Danny has quite a bit of blame to fail us to repeat

[LB3533]

Just because the team we had out there on the court played like a B+ or A- (62 win team) doesn't mean that Danny constructed that team to play like they did.

We had a lot of guys step up and quite possibly play "over their heads" for much of the season and the playoffs.

[Chris]

Just because the team we had out there on the court played like a B+ or A- (62 win team) doesn't mean that Danny constructed that team to play like they did.

We had a lot of guys step up and quite possibly play "over their heads" for much of the season and the playoffs.

Now this is unfair.  I would argue that one of the reasons Danny did not make moves was because he felt that some of these players would in fact step up.  In fact, I would argue that one of Danny's problem was that he was counting on someone from the group of Allen, Pruitt, Walker, and Giddens to step up, and when none of them did, it really crippled the team. 

I think Danny fully expected Rondo, Perk, Davis and Powe to progress a good deal this season.  Some (Davis) might have exceeded his expectations, while others (Powe) may have fallen short, but I really don't think the overall improvements of the other players was at all a surprise to him.

[winsomme]

Just because the team we had out there on the court played like a B+ or A- (62 win team) doesn't mean that Danny constructed that team to play like they did.

We had a lot of guys step up and quite possibly play "over their heads" for much of the season and the playoffs.

Now this is unfair.  I would argue that one of the reasons Danny did not make moves was because he felt that some of these players would in fact step up.  In fact, I would argue that one of Danny's problem was that he was counting on someone from the group of Allen, Pruitt, Walker, and Giddens to step up, and when none of them did, it really crippled the team. 

I think Danny fully expected Rondo, Perk, Davis and Powe to progress a good deal this season.  Some (Davis) might have exceeded his expectations, while others (Powe) may have fallen short, but I really don't think the overall improvements of the other players was at all a surprise to him.

agreed. he definitely thought the core of Eddie, Powe and BBD would be solid and they were.

the biggest problem that i saw was the "Posey by committee" plan. that just never made sense to me.

[Chris]

Just because the team we had out there on the court played like a B+ or A- (62 win team) doesn't mean that Danny constructed that team to play like they did.

We had a lot of guys step up and quite possibly play "over their heads" for much of the season and the playoffs.

Now this is unfair.  I would argue that one of the reasons Danny did not make moves was because he felt that some of these players would in fact step up.  In fact, I would argue that one of Danny's problem was that he was counting on someone from the group of Allen, Pruitt, Walker, and Giddens to step up, and when none of them did, it really crippled the team. 

I think Danny fully expected Rondo, Perk, Davis and Powe to progress a good deal this season.  Some (Davis) might have exceeded his expectations, while others (Powe) may have fallen short, but I really don't think the overall improvements of the other players was at all a surprise to him.

agreed. he definitely thought the core of Eddie, Powe and BBD would be solid and they were.

the biggest problem that i saw was the "Posey by committee" plan. that just never made sense to me.

I convinced myself it would work if they were able to play House at SG, and Scal could pick up some minutes at SF.  Unfortunately, for much of the season, House needed to play PG, since Pruitt looked like a deer in headlights, and Scal was forced into action as a PF, because of injuries...oh yeah, and Tony Allen was still terrible.

But I was definitely looking through green colored glasses at that point.  Anytime your best case scenario involves playing guys out of position, its not going to work out.

[winsomme]

Just because the team we had out there on the court played like a B+ or A- (62 win team) doesn't mean that Danny constructed that team to play like they did.

We had a lot of guys step up and quite possibly play "over their heads" for much of the season and the playoffs.

Now this is unfair.  I would argue that one of the reasons Danny did not make moves was because he felt that some of these players would in fact step up.  In fact, I would argue that one of Danny's problem was that he was counting on someone from the group of Allen, Pruitt, Walker, and Giddens to step up, and when none of them did, it really crippled the team. 

I think Danny fully expected Rondo, Perk, Davis and Powe to progress a good deal this season.  Some (Davis) might have exceeded his expectations, while others (Powe) may have fallen short, but I really don't think the overall improvements of the other players was at all a surprise to him.

agreed. he definitely thought the core of Eddie, Powe and BBD would be solid and they were.

the biggest problem that i saw was the "Posey by committee" plan. that just never made sense to me.

I convinced myself it would work if they were able to play House at SG, and Scal could pick up some minutes at SF.  Unfortunately, for much of the season, House needed to play PG, since Pruitt looked like a deer in headlights, and Scal was forced into action as a PF, because of injuries...oh yeah, and Tony Allen was still terrible.

yeah it's tough spot to fill. i keep going back and forth between longer big and Posey-replacement as the priority for this off season.

With Paul dealing with bone spurs that apparently are not going to be operated on, they definitely are going to have to figure out a way to get him more rest.

but KG and maybe now Perk coming off surgeries also needs serious backup...

[jdpapa3]

I'd still like to know the alternatives that you guys would've gone with.

Andersen was looked at in depth.
Lue was given an offer.
Pietrus got MLE in Florida.
Barnes loves the west coast.

[Mr October]

We had a terrible 2008 off season. Even though the market was terrible we could have used better minimum wage talent at the 3 and 5.

The resigning of TA was questionable, and of course the POB experiment was silly. We have enough projects on the roster. The 2009 FA class is FAR superior to the 2008 class. I expect a much better off season. Wyc, Doc and Danny all see the gaping holes.

[dlpin]

I think it was ownership all along that decided to go with the bargain version of a title defense. Penny wise, pound foolish...it's pretty silly to pay Kev so much but not pay a few more guys to get all the way. Yeah our core is/was the best but with the bargain bench they were worn out by playoff time.

Yes, even with Kevin playing some or a lot, I think we would have been too thin this year based on health.

Every single one of our starters should have been on the injured list going into the Orlando series. Pagliuca mentions it in today's Boston Herald article that they were all injured. Rondo: ankle sprains, Ray: ham issue, Paul: bone spurs, Perk: needs shoulder surgery again.

That wasn't just from Kevin not playing. We need bench players we are going to put on the court or we don't need them. Without them, we can forget about winning 18 with Garnett. We need them on the court in the regular season to limit wear and tear, and then we need them to play 15-25 a night, and to not give up on them and put our starters back in just to squeeze out a regular season win. Long minutes are for the playoffs only and even that isn't a great idea with this core.

We just can not win a title without backups when our core is over 30 and we ask our guys to play so hard on defense every game.

But here is the thing: they were NOT penny pinching. Ainge did offer the full MLE to someone, which is really all he had to work with. So in financial terms, the outcome would have been the same had he succeeded.

The problem is that he either overestimated the discount players would take to play for the champions or underestimated how much teams who lost a star or two would be willing to overspend to make up for who they lost.

And so instead of offering the full MLE to an MLE type of guy (Posey, Pietrus, etc), he offered it to Maggete.

So he basically swung for the fences trying to get a homerun with the MLE and striked out waiting for Maggete to decide...

[Mr October]

I'd still like to know the alternatives that you guys would've gone with.

Andersen was looked at in depth.
Lue was given an offer.
Pietrus got MLE in Florida.
Barnes loves the west coast.

Good point about Barnes. Given roughly equal money, players are going to choose their favorite cities or coasts. Who knows what offers we didn't hear about.

The 2008 FA class was pretty bleak. Still danny rolled the dice poorly with POB instead of Andersen or even Ratliff or Skinner. Heck, Mutombo looked decent until he fell apart. The big man role was a gamble no matter what.

The big bad move I saw was resigning TA. His 2.5 is going to be factored into this years budget too.... and he's not good enough to crack our top 9 or 10. What a waste of a salary space. I would have rather seen a real defensive specialist on the team like Q Ross.

[Tr1boy]

I do understand the F. When you lose posey, the big three getting older, uncertainty that your young guns like perk, rondo, bbd would be better he didn't do anything worthwhile to upgrade our team.

Many mention getting a guy like barns(who was signed to a ridicously low deal by phx and would have come to the celtics in a heartbeat instead)who is a stellar defender , can knock down threes, is a workhorse and could have handled lewis and turkolu better than a height disadvantaged PP or allen could have.

Yeah his attitude isn't the greatest but playing for an established team changes that

The thing for me is that he didn't "try" so that guys like me can't really fault him for his offseason and trade deadline activities.

Like i said he needed to try harder to repeat and ultimately win three in a row. But 2 in 3 years would also quite an accomplishment but i solely belive the big three are running on emergency fuel . Ray Allen and KG are in tip top shape but still with age , injuries are inevitable, pierce honestly has been on a physical decline since he didn't "care" a couple of years ago.

ainge has a great starting lineup but needs to give them a break during the game and thats where good vet capable bench players come into play

He needs to get a pf/c over 6'10 that can at least play defense and also get a swingman ideally at 6'7 plus that can defend and shoot the three.

Without these two ingredients next year will be same as this year.(even with kg healthy)

[Chris]

Just because the team we had out there on the court played like a B+ or A- (62 win team) doesn't mean that Danny constructed that team to play like they did.

We had a lot of guys step up and quite possibly play "over their heads" for much of the season and the playoffs.

Now this is unfair.  I would argue that one of the reasons Danny did not make moves was because he felt that some of these players would in fact step up.  In fact, I would argue that one of Danny's problem was that he was counting on someone from the group of Allen, Pruitt, Walker, and Giddens to step up, and when none of them did, it really crippled the team. 

I think Danny fully expected Rondo, Perk, Davis and Powe to progress a good deal this season.  Some (Davis) might have exceeded his expectations, while others (Powe) may have fallen short, but I really don't think the overall improvements of the other players was at all a surprise to him.

agreed. he definitely thought the core of Eddie, Powe and BBD would be solid and they were.

the biggest problem that i saw was the "Posey by committee" plan. that just never made sense to me.

I convinced myself it would work if they were able to play House at SG, and Scal could pick up some minutes at SF.  Unfortunately, for much of the season, House needed to play PG, since Pruitt looked like a deer in headlights, and Scal was forced into action as a PF, because of injuries...oh yeah, and Tony Allen was still terrible.

yeah it's tough spot to fill. i keep going back and forth between longer big and Posey-replacement as the priority for this off season.

With Paul dealing with bone spurs that apparently are not going to be operated on, they definitely are going to have to figure out a way to get him more rest.

but KG and maybe now Perk coming off surgeries also needs serious backup...

I would have argued this if they had Powe AND Davis coming back, but since Powe will likely be out for at least half the year, if not more (assuming they even resign him), they absolutely need to shore up the front line. 

This is a critical offseason, and they really have 3 huge holes, at backup big, backup wing, and backup PG.  I think they are all equally important if this team wants to have any chance against the Lebrons...although if they can fill two of them with top tier backups, they may get away with filling the other with a lower level guy...as long as they are still NBA material, and can win Doc's trust enough to see a few minutes here and there.

[Moranis]

You could say the same about James Posey, but it`s just not true.
KG´s injury was the sole reason why we didn`t repeat, imo.
No Posey and no Birdman could`ve changed that.
Sure, someone like Posey could have spelled Pierce and Ray during the regular season, and maybe they wouldn`t have been that tired. Maybe they would`ve made it to the ECF.

But all this talk is moot, and contains too many "If`s" for my taste.
Bottom line: No KG, no championsjip.

I'm sorry, we don't get by cleveland even with KG if the bench remains the same.  Cleveland was better than the C's all year long and that would not change in the playoffs.  Even assuming by some miracle we get by cleveland, we would be underdogs in the finals against the Lakers, and would have been a terrible matchup against them.  denver would be a different story, but still not an easy victory.

The C's bench lacks depth, lacks impact players, and is filled with mostly inconsistent players that once a series may decide to show up (davis being the exception, but if KG plays, he doesn't mature nearly as much as he did).

  We were ahead of Cleveland when KG went down with an easier remaining schedule. We had the inside track for home court and our defense was really coming together. We were also underdogs against the Lakers last year.

Cavs and C's both had 9 losses when KG went down the first time at the end of January and had split the season series at that point.  Cavs lost just 7 games the rest of the way and that includes the three meaningless games in April after they had essentially wrapped up home court.

[Casperian]

OK, outside of the Birdman and Barnes, who could he have gotten that would've greatly helped this team?

James Posey

[elcotte]

OK, outside of the Birdman and Barnes, who could he have gotten that would've greatly helped this team?

James Posey

Posey isnt a big.

[Eja117]

OK, outside of the Birdman and Barnes, who could he have gotten that would've greatly helped this team?

James Posey

Posey isnt a big.

He kinda plays big though