A rumor I must Dispell about Stoudemire!

[KG_ended_Bias]

People make WAY TOO MUCH of Amare's bad defense when Nash gets beat to the lane every time hes driven upon & Amare has to help out & his man scores on lobs or dumpdowns. If Garnett's PG's couldn't gaurd a sole we wouldn't be saying K.G. is not D-ing up, We would be crucifying that PG. Garnett man would average 20 in the Suns system because Nash get abused 90% of the nights he play & it results in Amare's man reaping the benefits as most Western Conference teams best scorer are the PF's. Aldridge, Gasol, Duncan(Parker Destroys Nash), Nowitzki(Kidd runs past Nash), Al Jefferson, Carlos Boozer(Deron WIlliams Kills Nash), Doug West(CP3 Demolishes Nash), Zach Randolph(Baron Davis Physically Manhandles Nash)& previously Elton Brand. Try gaurding those Forwards at a disadvantage without a body on them with them having a free run at the basket. Good luck! I watch 80 Suns games a year so I have alot more knowledge of what is really going on with his defense as opposed to most looking at the box scores. Unless Amare doesn't help at all on drives by the PG's which goes against any teams logic. He is doomed if he stays playing with Nash & will NEVER get rid of the NO D tag! He would have a luxury of multiple great defenders if he were here in Boston to help aid him also. Phoenix has Zero good defenders in their starting lineup if you dont count Grant Hill coming of the bench. Shaq hasn't played D since 03'-04' season. C's has 3 in the Starting line-up(Perk, Pierce, K.G.)if you don't include Rondo which is 4. 4 good defenders camouflages the 5th starter so that he cant be abused. I die with my C's & I just wanna see us put a another Banner up next year by having a good offseason then season. Seeing the Flakers in the show turns my stomach!

Nothing to do with trading Rondo or for him, just a tidbit of informantion that Celtic Bloggers should know.

[KungPoweChicken]

You make some valid points; however, the people who are anti-Stoudemire probably dislike him for more than his defense. Many now see him as a quitter, pouter, and egotist, who can't swallow his self-pride for the good of the team--isn't his nickname Stat? I don't want to put his name under the dreaded caution list just yet, which contains Iverson, Randolph, and a few others. He still has the opportunity to prove me wrong, and I hope he does, but not in a Celtics uniform.

[Fafnir]

I am sorry I have to disagree. Garnett has played with plenty of weaker defenders in his day.

Amare is a poor defender plain and simple. He doesn't even try far too often. I've watched him a lot over the years. This is true during playoff games and the regular season.

[Steve Weinman]

I am sorry I have to disagree. Garnett has played with plenty of weaker defenders in his day.

See: Marbury, Stephon, for reference.

(That's "weaker" in comparison to KG's current guards with the Celtics.  I'm not sure how vintage-age Steph and Nash compare defensively.  It's not pretty one way or the other.)

-sw

[BCelts]

People make WAY TOO MUCH of Amare's bad defense . . .

I disagree, Amare's defense is truly abysmal.  To my eye, in last years playoffs he singlehandedly killed the suns.  He is ok as a 1 on 1 guy, but not since herald green have I seen someone miss more help rotations.  I remember a stretch in one game (I think in the playoffs) where the opposing team scored four or five times in a row because of a missed rotation or late rotation by Amare.  I fear he just does not "get" team defense.  An amazing offensive talent to be sure, but his defense and his injury history makes him worth less than rondo in my book.  If we could get him for ray and a bbd sign and trade - worth the risk, but not much more.  One persons opinion.

[Roy Hobbs]

. . . He is ok as a 1 on 1 guy, but not since herald green have I seen someone miss more help rotations. 

More than Mikki?!

I'm an Amare fan, but his defense has been weak.  He made some real strides in it this year, but he -- and the rest of the team -- lost their motivation under Terry Porter. 

If a coach could incorporate a fast-paced offense into a system that preached defensive fundamentals, I think Amare would be fine.   Offensively, Amare is a legitimately great player, and he has all the skills to be a great defender. Doc and TT might be the perfect combo to get through to him.

(However, I wouldn't want Barbosa as our first-team point guard under any circumstances.)

[dlpin]

Poor perimeter defense generally helps a big man's numbers, not hurt it. Remember Camby last year on the Nuggets, for example.

Just as a reminder, Garnett has played with some truly abysmal PGs in terms of defense. Troy Hudson, Stephon Marbury, Marko Jaric.

In any case, the D in front of Amare is the same as in front of shaq and other Suns big men, and his defensive rating is worse than Shaq's and Jared Dudley's.

In fact, with the exception of last season, every other season his on/off court numbers show even the Suns played better defense with him off the court in every season he has played except one.

[BCelts]

. . . He is ok as a 1 on 1 guy, but not since herald green have I seen someone miss more help rotations. 

More than Mikki?!

I'm an Amare fan, but his defense has been weak.  He made some real strides in it this year, but he -- and the rest of the team -- lost their motivation under Terry Porter. 

If a coach could incorporate a fast-paced offense into a system that preached defensive fundamentals, I think Amare would be fine.   Offensively, Amare is a legitimately great player, and he has all the skills to be a great defender. Doc and TT might be the perfect combo to get through to him.

(However, I wouldn't want Barbosa as our first-team point guard under any circumstances.)

Roy, I rarely disagree with what you write, but I think here I do.  Amare has had plenty of time in this league to grasp defensive rotations.  He just has not done it at all.  Like you and many people here (which is what makes this group great) I watch a significant number of NBA games, and I just have not seen measurable defensive progress from Amare in terms of help or weakside defense.  He misses assignments routinely (perhaps exacerbated by Nash's "el toro" approach to defending his position).  I thought Shaq was brought in to address Arare's weaknesses, but was just too slow.  Could Garnett do it?  Perhaps, but not a bet I'd take.  I think the odds of our current team repeating is better than the odds of being able to fix Amare's defense or health issue to repeat.

But you are right about Mikki Moore and Barbosa.  My goodness!

[Fafnir]

. . . He is ok as a 1 on 1 guy, but not since herald green have I seen someone miss more help rotations. 

More than Mikki?!

I'm an Amare fan, but his defense has been weak.  He made some real strides in it this year, but he -- and the rest of the team -- lost their motivation under Terry Porter. 

If a coach could incorporate a fast-paced offense into a system that preached defensive fundamentals, I think Amare would be fine.   Offensively, Amare is a legitimately great player, and he has all the skills to be a great defender. Doc and TT might be the perfect combo to get through to him.

(However, I wouldn't want Barbosa as our first-team point guard under any circumstances.)

Roy, I rarely disagree with what you write, but I think here I do.  Amare has had plenty of time in this league to grasp defensive rotations.  He just has not done it at all.  Like you and many people here (which is what makes this group great) I watch a significant number of NBA games, and I just have not seen measurable defensive progress from Amare in terms of help or weakside defense.  He misses assignments routinely (perhaps exacerbated by Nash's "el toro" approach to defending his position).  I thought Shaq was brought in to address Arare's weaknesses, but was just too slow.  Could Garnett do it?  Perhaps, but not a bet I'd take.  I think the odds of our current team repeating is better than the odds of being able to fix Amare's defense or health issue to repeat.

But you are right about Mikki Moore and Barbosa.  My goodness!

I still think Pheonix was crazy not to trade Amare for KG. They would have been the favorites in the west. We probably would then have gotten Gasol, we could offer more than the Lakers.....

[Moranis]

. . . He is ok as a 1 on 1 guy, but not since herald green have I seen someone miss more help rotations. 

More than Mikki?!

I'm an Amare fan, but his defense has been weak.  He made some real strides in it this year, but he -- and the rest of the team -- lost their motivation under Terry Porter. 

If a coach could incorporate a fast-paced offense into a system that preached defensive fundamentals, I think Amare would be fine.   Offensively, Amare is a legitimately great player, and he has all the skills to be a great defender. Doc and TT might be the perfect combo to get through to him.

(However, I wouldn't want Barbosa as our first-team point guard under any circumstances.)

Roy, I rarely disagree with what you write, but I think here I do.  Amare has had plenty of time in this league to grasp defensive rotations.  He just has not done it at all.  Like you and many people here (which is what makes this group great) I watch a significant number of NBA games, and I just have not seen measurable defensive progress from Amare in terms of help or weakside defense.  He misses assignments routinely (perhaps exacerbated by Nash's "el toro" approach to defending his position).  I thought Shaq was brought in to address Arare's weaknesses, but was just too slow.  Could Garnett do it?  Perhaps, but not a bet I'd take.  I think the odds of our current team repeating is better than the odds of being able to fix Amare's defense or health issue to repeat.

But you are right about Mikki Moore and Barbosa.  My goodness!

I still think Pheonix was crazy not to trade Amare for KG. They would have been the favorites in the west. We probably would then have gotten Gasol, we could offer more than the Lakers.....

that has always been my what if.  What if the Bulls or Suns actually pulled the trigger on KG and we ended up with Jefferson, Gasol, and Perkins in the paint, coupled with Pierce, Ray, and Rondo.  I'm not sure we win the title last year, but if they stayed healthy that team is set up much better long term.

[cordobes]

Why do you need to start threads to voice your opinions on subjects that are already being discussed in another threads? 

Anyway, Stoudemire is a bad defender. He doesn't bother to put the effort or the intensity, or even to fake it. He just sits in the paint, following the ball with his eyes and when it passes somewhere nearby him he reaches for a steal or a block. He rarely moves his feet, he doesn't commit to stop the pick'n'roll, he's lazy recovering and catching up, he doesn't get low to stay in front of guards in the perimeter, he doesne't put the effort in the post (very often he doesn't even bother to raise his arms up to contest a shot), gets out of position because he's always staring at the ball, etc. Atrocious defender, Nash at least tries (at least sometimes).