle is worth it.

Marquis Daniels:  I don't think, in this economy and with his perpetual injury situation, will command the full MLE anywhere.  I think we can keep him without using much, if any, of the MLE for him this summer, presuming he wants to stay.

So I don't think we need to worry about resigning our guys.  We've pretty much locked up the ones we want to keep, except Ray, and I'd be willing to gamble that Daniels doesn't wander too far, or for too much money.  I think, if we had another wing, we could relax until he decides to take the 2.4 million, with a trade kicker or whatever to soothe his ego.

I think, if any of the above are true, we can save the MLE for someone who expects big $$$, then falls this summer.  I'm hopeful for Rudy Gay, personally, but dont' expect that.  If it did happen, then I think we just get him, probably don't resign Daniels, and let the chips fall.


I agree with whomever wrote that a Posey/Collison deal was okay, but perhaps not the best.  I wouldn't mind it, but would probably rather take Gomes back over Posey at this point.  I think we often overvalue our players, though, when one minute we'd trade them away, and the next worry about resigningthem.

[More Banners]

There is a fair number of interesting for the Celtics with their MLE this summer
 

• Mike Miller is the player that stands out for me in that MLE bracket. I don't think any of the guards are worth the full, or nearly the full MLE. Not that interested in the rest of the MLE wing crops either.
• Splitting the MLE has a couple of interesting options. Roger Mason Jr at guard. Luke Ridnour would be nice too if he slipped through the cracks and was available for that type of money. A couple of nice wings in Raja Bell + Rasual Butler + Kyle Korver. Maybe a return of Marquis Daniels if he can't get a big money deal.
• Anthony Carter looks the best minimum contract type of guard. So between him and House for that spot if the Celtics spend their MLE on a wing. Very little interest in the rest of the options.
• Keith Bogans, Bobby Simmons and Ime Udoka stand out amongst the wings. Also interested in Carney in a secondary role off the bench on the wing.

I'm still undecided between Posey + Collison versus spending the MLE.

I'm not too wild about any of those options.  I like Mike Miller, but he's injured, and hasn't had a strong year in a while, but has played well for the Wiz when he played...  But no MLE for him.  Same for Raja Bell, who is probably a minimum guy if he comes back from injury next year, having missed too much this year.  Korver is a HUGE defensive liability.  Bogans probably stays in San Antonio.  Good players tend to do that.

[snively]

So, how many combinations at PG + SG/SF are significantly superior to a Darren Collison + James Posey combination? And how likely are the Celtics to acquire one of those combinations via free agency?

And is it worth the risk of turning down a Collison + Posey deal if it were ever put on the table?

  Does Collison really do that much for us? Isn't he just going to back up Rondo?

Do you think the Celtics will spend their MLE next season?

I expect them to spend it again. After re-signing Ray Allen. Either on a wing player to replace Marquis Daniels or on a guard, or splitting it and trying to do both.

Financially, there isn't much of a difference between spending the MLE & change to fill the backup PG and wing spots and bringing back Posey + Collison in a trade. I think the value of having Collison's rookie contract reduces the burden of Posey's contract.

  With KG/Paul/Ray/Sheed I don't think we really need an aging unathletic backup wing. I'd rather see us get someone athletic at that spot. Plus Posey won't be as good then as he is now and he's not as good now (IMO) as he was in 08-09. If we had Posey and Collison they'll run us about $8M we'd still need another backup sg/sf IMO.

I'd rather have someone athletic at that backup wing spot too.

Not a lot of guys of interest for the full MLE (Travis Outlaw?) but there's a few interesting guys in that second bracket ... Rasual Butler + Raja Bell + Marquis Daniels.

I'd be very interested in Azubuike or Mo Evans if they opted out of their contracts. Doubt Mo Evans will though. Hard to say about Azubuike.

Posey + Collison

I think I'd be okay with a minimum contract wing option to be a second wing off the bench alongside Posey. Someone like Rodney Carney, or a Keith Bogans or Ime Udoka. Someone with more quickness + defensive ability.

Collison + Carney/Bogans/Udoka + Posey + BBD + Sheed

I think a Collison + Posey trade is a good option. Still not convinced it's the best option, versus the MLE next summer, but I do like it.

Posey + Collison is certainly more conventional than the House + Daniels combo we'd probably run in the playoffs but is it really better?  

I'm not sure Doc will trust a rookie PG with a shaky jumper and a high turnover rate in the playoffs though.  And I don't really want to watch Sheed and Pose decompose behind the 3-pt line for the next couple years.  I just don't think there's much benefit to this trade.

If we're going to add an unpleasant contract I'd shoot for Kirk Hinrich.  Hinrich, Daniels and Sheed, with spot minutes for House or Baby, is a fine playoff bench.  Great versatility on both ends of the floor and easy to mix and match with the starters.

[snively]

There is a fair number of interesting for the Celtics with their MLE this summer
 

• Mike Miller is the player that stands out for me in that MLE bracket. I don't think any of the guards are worth the full, or nearly the full MLE. Not that interested in the rest of the MLE wing crops either.
• Splitting the MLE has a couple of interesting options. Roger Mason Jr at guard. Luke Ridnour would be nice too if he slipped through the cracks and was available for that type of money. A couple of nice wings in Raja Bell + Rasual Butler + Kyle Korver. Maybe a return of Marquis Daniels if he can't get a big money deal.
• Anthony Carter looks the best minimum contract type of guard. So between him and House for that spot if the Celtics spend their MLE on a wing. Very little interest in the rest of the options.
• Keith Bogans, Bobby Simmons and Ime Udoka stand out amongst the wings. Also interested in Carney in a secondary role off the bench on the wing.

I'm still undecided between Posey + Collison versus spending the MLE.

I'm not too wild about any of those options.  I like Mike Miller, but he's injured, and hasn't had a strong year in a while, but has played well for the Wiz when he played...  But no MLE for him.  Same for Raja Bell, who is probably a minimum guy if he comes back from injury next year, having missed too much this year.  Korver is a HUGE defensive liability.  Bogans probably stays in San Antonio.  Good players tend to do that.

I disagree.  Miller's a 6'8 wing who can handle, pass, rebound, score and hit 3s like Ray Allen or Wally Z. He's been ridiculously efficient that last few years as well, even on crap teams.  He's definitely worth the MLE.

Raja Bell is getting old, but great 3pt shooting and strong defense at the 2 guard is worth more than the minimum in this league.  His resume is extensive enough that team's will cut him slack for one year lost to injury.

I agree that Korver's crap defensively.

And Bogans isn't the stickiest player.  He's a journeyman and the Spurs have passed along their fair share of those.

[wiley]

I'd love to get Raja Bell for next season.....and Mike Miller (based mainly on the love from others...does he defend well?)

But I'm thinking about this year.  Getting Heinrich would be swell, but I don't think we'll be getting him....

So who is going to help us against Atlanta?  Who is going to help us against Rashard Lewis?  Who's going to help us against Cleveland and L.A.?  Only if both Sheed and KG are in tip top form physically can we win as currently structured....(possibly withouth Sheed but a real longshot)

I'd be more hesitant to say the above (and generally more hopeful) if we had Posey.

Forget the contract....He's tradeable in a package deal going forward.....Let's think about this year and this year only.