Cedric Maxwell discussing refs on Dan Patrick Show

[the TRUTH]

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/danpatrick/blog/62901/index.html

That's the link. I didn't hear the show, but the brief summary of this discussion is as follows:

"Maxwell thinks the officiating has been good in this series, despite some criticism that the refs have favored the defending champions."

Favored us??? I would love to have some of what those people are smoking! Overall, I'm not nearly as appalled by the officiating in this series as I was against Cleveland last year. I think it's been relatively even both ways over the course of the series, but we definitely got the short end of the stick Tuesday night. If anything, that means the Bulls have gotten the benefit of the doubt more than us - the defending champs, and for people to honestly think it's the other way around is a joke.

Scal's blocking foul in Game 4, Pierce getting mugged over and over in Game 4, Pierce's apparent 4-point play where they didn't blow the whistle in Game 3, Ray's last two fouls in Game 5, and Gordon clearly stepping out of bounds at the end of Game 5 are just a few huge calls that went against us. Brad Miller and Noah set moving picks all day long, yet the only two guys who ever get called for it are Big Baby and Perk.

I seriously wonder whether or not the national media - or most fans for that matter - actually watch the games.

[soap07]

I seriously wonder whether or not the national media - or most fans for that matter - actually watch the games.

No, you're right. The only people that actually watch the games are the ones that think that the referees are in a wide-spread conspiracy to screw the Celtics. The people that don't think that aren't actually watching the games.

[fairweatherfan]

The media narrative is that the only controversial call in our series is the Rondo non-flagrant, because they've spent the last 40 hours chirping about it endlessly.  The reason why is that sports media "experts" don't pay a lot of attention to actual game content, they pay attention to what their peers are writing and talking about afterward, and then ape that, sometimes trying to take a different angle to be "controversial" and drive up their pageviews/viewers. 

Add on the fact that time is at a premium on shows like Patrick's, and it costs valuable time to fill listeners in on something they haven't heard a hundred times already, and the only options for discussion become exactly what's already been discussed endlessly.  So, "questionable officiating" like all the examples you've mentioned (and the instances of bad calls that have favored us) gets boiled down to "OMG he hit him in the FACE!!" It's a case of collective goldfish memory bouncing around an echo chamber.

...sorry for the rant, this is a pet peeve of mine and why I prefer blogs like CB to anything mainstream these days. 

[crownsy]

I seriously wonder whether or not the national media - or most fans for that matter - actually watch the games.

No, you're right. The only people that actually watch the games are the ones that think that the referees are in a wide-spread conspiracy to screw the Celtics. The people that don't think that aren't actually watching the games.

ya, those kooks. Everyone knows the NBA officating pool is niether corrupt or plain awful, its not like this league has ever had an offical caught fixing games or anything   

[LarBrd33]

threads complaining about referees are some of the most mind-numbingly boring threads on any NBA forum.  It goes both ways.  Some calls go against us... there are others where we completely hack the crap out of players and get away with it.  I'll never blame the refs for a win or a loss.

[crownsy]

threads complaining about referees are some of the most mind-numbingly boring threads on any NBA forum.  It goes both ways.  Some calls go against us... there are others where we completely hack the crap out of players and get away with it.  I'll never blame the refs for a win or a loss.

I wonder if you'd think that way if you were a phx fan and a certain ref's calls at the end of a playoff game enabled you to lose by the 4 point spread and have his mob buddies pocket an estimated $47,000?

I have zero trust in the NBA's reffering system. I doubt they are intenianly swinging games for the league or at its direction, but the NBA has done zero since the incident to assure me they aren't swinging them for vegas or aren't just awful at thier jobs.

so much for that promise of transparicy. good thing most NBA fans bought stern saying it was a one time deal hook, line, and sinker.

[youcanthandlethetruth113]

I"m kind of with Cornbread on this one.

Don't get me wrong and make no mistake about it, the officiating has been terrible, but at least it's been bad at both ends of the court.

3-4 times a game I find myself saying "we got away with one there" or "thanks for the call to even it out". I'm certain you all think/say the same thing(s) throughout the course of the game, no?

The point is that the players on the floor are determining the outcome of the game, not the refs.

[Atzar]

I think a couple of other factors come into play, too.  

First is that, for the most part, fans think their own team is getting jobbed by the refs at any given moment.  That's because they turn a blind eye to most calls in their favor and express outrage when a call goes the other way.  

Second is that we've kinda become public enemy #1 to the majority of the basketball world this year.  We won the title last year, and suddenly KG's antics went from being 'intense' to being 'classless'.  Now that we've won, we've had our turn - other teams are jealous now.

The two combine to create a fanbase that dislikes the Celtics and therefore believes that the Celtics get the benefit of every call.

[LarBrd33]

threads complaining about referees are some of the most mind-numbingly boring threads on any NBA forum.  It goes both ways.  Some calls go against us... there are others where we completely hack the crap out of players and get away with it.  I'll never blame the refs for a win or a loss.

I wonder if you'd think that way if you were a phx fan and a certain ref's calls at the end of a playoff game enabled you to lose by the 4 point spread and have his mob buddies pocket an estimated $47,000?

I have zero trust in the NBA's reffering system. I doubt they are intenianly swinging games for the league or at its direction, but the NBA has done zero since the incident to assure me they aren't swinging them for vegas or aren't just awful at thier jobs.

so much for that promise of transparicy. good thing most NBA fans bought stern saying it was a one time deal hook, line, and sinker.

My point is I can never get my panties in a bunch over some ref call.  There is no conspiracy.  Any time we get a questionable call against us... there is some questionable call we get away with.  I just think it's silly to cry about it.   We can cry about the result of game 4 or something, but then the Bulls will just cry about Rondo's "flagrant".  It's just dumb.  The refs do their best.   It's not that interesting.

[Rondo_is_better]

threads complaining about referees are some of the most mind-numbingly boring threads on any NBA forum.  It goes both ways.  Some calls go against us... there are others where we completely hack the crap out of players and get away with it.  I'll never blame the refs for a win or a loss.

I wonder if you'd think that way if you were a phx fan and a certain ref's calls at the end of a playoff game enabled you to lose by the 4 point spread and have his mob buddies pocket an estimated $47,000?

I have zero trust in the NBA's reffering system. I doubt they are intenianly swinging games for the league or at its direction, but the NBA has done zero since the incident to assure me they aren't swinging them for vegas or aren't just awful at thier jobs.

so much for that promise of transparicy. good thing most NBA fans bought stern saying it was a one time deal hook, line, and sinker.

My point is I can never get my panties in a bunch over some ref call.  There is no conspiracy.  Any time we get a questionable call against us... there is some questionable call we get away with.  I just think it's silly to cry about it.   We can cry about the result of game 4 or something, but then the Bulls will just cry about Rondo's "flagrant".  It's just dumb.  The refs do their best.   It's not that interesting.

There is no conspiracy, but there is plenty of incompetence, and that incompetence doesn't always even out over the course of a game--or over the course of a series. The 2002 Kings-Lakers series comes to mind as the most obvious example. Its because of that that I myself and many other fans feel such intense frustration.

[MaineBleedsGreen]

I really don't think the refs do anything intentialy. It's simple human error. All of the action on the court takes place in a split second, and as anyone who watches a game on TV knows (from the multiple angle replays), what you actually see can depend heavily on what angle you have on the play. The refs can't only make calls on things that they are 100% certain about or there would never be a whistle blown during the game. I think at the end of a game, a series, the playoffs, and the season (especially) that the calls that go for and against you really do even out.

Sure, I'd love it if a refs call never decided the end of a game (i.e. by putting someone on the line, fouling someone out, etc) but it's just not realistic. They'd have to be ordered to swallow their whistles for the last two minutes. If that happened there would still be plenty to complain about.

I think the thing with the refs that annoys me the most is when coaches and players get fined for complaining and criticizing the refereeing. I think it's ridiculous that these guys shouldn't be held publicly accountable. I'm sure there is plenty of review and chastising that goes on behind closed doors, but this is public entertainment, this isn't a private club, or a secret society, let these people speak their minds about what they're seeing, that's exactly what the refs are doing when they blow a whistle and make a call, I think the coaches and players should be allowed to publicly question the officiating with out being reprimand and fined for it.

[MaineBleedsGreen]

I really don't think the refs do anything intentialy. It's simple human error. All of the action on the court takes place in a split second, and as anyone who watches a game on TV knows (from the multiple angle replays), what you actually see can depend heavily on what angle you have on the play. The refs can't only make calls on things that they are 100% certain about or there would never be a whistle blown during the game. I think at the end of a game, a series, the playoffs, and the season (especially) that the calls that go for and against you really do even out.

Sure, I'd love it if a refs call never decided the end of a game (i.e. by putting someone on the line, fouling someone out, etc) but it's just not realistic. They'd have to be ordered to swallow their whistles for the last two minutes. If that happened there would still be plenty to complain about.

I think the thing with the refs that annoys me the most is when coaches and players get fined for complaining and criticizing the refereeing. I think it's ridiculous that these guys shouldn't be held publicly accountable. I'm sure there is plenty of review and chastising that goes on behind closed doors, but this is public entertainment, this isn't a private club, or a secret society, let these people speak their minds about what they're seeing, that's exactly what the refs are doing when they blow a whistle and make a call, I think the coaches and players should be allowed to publicly question the officiating with out being reprimand and fined for it.

[BrickJames]

I really don't think the refs do anything intentialy.

...and this is when I stopped reading your post.

[BrickJames]

posts complaining about threads complaining about referees are some of the most mind-numbingly boring threads on any NBA forum.  It goes both ways.

fix't 

[MaineBleedsGreen]

sorry, didn't mean to dbl post. don't know how to delete it tho.