Is There Such a Thing as "The Truth"?

[Redz]

I tried to dig into this a bit in my most recent "Rant", but those things seem to get buried.  (see the thread linked below)

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=30470.msg571876#msg571876

The topic of "The Truth" (not PP) struck me again in a side debate in the Schilling thread about an OP/Ed piece and journalism etc...

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=31587.msg575356#msg575356

So tell me.  If we can argue about things til we turn blue, is there a right and wrong?  Why bother arguing if there is no absolute right answer?

Does the Truth really matter if it's all going to be a matter of perception anyhow?

[indeedproceed]

Being the extremely self centered person I am, I say there is no truth. There is subjective reality. What you believe to be true in your world might not be true in mine.

However, there are truths, like "2+2=4", and "Defense Wins Championships"...so to answer your question: huh?

[Redz]

Being the extremely self centered person I am, I say there is no truth. There is subjective reality. What you believe to be true in your world might not be true in mine.

However, there are truths, like "2+2=4", and "Defense Wins Championships"...so to answer your question: huh?

Thanks for clearing that up for me IP.

At least someone gives a crap enough to reply (thanks for humoring me  )

I just get all wigged out hearing people have such opposite opinions of the same [dang] thing.

[indeedproceed]

I mean, I do believe that truth is subjective. There is only one objective truth to me, and that is "I think therefor I am". To every other truth, there is an "except when" and "not accounting for" that must be addendumed on to it.

In short, my mind is aglow with whirling, transient nodes of thought careening through a cosmic vapor of invention.

[BrickJames]

Of course there's truth.  I'm right, and you're all wrong.

[Redz]

Of course there's truth.  I'm right, and you're all wrong.

thanks Brick, that actually made me laugh 

[indeedproceed]

Of course there's truth.  I'm right, and you're all wrong.

Truth is a funny thing, like for instance I know you think you're telling the truth, but objectively I know that is completely false. Weird thing, truth.

[Redz]

Of course there's truth.  I'm right, and you're all wrong.

Truth is a funny thing, like for instance I know you think you're telling the truth, but objectively I know that is completely false. Weird thing, truth.

blowhard 

[screwedupmaniac]

so if paul pierce is the truth, and truth itself is skewed, then what is paul pierce? an opinion?

woah, that's deep stuff . . . 

[guava_wrench]

There is, of course, non-subjective reality. This reality is really complex and our ability to measure and model it is limited. We also do not have access to the past in a direct way, which means that the best we can do is strive for the best interpretations of the data to get as close to the truth of reality as we can.

There are also issues that are truly subjective, such as goals and 'oughts' in general. The best science strongly indicates anthropogenic global warming, but the question of whether we should care about the results of our actions is not a matter of truth.

[MaineBleedsGreen]

"The phrase "two plus two equals five" ("2 + 2 = 5") is a slogan used in George Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four[1] as an example of an obviously false dogma one must believe, similar to other obviously false slogans by the Party in Nineteen Eighty-Four. It is contrasted with the phrase "two plus two makes four", the obvious – but politically inexpedient – truth. Orwell's protagonist, Winston Smith, uses the phrase to wonder if the State might declare "two plus two equals five" as a fact; he ponders whether, if everybody believes in it, does that make it true? Smith writes, "Freedom is the freedom to say that two plus two make four. If that is granted, all else follows." Later in the novel, Smith attempts to use doublethink to teach himself that the statement "2 + 2 = 5" is true, or at least as true as any other answer one could come up with."

obviously doesn't answer anything, but it's an interesting position along the path to enlightenment.