Arenas suspended indefinitely

[guava_wrench]

The problem Nick is that similar offenses for gun possession have not resulted in year long bans.

Similar offenses. There haven't been any. He's the only one ever to bring them into a "venue".

Having them on the team bus, plane, or facility has happened though correct? Those have only been single digit games.

Yeah, Telfair was traveling on league-related business, which is delineated in that clause.

Also, the clause cited says nothing about voiding a contract.  Rather, it subjects a player to discipline by the NBA (i.e., not the team), which is separate and apart from voiding a contract.

I do not believe the rule in question was in effect during the Telfair airport incidence, so why are people mentioning that?

My expectation would be for the contract to be voided only if the criminal case against Arenas brings a guilty verdict.

People need to stop comparing apples and oranges. The laws vary across the country. Likewise, NBA rules change over time.

[Eja117]

I just can't see that happening. He didn't eject Spree or Artest.

I think the union would fight that pretty hard and I don't think it would hold up in arbitration.

It would be the single biggest punishment in sports history in a situation where nobody was hurt.

[Fafnir]

The problem Nick is that similar offenses for gun possession have not resulted in year long bans.

Similar offenses. There haven't been any. He's the only one ever to bring them into a "venue".

Having them on the team bus, plane, or facility has happened though correct? Those have only been single digit games.

Yeah, Telfair was traveling on league-related business, which is delineated in that clause.

Also, the clause cited says nothing about voiding a contract.  Rather, it subjects a player to discipline by the NBA (i.e., not the team), which is separate and apart from voiding a contract.

I do not believe the rule in question was in effect during the Telfair airport incidence, so why are people mentioning that?

My expectation would be for the contract to be voided only if the criminal case against Arenas brings a guilty verdict.

People need to stop comparing apples and oranges. The laws vary across the country. Likewise, NBA rules change over time.

The rule was put in during the 2005 bargaining session from what I've heard reported.

[Roy Hobbs]

The problem Nick is that similar offenses for gun possession have not resulted in year long bans.

Similar offenses. There haven't been any. He's the only one ever to bring them into a "venue".

Having them on the team bus, plane, or facility has happened though correct? Those have only been single digit games.

Yeah, Telfair was traveling on league-related business, which is delineated in that clause.

Also, the clause cited says nothing about voiding a contract.  Rather, it subjects a player to discipline by the NBA (i.e., not the team), which is separate and apart from voiding a contract.

I do not believe the rule in question was in effect during the Telfair airport incidence, so why are people mentioning that?

My expectation would be for the contract to be voided only if the criminal case against Arenas brings a guilty verdict.

People need to stop comparing apples and oranges. The laws vary across the country. Likewise, NBA rules change over time.

The rule was put in during the 2005 bargaining session from what I've heard reported.

Yeah, it was 2005 at the latest.  Wasn't the Telfair situation in 2006?  Therefore, the rule would have been in effect.

[The Walker Wiggle]

Don't know if it's been mentioned already, but Henry Abbott of Truehoop recently ran some salient excerpts from Terry Pluto's terrific oral history of the ABA, Loose Balls:

Pacers trainer Dave Craig: "The more those teams won, the wilder some of the guys got. In the early 1970s, [Mel] Daniels, [Roger] Brown, [George] McGinnis and some of the other guys started to think they were cowboys. Mel was from Detroit, but when he went to college in New Mexico, he got interested in horses. ... Then they started dressing like cowboys, and I'm not just talking about hats and boots. They wore pistols and holsters like something out of 'Gunsmoke.'"

Pacer Billy Keller: "We had a valuables bag where we stored our rings, watches, wallets and that kind of stuff. When those guys got on the cowboys kick, Dave Craig would open that valuables bag and you'd see a couple of holsters and 6-shooters right in there with all the wallets and watches. A couple of times, I walked into the dressing room and there were Mel and Roger, pulling pistols on each other like it was the O.K. Corral. They never shot at each other, but they waved the guns around, sometimes even wrestled with each other on the floor."

Craig: "These guys were playing 'Cowboys' as if they were kids. They would hide behind corners, or climb on top of the locker, draw their guns and do the 'Bang, bang, you're dead' routine. Finally, I told [Pacers head coach] Slick [Leonard], 'We've got to get these guns out of the dressing room before somebody gets hurt.' Slick thought the whole thing was pretty funny and said, 'Nah, those guys are using guns that aren't loaded.' But one day, the guys were messing around and one of the guns went off. Thank God no one was hurt, but then we had to pass a rule that if you brought your gun to the game, you had to check it at the dressing room door."

Pacers legal counsel Dick Tinkham: "As owners of the team, we wondered if the guys were getting out of hand with all the cowboy stuff, but then we said, 'Hey, we're winning. The fans loved them. We don't care what they do as long as they play hard and don't shoot each other.'"

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

[OriginalODb]

Possible New wrinkle to the story that casts Arenas ina ever so slightly better light.

http://deadspin.com/5442282/crittenton-cocked-and-loaded-arenas-taking-the-fall (link to the original article goes to the washington post so it has a legitimate news organization behind it)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/01/06/AR2010010605167.html

    Asking Arenas what he was doing, Arenas replied, "If you want to shoot me, I'd just thought I'd make it easy for you." As other teammates laughed, Crittenton crumpled up the paper, tossed one of Arenas's guns across the room, where it bounced in front of a team trainer, and said he didn't need any of Arenas's firearms because he had his own, according to the witness accounts.

    Crittenton then drew his weapon, loaded it and chambered a round, the witnesses said.

    Neither witness said the gun was ever pointed at Arenas, but both said Crittenton began singing as he held the gun.

Two of the five people in the room that morning, who spoke on condition of anonymity, said Arenas had originally not disclosed Crittenton's action to protect the little-used guard from prosecution and had told Crittenton he would assume full responsibility for the actions of both players that day.

If true, a very small part of me admires Arenas for taking the fall for his teammate. But mostly, man jail and 110 million are on the line; start snitchin

[Bahku]

Nice to see that poker games haven't progressed much from the Old West. Arenas is a child and a thug, and I honestly hope these guys get more than a suspension.

Thug? Arenas? A child, definitely. Never seemed at all a thug to me. Maybe I have a different concept of the word.

It might be a lot harder for Javaris collect now that Gilbert might have problems paying bills. I imagine Gilbert's endorsements will jump ship. I suppose he could play abroad if the suspension is particularly long.

Let's not forget that what he did was stupid and a violation of the collective bargaining agreement, but it was still an unloaded gun. He know no one was actually at risk of any harm. I think people talking about a lifetime ban are really getting carried away. Even Vick got to return to his livelihood, and what he did was clearly unethical and harmful.

Let's keep some perspective. Gilbert broke laws & NBA rules, but he harmed no one! I agree with a suspension of a full season, but let's not get carried away due to the sensational coverage. This doesn't even compare to what Stephen Jackson did (though the penalty will be larger due to the rules in place since then and the laws in DC).

Carried away?!? I'm not remotely getting carried away ... this is not the only dark mark in Gilbert's history, and I don't use the word "thug" lightly. Your opinion is different and your entitled to it, as I am mine. I was also not one of those calling for a lifetime ban, so please don't lump me into that group, as I think that's a bit too harsh in this instance. I think Tony Allen is a thug, too, but I also feel, (and hope), that these guys are capable of turning their lives around. As far as Vick and the comparison, there is no WAY he should have been allowed to play in the NFL again ... EVER. But again, just my opinion.

[greg683x]

one year as in the rest of this year or one year as in hes suspended til january next year?  thats a HUGE suspension considering the investigation isnt over.  i still havent seen this anywhere though.

[Schupac]

I think people are overreacting to a stupid, not malicious, act.  And I think people are too quick to condemn athletes as gangsters and thugs just because of their profession.  If a vice president were to own guns and say accidentally shoot someone in the face while hunting, would people say it was a stupid accident or he is just a gangster?

Now what if an NBA player made a stupid decision using guns as props for a joke?  Yeah, I know you can say one had a 'legitimate' reason (hunting) and one didn't (joking).  I would counter that by asking what makes shooting birds for entertainment more legitimate than a joke?

The real question here is what is going on in Arenas' head?  Was he even thinkingabout my fantasy team?  There goes a solid sleeper pick...

[Schupac]

This still hasn't been on espn or anything like that, might be premature.

[Fafnir]

one year as in the rest of this year or one year as in hes suspended til january next year?  thats a HUGE suspension considering the investigation isnt over.  i still havent seen this anywhere though.

This report was/is speculation.

Stern is leaving the suspension indefinite to leave his future options open.

[FatjohnReturns]

Stern is gonna lay the hammer down. You can't have players glorifing gun play. I bet when its all said and done Arenas gets a longer suspension than Artest for the Detroit brawl.

[Roy Hobbs]

Until we get further confirmation on the length of suspension, I'm merging this one into the "indefinitely" thread.  Tanguay isn't always reliable, and he may have misspoke.

[Roy Hobbs]

I think people are overreacting to a stupid, not malicious, act.  And I think people are too quick to condemn athletes as gangsters and thugs just because of their profession.  If a vice president were to own guns and say accidentally shoot someone in the face while hunting, would people say it was a stupid accident or he is just a gangster?

Now what if an NBA player made a stupid decision using guns as props for a joke?  Yeah, I know you can say one had a 'legitimate' reason (hunting) and one didn't (joking).  I would counter that by asking what makes shooting birds for entertainment more legitimate than a joke?

The real question here is what is going on in Arenas' head?  Was he even thinkingabout my fantasy team?  There goes a solid sleeper pick...

There's a difference between a hunting accident and threatening (even if in jest) to shoot another person over a gambling debt, isn't there?

[nickagneta]

I think people are overreacting to a stupid, not malicious, act.  And I think people are too quick to condemn athletes as gangsters and thugs just because of their profession.  If a vice president were to own guns and say accidentally shoot someone in the face while hunting, would people say it was a stupid accident or he is just a gangster?

Now what if an NBA player made a stupid decision using guns as props for a joke?  Yeah, I know you can say one had a 'legitimate' reason (hunting) and one didn't (joking).  I would counter that by asking what makes shooting birds for entertainment more legitimate than a joke?

The real question here is what is going on in Arenas' head?  Was he even thinkingabout my fantasy team?  There goes a solid sleeper pick...

There's a difference between a hunting accident and threatening (even if in jest) to shoot another person over a gambling debt, isn't there?

I agree. I also think there's a huge difference between the use of hunting weapons for hunting in rural areas and hand guns being used the way they are in urban areas.

Also, I think it ridiculous to ever play or joke with weapons. I don't care if they were not loaded. Do you know how many accidents happen a year with hand guns because people take out the clip and forget the bullet in the chamber? It's significant.