C's backcourt, not frontcourt, can win it all

[TitleMaster]

Look, we all saw what happened when the House lit up, in game 7. On the other foot, what took him so long and how long can Rondo carry the backcourt, series after series?

Right now, the C's frontcourt is decimated. We need to change Pierce, from scoring option number 1 to option number 3 and draw the majority of the offenses through the guards. Hence, Marbury has got to step up; he's been playing lost for too many games.

Pierce has got to do what Bird and Parish did back in '84, pull down a total of 30 rebounds per game. Yes, both Bird and Chief were in double digits for boards during the finals. If we don't do that, then we'll be giving away many more second options and the chances for more horrific overtime drama. We need all our frontman to crash the boards like there's no tomorrow. I think we've got to stop this unconscious desire for the return of Powe/KG, it isn't going to happen for these games.

Right now, Pierce is 24 PPG/6 RPG/2 APG... I want Pierce to be 18 PPG/11RPG/4 APG going forward. Many of those assists will be towards our backcourt (but not only for Ray Ray or Rondo) and likewise, obviously, an open BBD for a 8-10 footer is still a preferred play, when the perimeter is tightly defended. Remember, before '05, Pierce was one of our best rebounders; he still has it.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Ball movement, and giving the ball up to your shooters... and some penetration. That's pretty much it. This wasn't really much about House struggling, but the team not putting him in a position to succeed.

Big Baby, for instance, has been playing a bit too much like Powe to my liking, and what I mean by this a blackhole. About 2 or 3 times in the game today, he drew a double team with Eddie on the strong side, and Baby simply forced a shot.

This are the things the we need to improve, better kickouts when our shooters make themselves available and are open.

[TitleMaster]

This wasn't really much about House struggling, but the team not putting him in a position to succeed.

Big Baby, for instance, has been playing a bit too much like Powe to my liking, and what I mean by this a blackhole.

This is true.

I believe part of this is the lack of specialization. For example, the Celts don't lack shooters, they lack a true big man rotation with the associated rebounding and shot blocking. In a sense, we got too comfortable with KG around. And when let's say everyone tries to be a finisher, we lose control of the boards, opponents get key rebounds, and then keep themselves in the game. Believe me, when you've got nothing to lose, your opponents will adapt.

So back in '03, we'd overachieved and beat a good Pacer's squad with healthy O'Neil, Miller, and Tinsley, by using a cross product of a quasi-zone defense and a heavily perimeter oriented offense but of course, the Nets had already figured that out so we were continually ineffective against them.

Today, we've got the ability to play all styles, however, we're essentially trying to get Pierce to be Pierce of '03, instead of where he's needed today and that's under the basket, keeping the Celt's front line intact without a KG around. In a sense, we're underachieving given our depth of guards, who can hoist high percentage shots.

I honestly believe that we can still win a title if we play with a type of focus. If Pierce fronts LeBron, keeping him away from the glass & then our team defense makes LeBron find someone other than Williams open, their offense will be very one dimensional. It'll be a LeBron iso or a lesser shooter, that's it. Remember, we still lost Game 6 despite Ray Ray's 51 points (can anyone say... the story of Elgin Baylor or Jerry West against the C's). We can make LeBron, the Elgin Baylor of the east!

[wiley]

Look, we all saw what happened when the House lit up, in game 7. On the other foot, what took him so long and how long can Rondo carry the backcourt, series after series?

Right now, the C's frontcourt is decimated. We need to change Pierce, from scoring option number 1 to option number 3 and draw the majority of the offenses through the guards. Hence, Marbury has got to step up; he's been playing lost for too many games.

Pierce has got to do what Bird and Parish did back in '84, pull down a total of 30 rebounds per game. Yes, both Bird and Chief were in double digits for boards during the finals. If we don't do that, then we'll be giving away many more second options and the chances for more horrific overtime drama. We need all our frontman to crash the boards like there's no tomorrow. I think we've got to stop this unconscious desire for the return of Powe/KG, it isn't going to happen for these games.

Right now, Pierce is 24 PPG/6 RPG/2 APG... I want Pierce to be 18 PPG/11RPG/4 APG going forward. Many of those assists will be towards our backcourt (but not only for Ray Ray or Rondo) and likewise, obviously, an open BBD for a 8-10 footer is still a preferred play, when the perimeter is tightly defended. Remember, before '05, Pierce was one of our best rebounders; he still has it.

I don't know much about bball strategy, but your post makes perfect sense to me.  We are underutilizing our bench guards right now and exhausting the hell out of everyone else.

I'm tired of Paul backing people down from the top of the key while in a state of exhaustion and getting stripped.  And I also agree that he could easily get 15 rebound or more playing inside.

I know Tony is often a carnival ride of a player, but I think we should start Rondo, Ray, TA, Pierce and Perkins.  That way House and Marbury can continue playing together off the bench...

But I don't expect the Celts to change anything.  I doubt they'll start Scal at the 4 and I'm sure they won't start Pierce there either.

I like your thinking Titlemaster!

[TitleMaster]

As for Pierce, as a starting 4, that might be taking it too far.

It's more the focus of the game vs a sort of unprepared, "let's see what happens" and "let's hope the refs don't give LBJ a game or two" type of mentality which has made me sour.

We need to realize that no team has anything to lose in these playoffs. Neither the Magic, nor the Cavs, nor the Shaq-free Lakers have won yet. So with that in mind, despite the media's *cult of personality* biases, they'll fight for every board, every possession, and anything they can get, to keep themselves in the series so that one or two, Paul Pierce ala 2002/2003 top off games, isn't doing to sink their battleships and neither is Ray Ray going off for 50 points.

Also, unlike everyone else in the country, I do not fear LeBron James just like Red Auerbach never feared Elgin Baylor and that guy could routinely drop 40 to 60 pts, at will, during playoff series. So now, if he scores 40-50 points, so be it, however, let's not also let him get 30 points, 15 rebounds, and 12 assists unfettered all series long. Take away the glass and the primary passing lane to Williams and the Cavs are not Championship caliber but an ordinary upstart team.
Likewise, without Odom playing his heart out, neither are the Lakers. So I say, just like in '03 where the Pacers had already written us off, let's *Overachieve* with the cards we'd been dealt!

[wiley]

As for Pierce, as a starting 4, that might be taking it too far.

It's more the focus of the game vs a sort of unprepared, "let's see what happens" and "let's hope the refs don't give LBJ a game or two" type of mentality which has made me sour.

We need to realize that no team has anything to lose in these playoffs. Neither the Magic, nor the Cavs, nor the Shaq-free Lakers have won yet. So with that in mind, despite the media's *cult of personality* biases, they'll fight for every board, every possession, and anything they can get, to keep themselves in the series so that one or two, Paul Pierce ala 2002/2003 top off games, isn't doing to sink their battleships and neither is Ray Ray going off for 50 points.

Also, unlike everyone else in the country, I do not fear LeBron James just like Red Auerbach never feared Elgin Baylor and that guy could routinely drop 40 to 60 pts, at will, during playoff series. So now, if he scores 40-50 points, so be it, however, let's not also let him get 30 points, 15 rebounds, and 12 assists unfettered all series long. Take away the glass and the primary passing lane to Williams and the Cavs are not Championship caliber but an ordinary upstart team.
Likewise, without Odom playing his heart out, neither are the Lakers. So I say, just like in '03 where the Pacers had already written us off, let's *Overachieve* with the cards we'd been dealt!

I'm ready to try starting Pierce at the 4, with Scal his backup and Baby backing up Perk, as being discussed in the start Scal thread.

If Pierce can shift between 3 and 4 without discombobulating everything, then I'm okay with starting Scal at the 4, but I'd lean towards getting more of our guards more minutes the entire game, right from the get go....

[EJPLAYA]

I think Ray Allen and his 23.4 pts, 3 boards and 2 assists per game at 47% from the three point line, and 92% from the foul line would like you to rephrase your argument that Rondo is the only backcourt player doing anything in this series...

[TitleMaster]

Sorry, I'd left Ray Allen out of the discussion because he's doing his job w/o much adieu.

The guard situation is { Ray Ray, Rondo, Starbury, House } which is a better rotation than { DJ, Ainge, Carlisle, Vincent }, I'm selectively leaving out Sichting because he was only good for that one season; he was out with the flu in '87.

What that means is that the Celts of the 80s did it w/o a dynamo backcourt but for us, we're hamstrung because our frontline is playing a scatterplot game and not crashing the boards like Bird and Parish did, non-stop. Plain and simple, a shift in focus, and we're at par with the Cavs and the Lakers.