Dikembe Declines Boston...but

[CoachBo]

Joe Smith would be a marked improvement over "No Outside Shooting Small Ball" - but I don't know that he fills the massive void at the 5. Perhaps PJ can be coaxed out of retirement.

Doesn't solve the lack of outside shooting and defense on the bench mess, though.

Ya know, I have come to respect your basketball knowledge - you are usually right on.  I gotta say this though, if we win the title this year, I am totally calling you out for your repeated beating of the dead horse that is James Posey. 

I for one think there are some holes on the bench (namely backup center) but I am certainly not ready to write off our title chances because of them.  As for defense and shooting off the bench I still think that House and Allen will provide what is needed there.  Both are above average defenders (TA being a great defender) and as for the outside shooting, we have Ray Allen, Paul Pierce and Eddie House -- 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the L.  When it counts, 2 out of 3 will be in the game.

Losing James Posey did not drive the stake into our teams heart.  And I hope you admit you were wrong about him when we raise banner 18, given your repeated condemnation of the team for letting him walk.  The backup C situation is different, I will agree with you that that does need to be addressed.

Yeah, I know. Danny's a genius. Blah, blah, blah.

I have said consistently that this team needs someone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time. Despite the misinformation people love to post on this board, Posey brought those qualities to this team last year and we don't have them this year. The claim that Tony Allen has filled Posey's void is too laughable to warrant further discussion.

I've also wearied of the revisionist history that attempts to downplay Posey's substantial contribution to the championship last year. It's getting old reading that Posey couldn't defend, couldn't shoot, etc. None of that is true.

However, I have also consistently said that the mistake - and I will not waver from that statement; Ainge made a mistake not resigning Posey, one of several this summer - is done. Now, we must focus on replacing his skills, as listed above. A center, while a nice addition, does none of that.

I have also said consistently that this team will not win a title - or the Eastern Conference - with this sad excuse for a bench, put together by Ainge during the Dumpster Diving Summer of 2008.

A legitimate backup 5, instead of the failed O'Blount experiment, is a start. But it may not be enough to keep up with Cleveland, let alone Los Angeles.

[Chief]

Joe Smith would be a marked improvement over "No Outside Shooting Small Ball" - but I don't know that he fills the massive void at the 5. Perhaps PJ can be coaxed out of retirement.

Doesn't solve the lack of outside shooting and defense on the bench mess, though.

Ya know, I have come to respect your basketball knowledge - you are usually right on.  I gotta say this though, if we win the title this year, I am totally calling you out for your repeated beating of the dead horse that is James Posey. 

I for one think there are some holes on the bench (namely backup center) but I am certainly not ready to write off our title chances because of them.  As for defense and shooting off the bench I still think that House and Allen will provide what is needed there.  Both are above average defenders (TA being a great defender) and as for the outside shooting, we have Ray Allen, Paul Pierce and Eddie House -- 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the L.  When it counts, 2 out of 3 will be in the game.

Losing James Posey did not drive the stake into our teams heart.  And I hope you admit you were wrong about him when we raise banner 18, given your repeated condemnation of the team for letting him walk.  The backup C situation is different, I will agree with you that that does need to be addressed.

Yeah, I know. Danny's a genius. Blah, blah, blah.

I have said consistently that this team needs someone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time. Despite the misinformation people love to post on this board, Posey brought those qualities to this team last year and we don't have them this year. The claim that Tony Allen has filled Posey's void is too laughable to warrant further discussion.

I've also wearied of the revisionist history that attempts to downplay Posey's substantial contribution to the championship last year. It's getting old reading that Posey couldn't defend, couldn't shoot, etc. None of that is true.

However, I have also consistently said that the mistake - and I will not waver from that statement; Ainge made a mistake not resigning Posey, one of several this summer - is done. Now, we must focus on replacing his skills, as listed above. A center, while a nice addition, does none of that.

I have also said consistently that this team will not win a title - or the Eastern Conference - with this sad excuse for a bench, put together by Ainge during the Dumpster Diving Summer of 2008.

A legitimate backup 5, instead of the failed O'Blount experiment, is a start. But it may not be enough to keep up with Cleveland, let alone Los Angeles.

CoachBo, is there anyone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time that you would like Danny to go after via trade?

[Redz]

Coach Bo said

I have said consistently that this team needs someone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time. Despite the misinformation people love to post on this board, Posey brought those qualities to this team last year and we don't have them this year. The claim that Tony Allen has filled Posey's void is too laughable to warrant further discussion

I wholeheartedly agree with the part in green.  The Celts D has been good, and at times excellent this season, but the long spells of completely dominant frenzied D have largely been absent - and I credit Posey with much of the peak D-level from last year.

[D Dub]

Joe Smith would be a marked improvement over "No Outside Shooting Small Ball" - but I don't know that he fills the massive void at the 5. Perhaps PJ can be coaxed out of retirement.

Doesn't solve the lack of outside shooting and defense on the bench mess, though.

Ya know, I have come to respect your basketball knowledge - you are usually right on.  I gotta say this though, if we win the title this year, I am totally calling you out for your repeated beating of the dead horse that is James Posey. 

I for one think there are some holes on the bench (namely backup center) but I am certainly not ready to write off our title chances because of them.  As for defense and shooting off the bench I still think that House and Allen will provide what is needed there.  Both are above average defenders (TA being a great defender) and as for the outside shooting, we have Ray Allen, Paul Pierce and Eddie House -- 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the L.  When it counts, 2 out of 3 will be in the game.

Losing James Posey did not drive the stake into our teams heart.  And I hope you admit you were wrong about him when we raise banner 18, given your repeated condemnation of the team for letting him walk.  The backup C situation is different, I will agree with you that that does need to be addressed.

Yeah, I know. Danny's a genius. Blah, blah, blah.

I have said consistently that this team needs someone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time. Despite the misinformation people love to post on this board, Posey brought those qualities to this team last year and we don't have them this year. The claim that Tony Allen has filled Posey's void is too laughable to warrant further discussion.

I've also wearied of the revisionist history that attempts to downplay Posey's substantial contribution to the championship last year. It's getting old reading that Posey couldn't defend, couldn't shoot, etc. None of that is true.

However, I have also consistently said that the mistake - and I will not waver from that statement; Ainge made a mistake not resigning Posey, one of several this summer - is done. Now, we must focus on replacing his skills, as listed above. A center, while a nice addition, does none of that.

I have also said consistently that this team will not win a title - or the Eastern Conference - with this sad excuse for a bench, put together by Ainge during the Dumpster Diving Summer of 2008.

A legitimate backup 5, instead of the failed O'Blount experiment, is a start. But it may not be enough to keep up with Cleveland, let alone Los Angeles.

Interesting.  Never once have I read anywhere, from anyone, that Posey couldn't shoot or defend.  And the fact that he is a daily topic of discussion only re-certifies how large his contribution was last year.  No one is debating that, certainly not myself.

I would have loved to have him back, but the reality is that we just couldn't afford him.  The crucial thing he brought last year was championship experience.  Now we have a roster full of championship experience.  

And you can flame me all you like for this next comment, but I will stand by it.  Brian Scalabrine has the EXACT same skill set as Posey.  Veteran player who defends the 4/3 and can hit the open 3.  Just like Pose, don't expect him to drive the ball and don't expect a 10 rebound night out of him.  

My point is that one bench wing player will not break this teams back.  The team defense is better, and we have 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the league.
  
As for Paddy O, you will get no arguement there out of me.  In fact I have given you credit for calling that one early on.  

Backup Center is BY FAR this teams biggest hole.  The wing situation just isn't as big a deal as you claim, imho.  

[vinnie]

DDub, you are kidding about Scalabrine, right? As far as I can see, he should be the 11th or 12th (I wold prefer 13th man) and should never get off the bench.

[ssspence]

If we're to get Joe Smith, we'd have to trade for him -- he'll sign with the Cavs if he makes it to a buyout. This would likely require a two-for-one (say, Scal and - hopefully - POB, or Baby, plus a 2nd, with the Cs picking up Scals salary). So roster space would come with it, which would be an added bonus.

My point is, if you can get Smith AND sign Mourning or PJ, you do it. One should not cancel out the other. And if we don't make the Smith trade, roster spaces should be created for whoever is needed. Need to sign PJ or Smith or Mourning? Cut Cassell and have him come in and coach. Need to add two of them, or sign Bonzi Wells from China, or Marty Conlon from the Providence Playground? Cut POB.

The team clearly has needs in a variety of areas (the 3 and 5 for sure). Guys who don't play should not get in the way of addressing em.

[CoachBo]

Agreed.
It appears Joe makes $4.8, so the deal you propose works - assuming that OKC will settle for players to waive. We have other options, though, if they want something to keep. If I could get Joe for Tony Allen, Baby and a deuce, I'd have to think seriously about doing that.

And getting Joe wouldn't change the dynamic for PJ or Zo, I don't think - and it certainly wouldn't change the need for outside shooting and defense off the bench from the 3.

As for Posey, he's repeatedly denigrated on this board - which is fine. I can choose who to take seriously here.

[Mean Gerald Green]

DDub, you are kidding about Scalabrine, right? As far as I can see, he should be the 11th or 12th (I wold prefer 13th man) and should never get off the bench.

Seriously, Brian Scalabrine is no James Posey.

That has to be a joke, no one is that oblivious.

[CoachBo]

DDub, you are kidding about Scalabrine, right? As far as I can see, he should be the 11th or 12th (I wold prefer 13th man) and should never get off the bench.

Seriously, Brian Scalabrine is no James Posey.

That has to be a joke, no one is that oblivious.

Amazing, isn't it?

[RebusRankin]

Marty Conlon? Are you kidding me? A 40 year old never was!

I still say we should have signed Barnes or Bonzi.

[guava_wrench]

That's pretty funny comparing Posey and Scal. I have to say, there is a significant difference. Both like to shoot only 3's if possible, but Posey can launch from anywhere pretty quickly. Scal has a ritual of movements he has to do before shooting. Posey is also WAY better at hitting his 3's.

On defense, Posey can play perimeter players. Scal can hit them as they run by.

Btw, are there any links yet to Mutombo actually declining Boston? There is Doc calling it unlikely, but Deke hasn't said he wouldn't.

[billysan]

DDub, you are kidding about Scalabrine, right? As far as I can see, he should be the 11th or 12th (I wold prefer 13th man) and should never get off the bench.

Seriously, Brian Scalabrine is no James Posey.

That has to be a joke, no one is that oblivious.

Amazing, isn't it?

CoachBo, I agree with your assessment of needs (upgrades) regarding a better bench center and SF in general. I am surprised at the one thing you havent pointed out here that is a glaring need on this second unit. Leadership, it is non existent out there IMO. I dont see it from any of the bench players this year. Posey had it, PJ has it, ZO will have it, Sam has it (But is too old), I dont think Joe Smith will have much (but I still like the acquisition). 

I think the identity and leadership are what is most lacking this year from our bench.

[Steve Weinman]

Joe Smith would be a marked improvement over "No Outside Shooting Small Ball" - but I don't know that he fills the massive void at the 5. Perhaps PJ can be coaxed out of retirement.

Doesn't solve the lack of outside shooting and defense on the bench mess, though.

Ya know, I have come to respect your basketball knowledge - you are usually right on.  I gotta say this though, if we win the title this year, I am totally calling you out for your repeated beating of the dead horse that is James Posey. 

I for one think there are some holes on the bench (namely backup center) but I am certainly not ready to write off our title chances because of them.  As for defense and shooting off the bench I still think that House and Allen will provide what is needed there.  Both are above average defenders (TA being a great defender) and as for the outside shooting, we have Ray Allen, Paul Pierce and Eddie House -- 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the L.  When it counts, 2 out of 3 will be in the game.

Losing James Posey did not drive the stake into our teams heart.  And I hope you admit you were wrong about him when we raise banner 18, given your repeated condemnation of the team for letting him walk.  The backup C situation is different, I will agree with you that that does need to be addressed.

Yeah, I know. Danny's a genius. Blah, blah, blah.

I have said consistently that this team needs someone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time. Despite the misinformation people love to post on this board, Posey brought those qualities to this team last year and we don't have them this year. The claim that Tony Allen has filled Posey's void is too laughable to warrant further discussion.

I've also wearied of the revisionist history that attempts to downplay Posey's substantial contribution to the championship last year. It's getting old reading that Posey couldn't defend, couldn't shoot, etc. None of that is true.

However, I have also consistently said that the mistake - and I will not waver from that statement; Ainge made a mistake not resigning Posey, one of several this summer - is done. Now, we must focus on replacing his skills, as listed above. A center, while a nice addition, does none of that.

I have also said consistently that this team will not win a title - or the Eastern Conference - with this sad excuse for a bench, put together by Ainge during the Dumpster Diving Summer of 2008.

A legitimate backup 5, instead of the failed O'Blount experiment, is a start. But it may not be enough to keep up with Cleveland, let alone Los Angeles.

Interesting.  Never once have I read anywhere, from anyone, that Posey couldn't shoot or defend.  And the fact that he is a daily topic of discussion only re-certifies how large his contribution was last year.  No one is debating that, certainly not myself.

I would have loved to have him back, but the reality is that we just couldn't afford him.  The crucial thing he brought last year was championship experience.  Now we have a roster full of championship experience.  

And you can flame me all you like for this next comment, but I will stand by it.  Brian Scalabrine has the EXACT same skill set as Posey.  Veteran player who defends the 4/3 and can hit the open 3.  Just like Pose, don't expect him to drive the ball and don't expect a 10 rebound night out of him.  

My point is that one bench wing player will not break this teams back.  The team defense is better, and we have 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the league.
  
As for Paddy O, you will get no arguement there out of me.  In fact I have given you credit for calling that one early on.  

Backup Center is BY FAR this teams biggest hole.  The wing situation just isn't as big a deal as you claim, imho.  

While I might not necessarily use the construction of the term "skill set" as you do D Dub, would you agree that even under your premise, the skill levels are vastly different?

-sw

[Toine43]

Joe Smith would be a marked improvement over "No Outside Shooting Small Ball" - but I don't know that he fills the massive void at the 5. Perhaps PJ can be coaxed out of retirement.

Doesn't solve the lack of outside shooting and defense on the bench mess, though.

Ya know, I have come to respect your basketball knowledge - you are usually right on.  I gotta say this though, if we win the title this year, I am totally calling you out for your repeated beating of the dead horse that is James Posey. 

I for one think there are some holes on the bench (namely backup center) but I am certainly not ready to write off our title chances because of them.  As for defense and shooting off the bench I still think that House and Allen will provide what is needed there.  Both are above average defenders (TA being a great defender) and as for the outside shooting, we have Ray Allen, Paul Pierce and Eddie House -- 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the L.  When it counts, 2 out of 3 will be in the game.

Losing James Posey did not drive the stake into our teams heart.  And I hope you admit you were wrong about him when we raise banner 18, given your repeated condemnation of the team for letting him walk.  The backup C situation is different, I will agree with you that that does need to be addressed.

Yeah, I know. Danny's a genius. Blah, blah, blah.

I have said consistently that this team needs someone to stretch defenses and actually lock down a big scorer for a few minutes at a time. Despite the misinformation people love to post on this board, Posey brought those qualities to this team last year and we don't have them this year. The claim that Tony Allen has filled Posey's void is too laughable to warrant further discussion.

I've also wearied of the revisionist history that attempts to downplay Posey's substantial contribution to the championship last year. It's getting old reading that Posey couldn't defend, couldn't shoot, etc. None of that is true.

However, I have also consistently said that the mistake - and I will not waver from that statement; Ainge made a mistake not resigning Posey, one of several this summer - is done. Now, we must focus on replacing his skills, as listed above. A center, while a nice addition, does none of that.

I have also said consistently that this team will not win a title - or the Eastern Conference - with this sad excuse for a bench, put together by Ainge during the Dumpster Diving Summer of 2008.

A legitimate backup 5, instead of the failed O'Blount experiment, is a start. But it may not be enough to keep up with Cleveland, let alone Los Angeles.

Interesting.  Never once have I read anywhere, from anyone, that Posey couldn't shoot or defend.  And the fact that he is a daily topic of discussion only re-certifies how large his contribution was last year.  No one is debating that, certainly not myself.

I would have loved to have him back, but the reality is that we just couldn't afford him.  The crucial thing he brought last year was championship experience.  Now we have a roster full of championship experience.  

And you can flame me all you like for this next comment, but I will stand by it.  Brian Scalabrine has the EXACT same skill set as Posey.  Veteran player who defends the 4/3 and can hit the open 3.  Just like Pose, don't expect him to drive the ball and don't expect a 10 rebound night out of him.  

My point is that one bench wing player will not break this teams back.  The team defense is better, and we have 3 of the best 3pt shooters in the league.
  
As for Paddy O, you will get no arguement there out of me.  In fact I have given you credit for calling that one early on.  

Backup Center is BY FAR this teams biggest hole.  The wing situation just isn't as big a deal as you claim, imho.  

While I might not necessarily use the construction of the term "skill set" as you do D Dub, would you agree that even under your premise, the skill levels are vastly different?

-sw

What Steve said is exactly what I was thinking. D Dub is correct that Posey and Scal are in theory out there to do the same things. Posey is just way better at every facet of the game. I'm not sure if D Dub was implying that Posey and Scal are interchangeable, but it seemed that way. If that's what he was saying, then he needs to reevaluate that stance, to put it lightly.

[ssspence]

Let's try to remember the strengths of the 2nd unit. Leon is a true asset in the post, and as a hustle player. Eddie House is a nice energy shooter. TA  can defend the best wing guy(s) on the opposing team 20 minutes a night (half of Ray's guy, half of PPs, or as applicable). Davis can defend in the post well against both 4s and 5s even when they're taller and - again - provide hustle.

So we need some ball handling, some rim protection / size, and a guy who can create his own shot. These should be our points of concentration. The other guys mentioned here will thrive if play is picked up in these areas, or players are added who will help.

Very achievable. AT LEAST start by giving Gabe a bit of run, test  his skills a bit. Do we really have to watch House pound the ball into the floor standing still at the top of the key much longer? Newsflash: he's a small 2. Use him that way.

I've proposed myriad other ideas for the 3 and the 5. It's still early. Whether subtle or a bit more drastic, solutions are available. Try Chris Wallace on Hakim Warrick. Bet you'd find a guy available for peanuts with scoring ability at the 3 who's in a contract year