Author Topic: Tips on Strengthening?  (Read 6197 times)

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Tips on Strengthening?
« on: August 18, 2009, 08:24:45 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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Started to ask this on the 'diet' thread, but didn't want to divert the thread.  I've been fortunate not to have weight issues, but 2 years ago (at age 48) I was starting to sag and thought I should begin exercising regularly.  I had hoped to build some muscle, but have made only mild progress in about 27 months of regular gym visits.

I probably don't workout long enough or hard enough -- my average workout is about 15 minutes cardio and then about 20-30 minutes working arms, shoulders and chest. I do this about 4 times a week plus a b-ball game once a week.  I have bad shoulders so I can't handle much weight -- I opt for higher reps at a manageable weight so that I don't injure my shoulders. Can't do push-ups as they wreck the shoulders.

Any thoughts for building up a little muscle?  I am not looking for Swarzeneggar -- I'm not even looking for impressive -- but, I am hoping to improve on Don Knotts. 

Tips? Or, do I just need to go longer, harder, heavier.  It is doubtful that I can spare any additional time, and frankly, I don't love doing it, so -- excluding steroids -- I'd love to hear if there are any helpful tricks, tidbits, thoughts or rules of thumb about buidling a little strength and muscle.  Thanks.



Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2009, 09:25:32 PM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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Leg work.  The legs contain some of the biggest muscle groups in the body; working them out increases muscle mass directly and through sympathetic growth (muscles you aren't working getting bigger).  You could either sub it in for cardio one of your days or create a day just for leg work.  Squats are best but if they are too strenuous do leg presses instead.  Add some calf raises and hamstring curls, maybe some leg extensions if you've got the time.

Either way, you should diversify your workouts - if you do the same exercises every time you'll plateau pretty quickly.  Change exercises and the amount of reps you do every 6-8 weeks.

Also, pick up some kind of protein powder - drink a shake within 2 hrs of every workout, and maybe put one in with your breakfast too.  You probably don't want weight gainer so just look for the stuff that's basically pure protein.  Most people prefer whey but there are several other options.

Lastly, if you're 50 with bad shoulders and haven't worked out a lot in the past, real growth may be pretty difficult.  Gains will probably be fairly slow, but they can be made, and just treading water against the aging process is still progress.

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2009, 09:31:54 PM »

Offline Redz

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Any thoughts for building up a little muscle?  I am not looking for Swarzeneggar -- I'm not even looking for impressive -- but, I am hoping to improve on Don Knotts. 



Don Knotts had to go a major workout regimen to get in shape for all of the swimming in Mr. Limpett
Yup

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2009, 09:34:12 PM »

Offline Kwhit10

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When do you do your cardio?  I've read that running after the workout compared to before hand is better for strength training.

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2009, 09:40:40 PM »

Offline yall hate

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instead of doing all of that lifting on the same day (I am assuming that is what you are doing) try and do arms one day (bi, tri, forearm), then chest and back one day, then shoulders and legs one day, etc...  mix and match which muscle groups you like, but this way you are really working that set of muscle.  to try and do a full body workout in 20-30 minutes is near impossible. 

so when you do your arms day, there should be three sets per exercise, and 2-3 exercises per muscle group (so 3 bi exercises, 8-10 reps per, 3 tri exercises 8-10 reps per)

As for the protein as mentioned by another poster, you will certainly get bigger with it, but some will likely be water weight, and you will gain weight.  if you are looking to get muscular without getting bigger, I would suggest avoiding the protein (just my opinion, I know a lot will disagree, but from personal experience that is my opinion)

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2009, 09:41:41 PM »

Offline yall hate

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When do you do your cardio?  I've read that running after the workout compared to before hand is better for strength training.

This is true, because you have more energy/strength to lift, so you are more likely to push yourself and be able to do more lifting if you are doing it before running

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2009, 09:44:43 PM »

Offline Eja117

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I was pretty skinny coming out of college and multiple things helped, some of which are counterintuitive.

One I completely agree with the legs.

Two. Eat more food with more protein. Tons of eggs. Chicken. And the weight gainer stuff too. Milk. Whatever. Just as long as there is decent protein.

Three. Yes I took a lot of peds. This is why I take a weak stance on them. I think people should be able to control what goes in their body. Creatine worked very well, but it was a certain kind. The kind in the tub, not the packets. Also some other things like ephedra and caffein worked, but don't take it past 5pm or you won't sleep and that is how you can ruin your life

Four. Stop running so much. anyone who can do a 6 minute mile isn't fat. I don't think. You're trying to gain weight and get stronger, not burn it. You never saw a strong looking Kenyan marathon guy.

Five. Reduce your workouts from 4 a week to two a week. I got by far the best results when I only did a certain exercise once a week. But I still worked out on other things during the week. But I was only benching once a week for example. Your muscles grow when you rest, sleep, and eat after breaking them down. Not from pushing them to pain 4 times a week. Give yourself time to heal

6 Mindset. If you approach it with a ho hum mind set you'll get ho hum results. If you tell yourself you will get strong you will.

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #7 on: August 18, 2009, 10:08:46 PM »

Offline CelticS 86

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Working out your legs will definetly help out. do same muscles only a max of twice a week. mix and match your workout, if not your body gets use to the same routine and it doesn't work anymore, its all about muscle confusion.
lastly, commit not just physically, but also mentally.
“Basketball is like war in that offensive weapons are developed first, and it always takes a while for the defense to catch up.”

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Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #8 on: August 18, 2009, 10:28:33 PM »

Offline Nut from Nh

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I would consider myself to be a pretty serious lifter and have been for about 4 years.  I put on 30 solid natural pounds of muscle in my first 12 - 18 months and the following is what I believe, just my opinions from reading and doing.

Legs are key as mentioned above, and they are neglected by most people.  They are your largest muslcle group.  Weight lifting tears muscle, then the body repairs these tears and hench our muscles get bigger.  Lifting hard with your legs causes your body to repair this large muscle group and in doing so you burn a ton of calories long after you have left the gym.  Fat middle aged women try to lose weight with cardio almost exclusively, a big mistake.  Weight training, legs in particular is a fast track way to lose weight, but nobody seems to know this.  

Creatine works.  It's controversial, but people who bash it are usually misguided and uneducated with respect to creatine itself, and training in general.  Good old fashioned (and cheap) monohydrate is the way to go.  Follow the instructions for the loading phase, but DRINK LOTS OF WATER.  Water is needed for training, but is also key for creatine to work, and you liver to avoid being stressed.  People who say creatine hurts your liver are in early 1990's mode, they are wrong (so long as you drink around a half gallon of water or more per day).  People who say creatine bloats your muscles with water are correct.  But if they are suggesting that it is all fake water-weight type muscle than they are wrong.  You're muscles will get bloated, when you stop using creatine they will indeed deflate.  BUT, I promise you that you gained more mass and muscle than you would have otherwise.  So they are half right.  Creatine brings water to the muscles, aiding repair and recovery.  Repairing the muscle is the point of training in the first place, it's how you grow as I said above.  Your not using creatine correctly if you don't include the water!

Whey protein is good and even people WHO DON'T TRAIN could most likely benefit from having whey protein shakes every day.  The avg person DOES NOT have enough protein in their diet.  Therefore, someone looking to add muscle (good muscle) should absolutely add whey protein to their diet.  3 scoops per day.  About 20 grams pre workout, 30 grams IMMEDIATELY after a workout and then again in between lunch and dinner if you train in the morning.  Even a light trainer should have 1.5 grams of preotein per pound of body weight per dya, 2 grams for people seeking good solid mass gain.  That is a lot of protein my friend, you won't get it from eggs and tuna.  Protein baby, it's good, it's a must.  You are doing yourself an injustice not to use it.  Go for whey protein isolate if you want the real deal, worth the extra cash.

I think your cardio is good.  A person looking to get fit and build muscle is best served by alternating cardio / weight training each day for six days with rest on the seventh.  Weight training builds muscle which increases metabolism.  Increased maetabolism burns fat, less fat means more muscle which means increased metabolism!  See the cycle?  That's a win win.  

It sounds like your not out to get huge, but it also sounds like you need to train harder.  I get lightheaded and nausious on a regular basis in the gym.  Thats a good thing.  I hurl about once a month, that's training hard.  I also have bad bad shoulder pain, bursitis.  When it flairs up I ice 3 times a day and take 800 milogram motrin three times a day to bring down swelling.  Lots of work, but I get better.  The key is to find a way to keep training, and to find ways to train hard.

I recommed the following for your weight training

Day 1: Chest/tri's  You figure out the movements that are right for you but the meat and potatoes will be flat/incline/decline bench and fly's with dumbells.  Hit both chest and tri's at the end with dips, weighted dips if you have the strenght.  Tri's will be pushdowns, scull crushers etc.

Day 2 back/bi  Back excersizes will be your rowing and pull downs back extensions etc, and you know what to do for bi's, curls for the girls brotha! Oh, mix in a forearm exersize too.  Strong foreams will help your grip which help you in almost any excersize you do.  Plus big popeye foreams with some solid veins is always a plus, and in business when you shake a hand and a person sees what you got going on in those foreams they will make a note, even if it is subconsious.  

Day 3 Shoulders/legs  try to get your shoulders healed and then get them stronger.  Military press, shrugs, arnold flys etc, and train those legs HARD.  Strong legs will increase strength and stability for your entire body enabling you to train harder, plus all of the metabolsm benefits I already mentioned.  Squats, extensions, etc.  

I think if you take what I said about water, creatine, and whey protein and try real hard to find a way to train harder for 4 weeks you will say holy crap, Nut from NH was right.  Some real results will breed real motivation and that's how you stick to it and continue on the path.  

1 more thing, when your body is right and your sholder is better work yourself the other way on your reps, that is to say go down.  start doing 3 sets of 8 reps at a higher weight for everything for 4-5 weeks, then go to just 5-6 reps for 3 sets, then if your body can take it go all the way down to just 3-5 reps for 3 sets.  By this time you will be throwing around serious weight, or at least to you it will seem like serious weight.  You may find this kind of lifting to be completely different, and you may love it.  Once I did high weight low reps I was never the same.  I was the avg guy doing avg stuff with avg results.  But throwing around that weight was new and fun, and clicked the primal switch.  Then i LIKED going to the gym and started pushing hard.  

Try it if you can, even if you just get down to 6 reps it will be a good shock to your muselces that should trigger new growth and break a plateau.  

Good luck man.  Keep looking to learn too.  You should look for other opinions and literature to develop your own plans and opinions.  

 

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #9 on: August 18, 2009, 10:35:35 PM »

Offline dsturdy5

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I'm not breaking any new ground here.  People have given you plenty of good advice about diet, varying your work out and focusing your workout on certain muscle groups each time. 

Like you, I tried to work every muscle group every time, doing circuit work or whatever.  I saw strength results quickly, but plateaued and saw no real improvement in bulk.  Varying my workout has helped greatly.  I have a four day cycle but only work out three days a week at the gym, (I run or play ball the other days).  The rest in between gives my body time to rest and heal. 

I would add to stretch every day, even days you do not work out.  I recently read this on a running website and have found great results.  Go through the same stretching routine you would after a work out.  This will help to tighten up your muscles a bit, in a good way. 

I have not taken to protein shakes but have had good results with protein bars either right after my work out or as a snack in place of something less healthy. 

Whatever advice you take from this, good luck with it. 

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #10 on: August 18, 2009, 10:40:31 PM »

Offline Nut from Nh

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my average workout is about 15 minutes cardio and then about 20-30 minutes working arms, shoulders and chest. I do this about 4 times a week plus a b-ball game once a week...  It is doubtful that I can spare any additional time,...

Your time in the gym is just fine if you do what I said, alternating weight training and cardio every day for six days with rest on the seventh. 

Do not do both cardio and weights tho, alternate 45 minutes of cardio one day and then 45 of the weight training I mentioned above on the next day. 

You'll get there I promise. 

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #11 on: August 18, 2009, 10:56:56 PM »

Offline Neurotic Guy

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What an incredible thread of advice from all of you -- even you REDZ for reminding me about Lim-Pett (as Lady Fish called him). 

TPs to:
Nut from Nh
dsturdy 5
celtics 86
EJA 117
Yall Hate
Kwhit 10
fairweatherfan
Redz

I appreciate all the advice -- I'll take it all in and incorporate what I can.  Thanks!!

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2009, 12:12:07 AM »

Offline vl819

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I'm just guessing, but if you're 48 and haven't had weight issues, then chances are that your metabolism is pretty fast. And if you lift weights and exercise on a regular basis, its even faster.

So if you wanna increase your strength, i would consume 1-1.5 grams of protein per pound of your total body weight (so if you weigh 180- take in 180 grams of protein) every day.
 
Work smart and hard in the gym
Eat smart and often
Believe in yourself and your body.

Good luck 

Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2009, 05:06:35 AM »

Offline P2

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You need strength?

Deadlifts, Squats, Bent-Over Barbell Rows, Military Press, Bench Press.

/thread

I know what I'm talking about (that's me in 1889):


Re: Tips on Strengthening?
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2009, 08:17:42 AM »

Offline makaveli

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You should try to workout with those flexible things, they are just great...cheers
what doesn't kill you makes you stronger