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Author Topic: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ  (Read 8573 times)

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Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« on: December 02, 2009, 04:38:43 PM »

Offline TitleMaster

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http://www.newsok.com/article/3421468

Once again, Wade, Anthony and other *usual suspect* franchise players are chosen over Pierce.

I think it's time to call an ace an ace and a spade a spade... Paul Pierce is actively being ignored by the press and the mainstream public. He'd won the '08 Finals MVP and has clearly indicated top tier prowess, over the past few seasons, with enough film footage to convince the skeptics.

What's happening is that the world is focused on KG's knee and has forgotten who's got the money ball for the C's. All and all, Pierce is the Celt's MVP and therefore, has some b-ball intelligence, much like the others who're chosen over him.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #1 on: December 02, 2009, 04:55:50 PM »

Offline PosImpos

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Well, when asked those kinds of questions people naturally pick the best known players in the game.  Most of those players are also the point guards or key playmakers for their teams.  It makes sense that Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Deron Williams and Chris Paul would all be top in the voting.

Kobe, LeBron, and Melo all get votes because they are superstars and because they are good at drawing fouls - which is to say they are smart enough to know that the refs will almost always give them the calls they want.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #2 on: December 02, 2009, 05:18:09 PM »

Offline TitleMaster

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But is it too much to expect of the media to include him in the same sentence as LBJ, Kobe, CP, Wade, Kidd, and Anthony? After all, he did devastate a lot of Kobe's shake and bake moves during the finals.

Instead of that, all we hear is... "KG's hurt; let's hope that Pierce can hold down the fort?"
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #3 on: December 02, 2009, 06:07:12 PM »

Offline Cman

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It's hard to argue with PGs as having the highest IQs.  I buy that.

But Carmelo Anthony, LeBron James and Dwayne Wade?  Clearly all three are gifted with physical ability, but I'm not so sure about their intelligence, per se.

Shouldn't the survey include players who "play well off the ball"?  The usual suspects in this list would include players like Shane Battier...  ie: players who aren't gifted with natural b-ball skills, but make do with smarts and hustle.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #4 on: December 02, 2009, 06:07:45 PM »

Offline jambr380

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Quote from: PosImpos on December 02, 2009, 04:55:50 PM
Well, when asked those kinds of questions people naturally pick the best known players in the game.  Most of those players are also the point guards or key playmakers for their teams.  It makes sense that Steve Nash, Jason Kidd, Deron Williams and Chris Paul would all be top in the voting.

Kobe, LeBron, and Melo all get votes because they are superstars and because they are good at drawing fouls - which is to say they are smart enough to know that the refs will almost always give them the calls they want.

While I agree with most of what you say, I would add that I think Pierce is fantastic at drawing fouls. Pierce's game is based on athleticism and strength and slows the game down to his speed. I understand why the list is pg heavy and that it included other superstars that get more notoriety, but Pierce probably deserved to be on the list as well...
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #5 on: December 02, 2009, 06:24:04 PM »

Offline Tai

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It's clear this list is star-studded. Whether that's the writers trying to tell us something or not, I haven't decided.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2009, 07:12:00 PM »

Offline Atzar

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Paul Pierce has always been a second-tier star in the eyes of the media.  This isn't anything new.  His game is based on effectiveness - his jumpshot isn't sugary like Ray's, he's not as fast as Wade, he's not as athletic as Dwight or LeBron.  There's nothing sexy about his game - it just works.  We can probably all agree about that. 

It isn't even really anything I have a problem with - if they want to sleep on Paul, it makes it all the sweeter when he beats one of the media darlings and forces the writers to acknowledge him.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2009, 07:25:55 PM »

Offline guava_wrench

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I do not consider Pierce a top tier bball IQ, nor do I consider Carmelo at this point.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2009, 07:26:56 PM »

Offline Truck Lewis

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Quote from: Atzar on December 02, 2009, 07:12:00 PM
Paul Pierce has always been a second-tier star in the eyes of the media.  This isn't anything new.  His game is based on effectiveness - his jumpshot isn't sugary like Ray's, he's not as fast as Wade, he's not as athletic as Dwight or LeBron.  There's nothing sexy about his game - it just works.  We can probably all agree about that. 



i agree with all of this, but i also think a major reason Pierce is ignored is his lack of charisma or media savy, whichever you choose to call it, especially pre-KG and Ray Ray.  We love him for all the right reasons (great play, hustle and attitude), but players get overhyped and overexposed when they either make the national media fall for them or simply ooze charisma.  Pierce justs plays and plays great, which i love.  Pierce has never been a media darling and therefore gets overlooked for these kind of lists.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2009, 08:35:07 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Quote from: Truck Lewis on December 02, 2009, 07:26:56 PM
Quote from: Atzar on December 02, 2009, 07:12:00 PM
Paul Pierce has always been a second-tier star in the eyes of the media.  This isn't anything new.  His game is based on effectiveness - his jumpshot isn't sugary like Ray's, he's not as fast as Wade, he's not as athletic as Dwight or LeBron.  There's nothing sexy about his game - it just works.  We can probably all agree about that. 



i agree with all of this, but i also think a major reason Pierce is ignored is his lack of charisma or media savy, whichever you choose to call it, especially pre-KG and Ray Ray.  We love him for all the right reasons (great play, hustle and attitude), but players get overhyped and overexposed when they either make the national media fall for them or simply ooze charisma.  Pierce justs plays and plays great, which i love.  Pierce has never been a media darling and therefore gets overlooked for these kind of lists.

what charisma does Kobe have? The guy looks like a smug jerk. What charisma does carmelo have? Pierce is as charismatic as most of those guys, it's just that Stern's media crew decided not to hype him and give him the special set of rules. Sheed speaks the truth, if he was the golden child or a borders without boundaries guy, he would also be promoted much, much more.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2009, 08:43:44 PM »

Offline USG

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Well of course. Pierce's smart plays (getting his man in the air and drawing the foul) have been targeted by Stern and co. You can't look smart when the big guys are getting p---y and telling refs not to call your perfectly valid fouls.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #11 on: December 02, 2009, 08:45:52 PM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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I must disagree with that article (not the discussion here), because it takes a lot for Pierce to be a Captain and lead this team.

Watching him play with his fellow starters over the last few years, I've watched him incorporate his skills and intelligence to get them all involved, and even taking over games when needed (Ex: last few games of high scoring output that took pressure off of KG while he gets his legs back).

And now notice that he hasn't scored a lot at all the last two games..KG took over in Miami, and Ray and Perk went off in CHA. Pierce just took a backseat. That takes some considerable IQ, IMO...to let your teammates be their best when you sense that they are ready or feeling it.

He seems to always know what the team needs (or doesn't need)  at a particular point in the season or game. To me that takes some considerable IQ.

And as far as his comments, just watching Pierce over the years during post or pre-game interviews, he just says and comments on what he sees in the game and that's it. I'd do the same thing if I was in his shoes. I wouldn't like the media attention myself.

Dwayne Carmelo and Lebron are what the NBA is calling "The Future". These three talented players have earned the HUGE world-wide media attention focused on them by bringing home the Gold Medal, which is truly admirable.

but all that matters to me is that in June we'll have Banner 18. Possibly Banner 19 in June 2011?

I really believe that Pierce feels this way, too. Even when it was just him and Antoine, Pierce had no problems with sharing the ball (and spotlight) with Walker.

Pierce helps lead Boston to Banner 18 (and 19?), and that will give him more rings than Lebron, Carmelo, and Wade combined.

And 10 years from now when the Pierce has moved on, NBATV will be playing those Reruns of the Celtics Championships, all 18 (or 19) of them.

The individual spotlight and IQ stuff is good for the sports media now, but it won't hold up over the course of time without Championships.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2009, 08:54:31 PM »

Offline Bahku

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Pierce has been snubbed for the majority of his career, and only when he received the MVP of the Finals 2 years ago did he begin to get some of the credit he deserves. He is a player approaching the level of Kobe and LeBron, but I would personally take Paul over them any day, because he is a far more complete player than they will ever be.

What he does he does quietly, and he makes all those around him better players as well. He's one of the very few people who can consistently shut down Kobe with his defense, and he leads not only on the court but off, with his character and amazing work-ethic. He truly loves the game of baksetball more than most, and it shows in all he does.

Paul is my favorite player since Larry Bird, and it will take some doing to ever replace him. I honestly don't think Paul is very worried about all this snubbing, as he's used to it, but I hope this team wins some more championships while he's active, and that he gains more of the recognition he has long deserved.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2009, 09:01:29 PM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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Maybe if his team would have brought home the Gold in 2004, that World-Wide adulation would have helped Pierce as well.

Don't get me wrong, though..I don't believe it was Pierce's fault for that Olympic team, though. But because he was on it maybe he was affected media-wise by it.

Also look at Tim Duncan..4 Championship rings, but he doesn't get a lot of media attention, too.

Duncan and Pierce are part of the Old Heads in the NBA as far as their careers go...both in early thirties, approaching the twilight of their careers.

But Pierce still has some unfinished business as far as Banners go. Still work to do, Captain.
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Re: Pierce is also snubbed for top tier b-ball IQ
« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2009, 09:29:36 PM »

Offline Truck Lewis

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Quote from: hpantazo on December 02, 2009, 08:35:07 PM
Quote from: Truck Lewis on December 02, 2009, 07:26:56 PM
Quote from: Atzar on December 02, 2009, 07:12:00 PM
Paul Pierce has always been a second-tier star in the eyes of the media.  This isn't anything new.  His game is based on effectiveness - his jumpshot isn't sugary like Ray's, he's not as fast as Wade, he's not as athletic as Dwight or LeBron.  There's nothing sexy about his game - it just works.  We can probably all agree about that. 



i agree with all of this, but i also think a major reason Pierce is ignored is his lack of charisma or media savy, whichever you choose to call it, especially pre-KG and Ray Ray.  We love him for all the right reasons (great play, hustle and attitude), but players get overhyped and overexposed when they either make the national media fall for them or simply ooze charisma.  Pierce justs plays and plays great, which i love.  Pierce has never been a media darling and therefore gets overlooked for these kind of lists.

what charisma does Kobe have? The guy looks like a smug jerk. What charisma does carmelo have? Pierce is as charismatic as most of those guys, it's just that Stern's media crew decided not to hype him and give him the special set of rules. Sheed speaks the truth, if he was the golden child or a borders without boundaries guy, he would also be promoted much, much more.


kobe is a smug jerk, but you cant tell me he doesnt know how to work the media.  His fake laugh and jokes with the tnt crew.  I didnt mean it as a negative for Pierce.  Pierce doesnt act fake like Kobe does.  But Kobe's fakeness endears him to the media elite. 
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