Giddens

[Rondo2287]

Doc has commented on his needing to get smarter as a player, which just cements it for me: he's our new TA.  (And yes, I know our old TA is still here.)

Yeah, unfortunately, this is the impression I got from him too. 

He had a ton of energy, and really hustled, and showed off his athleticism, but ultimately, his activity level's net positive affect on the team was much lower than I felt it should have been.  That is the same thing that happens with Allen.  He will do some loud things, make some nice plays, score some points...but when it is all said and done, he just doesn't help the team much.

Really not the same thing. Allen's impact is with his hands on the ball. Giddens is rarely touching the ball. You surround him with people with talent and they'll take advantage of the little things he does well.

The team limited the Nets to 28 total points in the 2nd half, 11 in the 4th...  I think there was plenty of impact.

Well, you are right that they are different.  But I meant they have a similar way of not helping the team as much as they appear to in flashes.

I think Giddens still has a lot to learn about positioning, and how to play basketball in general.  Right now, he is an active player, but incredibly innefficient.

In terms of positioning.  I remember several times where I saw him run into the corner on offense, stand their and wait for a shot to get put up and then he would crash the offensive boards.  So yes he was active but not active in ball movemement or creating shots.

[feckless]

This discussion all seems kind of silly to me.  It is the 1st time we have seen much of JR, he played okay, good D and made a couple of shots and nice passes.  He isn't going to be challenging PP, Ray or even Quisy for minutes.  He is playing at a level where Doc has to decide if he dresses, stays in Boston or goes to Portland.  Barring an injury, maybe 2, he is not real relevant - because Lester is being groomed to play point and we are shallow at back-up point Lester's play is of  more concern.

[HomeRunBaker]

Time management
J.R. Giddens had 7 points and 13 rebounds in 33 minutes, his most playing time since joining the Celtics last season.

“I thought J.R. was unbelievable with his energy,’’ Rivers said. “He didn’t score a lot but, defensively, and rebounds, and he just kept a lot of things alive.

“That’s his role on this team. He’s not going to be a scorer. But he can be a defender. And if wants to buy into that role there can be minutes for him.’’

http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/articles/2009/10/14/rondo_not_guarded_during_celtics_exhibition_win/

Doc doesn't seem to think he has too much energy. If you're looking for a star, he's not it, but he can be a perfect role player for this team.  Just someone who comes in, plays defense, rebounds and moves the ball.  Very unselfish player, that's why I think he'd be a good fit for this team as a role player.

And those who said he has a low BBIQ, I haven't seen anything to suggest such a thing.  He really hasn't played enough before last night for anyone to come to that conclusion, imo.  To me, he seems to have decent basketball smarts.  I think he can take Tony's spot.

Giddens problem is that he is clueless on how to play the NBA game.  Yes, he has the ability to bring energy but doesn't know when or how to use his skillset on the basketball court.  Giddens has phenomenal athletic ability which is why Ainge took a flyer on him but he isn't even yet in Tony Allen's league of understanding how the NBA game is played......which speaks volumes.  We already signed Marquis Daniels to play the role of "someone who comes in, plays defense, rebounds and moves the ball" yet hasn't approached TA's level thus far.

Giddens will again spend much of the season in the NBDL....this year with the Maine Red Claws.  There simply isn't a role for him unless several of our wings go down with injuries.

[the_Bird]

And if wants to buy into that role there can be minutes for him

That's the money quote right there.  If Giddens wants playing time, he has to accept that he's not getting a lot of shots on a team with Paul Pierce and Ray Allen and KG and 'Sheed and House and BBD and.........

This quote, here, makes everything that happened last year make sense.  When Walker was on the floor, what did we see?  Not really a great player, but someone who was hustling, exerting effort on D, not taking a lot of bad shots, etc.  

I'm convinced that at least so far, Walker has been the guy who has understood what the coaches are looking for from him (to be a high-energy, defensive-minded role player), whereas this transition away from being The Man has been a lot more difficult for Giddens.

So, Walker gets to dress, Giddens does not.  Walker gets a little playing time, Giddens plays eight minutes all season.  Walker stays with the parent club, Giddens gets humbled by being sent to the D-League.  

[clover]

Yep, and so far Lester has shown that commitment to D while also backing off from his own scoring.  That's part of why they gush about the 25yo rookie's maturity.  Perhaps those two examples around Giddens will help him to really get it.

[TBreezy]

He was +7 and the team won by three - it is hard to call his contribution last night less than helpful.  IMO they groom him this year and see if he can replace Marquis next year... Thats the way I reading it - whether he can grow enough is another story, but I don't think it is impossible

[feckless]

He was +7 and the team won by three - it is hard to call his contribution last night less than helpful.  IMO they groom him this year and see if he can replace Marquis next year... Thats the way I reading it - whether he can grow enough is another story, but I don't think it is impossible

That's a lot of growing--because he is starting pretty far below being a regular contributor--IMO

[ssspence]

He was +7 and the team won by three - it is hard to call his contribution last night less than helpful.  IMO they groom him this year and see if he can replace Marquis next year... Thats the way I reading it - whether he can grow enough is another story, but I don't think it is impossible

To replace Marquis he'd need to learn to dribble first. His handle makes Gerald Green's look like Rod Strickland's.

[moiso]

He was +7 and the team won by three - it is hard to call his contribution last night less than helpful.  IMO they groom him this year and see if he can replace Marquis next year... Thats the way I reading it - whether he can grow enough is another story, but I don't think it is impossible

To replace Marquis he'd need to learn to dribble first. His handle makes Gerald Green's look like Rod Strickland's.

yep, dribbling is his biggest weakness.  I havn't seen him beat someone off the dribble... ever.

[kozlodoev]

Actually, the fact that he's a limited dribbler simply means that he should concentrate on finding shot with a one-dribble drive. He's not going to be Chris Paul, no matter who you slice it, so it's crucial for him to understand which plays will work and which won't.

[Chris]

Actually, the fact that he's a limited dribbler simply means that he should concentrate on finding shot with a one-dribble drive. He's not going to be Chris Paul, no matter who you slice it, so it's crucial for him to understand which plays will work and which won't.

Well, he also needs to be a better shooter.  Right now, he is not a very consistent outside shooter.  So if you can't shoot, or get to the basket, it doesn't leave much.

This, by the way, is also Walker's big problem right now.

[moiso]

Actually, the fact that he's a limited dribbler simply means that he should concentrate on finding shot with a one-dribble drive. He's not going to be Chris Paul, no matter who you slice it, so it's crucial for him to understand which plays will work and which won't.

He won't be Chris Paul, but Tony Allen is a very sloppy dribbler and he blows by people left and right to get to the rim/line.

[BudweiserCeltic]

What Giddens should be doing is doing a lot of slashing, and posting up. That's where he's at his best offensively. He's fairly decent finding slashing big men, and passing down low. His length also makes him a bit of a threat around the basket with his athletism.

Right now he's getting the ball a lot in the perimeter, and that's not good for him in my opinion... though something he should be working on. Not a problem if he's moving the ball, which was something he wasn't doing during the Summer League which surprised me. Probably because he was trying hard to impress... surprised me because during the NBDL he was quite selfless moving the ball. Impressive when you consider that no one in that team passed the ball.

[MVP]

What Giddens should be doing is doing a lot of slashing, and posting up. That's where he's at his best offensively. He's fairly decent finding slashing big men, and passing down low. His length also makes him a bit of a threat around the basket with his athletism.

Right now he's getting the ball a lot in the perimeter, and that's not good for him in my opinion... though something he should be working on. Not a problem if he's moving the ball, which was something he wasn't doing during the Summer League which surprised me. Probably because he was trying hard to impress... surprised me because during the NBDL he was quite selfless moving the ball. Impressive when you consider that no one in that team passed the ball.

He shouldn't be doing a lot of slashing because his dribbling is worse then TAs. And he shouldn't be expecting any post ups because that would mean that we are running a play for him which isn't going to happen even in a preseason game with the offensive weapons that we have.

What Giddens should focus on is defense/rebounding. On offense, he should keep working on those corner 3s that Bowen mastered as well as leaking out on fast breaks/going back door for dunks. Probably even more important is court awareness. Giddens was just all over the place last night. Part of it was good because he got a lot of rebounds/loose balls. But part of it was bad, he didn't know where he should be on either offense or defense in certain parts of the game. That's probably the biggest thing keeping him from getting more minutes. Hopefully his performance against NJ earns him some more minutes in the next few games and he improves in this area as well as continuing to crash the boards and playing with a lot of energy. With TA/Walker injured, if he doesn't prove that he belongs in the near future, he could be out of the league in a year.

[the_Bird]

What Giddens should focus on is defense/rebounding. On offense, he should keep working on those corner 3s that Bowen mastered as well as leaking out on fast breaks/going back door for dunks. Probably even more important is court awareness. Giddens was just all over the place last night. Part of it was good because he got a lot of rebounds/loose balls. But part of it was bad, he didn't know where he should be on either offense or defense in certain parts of the game. That's probably the biggest thing keeping him from getting more minutes. Hopefully his performance against NJ earns him some more minutes in the next few games and he improves in this area as well as continuing to crash the boards and playing with a lot of energy. With TA/Walker injured, if he doesn't prove that he belongs in the near future, he could be out of the league in a year.

+1.  That's what he should be doing if he wants to see the court; focus on D and keep the ball moving on offense, but DON'T look for his own shot.  That's clearly what Doc is telling him that the team needs and that's what will get him court time.  Long-term, he needs that jumper to survive, but the time to work on that is over the summer.