The BYC, 3 team trades, and Big Baby

[Jeff]

did some research this morning before my brain cramped up

here's what I came up with:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm

75. Whenever I read about prospective trades involving base year players, they say a third team must get involved. Why? Can't a base year player be traded in a two-team trade?

There's no specific rule that prohibits trading base year players in a two-team deal. But the way the numbers work, it's not always possible unless one of the teams dumps additional salary onto a third team.

As an example, let's say Player A plays for Washington. He earned $3 million last season and re-signed as a free agent for $10 million. That makes him a base year player whose BYC value is $5 million (see question number 73). Player B plays for Seattle and also earns $10 million, but is not a base year player. Both Seattle and Washington are over the salary cap.

Now suppose Seattle and Washington want to trade Player A and Player B for each other. Seattle can take back 125% plus $100,000 of Player B's $10 million salary, or $12.6 million. Player A's $10 million salary easily fits within that limit. But Washington can only take back as much as 125% plus $100,000 of Player A's $5 million BYC value, or $6.35 million. Player B's $10 million salary is too high.

If the two teams want to complete this trade, then Washington must rid themselves of an additional $2.92 million in salary (because Washington's total outgoing amount would then be $7.92 million, and 125% plus $100,000 of $7.92 million is $10 million, which is the amount of incoming salary Washington is trying to absorb in this example). Let's say that Player C plays for Washington, is not a base year player, and earns $3 million. What happens if they want to trade Player A plus Player C for Player B? Player A plus Player C total $13 million, which is greater than Seattle's $12.6 million maximum. So Washington can't give the additional $2.92 million to Seattle.

This is where a third team gets involved. This team must be far enough under the cap, or have a Traded Player exception (see question number 69) to absorb the additional $2.92 million in salary. Let's say Chicago is way under the salary cap. Here is an example three-team trade:

    * Washington sends Seattle Player A
    * Seattle sends Washington Player B
    * Washington sends Chicago Player C
    * Chicago sends Washington a future second round draft pick

Here's how the numbers work:

Washington trades $5 million BYC plus $3 million salary, or $8 million. They can receive 125% plus $100,000, or $10.1 million, in return. Washington receives Player B's $10 million salary, along with a draft pick that has zero trade value (see question number 71) for a total of $10 million.

Seattle trades $10 million in salary, and receives $10 million in salary, so they're fine.

Chicago trades $0 and receives $3 million, but since they're more than $3 million under the salary cap, they can absorb the increase.

So the numbers work for all teams involved.

The example calls for a 10M signing, so you have to half all the numbers to give Big Baby about $5M (which isn't as easy as it sounds with the 125% + 100K rules)

With that said, if you can work out the math, you could probably replace Washington with Boston, Seattle with New Jersey, and Chicago with Memphis and you'd have the outline of a potential 3 team deal.  Then it would just be a matter of filling in names.

I think if we get Memphis involved, we can dump someone like Tony Allen or JR Giddens (depending on how the math works) in exchange for a conditional 2nd rounder that we'll never get.

Then it becomes a matter of what we get from New Jersey that adds up to about $5M (I think).

If anyone can work out the math and plug in some names that make sense, you deserve mucho Tommy Points.

Cheers.

[BudweiserCeltic]

If you want to use the Trade Machine for BYC players, just do this steps.

This is an example for a two team trade:

1) Choose the teams, your team (Celtics) being the one with the BYC player.
2) Choose the players you want to trade for (the other team).
3) Forget about the specific players you want to use in a trade (your team) and just select salaries that will add up to what half of the BYC's salary is plus any other player that will be involved in the trade.
4) Check trade, if it's successful, it means the trade works for the Celtics.
5) Do the same process above (leave the players you want to trade for intact) and this time for the Celtics' players simply choose salaries that will add up to the actual salary of the BYC player and any other you want to use in a trade.
6) Check trade, if it's successful, it means the trade works for the other team.

So if steps 4 and 6 are successful, the trade works.

As an example, let's say you want to trade Scal and Baby (4m this year) for Yi and Dooling. The first portion, try trading for Scal and Rondo... if it works, it means that a trade with Scal and Baby works for the Celtics.

Try the trade again, adding JR and Pruitt to Rondo and Scal, and if it works, it means it works for NJ.

That should give you a rough idea if a trade would work with a BYC player without doing too much math.

If you want to do a 3-player trade, I think you can do the same as above without problem. Leave the other teams' players intact, and simply match salaries with your team (BYC player's team).

[Celtic#9]

Ouch! that hurts my head.

[trey_h]

does anybody know what kind of trade exceptions specifically that New Jersey got from the Vince Carter trade? I suppose it could not matter bc they are under the cap anyways.