How many championships would have the Celtics won if....

[JBcat]

we had KG and Ray since their rookie years along with Paul?  I guess for the rest of the team we could just take the value of last year's role players.  A friend and I were talking about this over the weekend.   We were lucky to have Bird and Mchale their whole careers and get Parish at such at a young age.   What if the present big 3 were together the whole time?   Let's take a look...

KG was a rookie in 95-96, Ray in 96-97, and Paul in 98-99 so we really can't start talking about  this until when Paul was on board. 

In 1999 our big 3 are too young and nobody is stopping the Spurs anyway who finished the postseason with a 15-2 mark.

In 2000 we get to the finals even in only Paul's second year.   The Pacers top scorer was Jalen Rose and next in line was a 34 year old Reggie Miller followed up by Smits averaging 12.9 PPG.   We overwhelm them with our new aged big 3 and then face the Lakers in the finals.  Kobe was already on his way to being a star at age 21 but at that that time Shaq was such a force.  I think we end up losing in the big 3's first trip to the finals 4 games to 2. 

In 2001 the Lakers lost 1 game in the playoffs.  1 game!  I think we could have beaten the 76rs to get to the finals but I think we lose yet again this time 4 games to 1.

In 2002 our big 3 are starting to really gel together.   This is the year Paul carried us to the eastern conference finals in real life and in my make believe team he carries us to the finals winning MVP honors and the Celtics get over the hump beating the Lakers who took us for granted winning in 7 games.

In 2003 we have a new challenge on our hands in the San Antonio Spurs.   We beat the Nets again to get to the finals and overcome Robinson's old legs, Manu has yet to hit his stride, and Parker is only 20.  Even with Duncan carrying them and Jackson's timely shots we are too much for them as we go on to win back to back titles winning in 6 games.

In 2004 we face a very good Pistons team in the eastern conference finals however this is KG's MVP season and he will not be denied.  We get past them and face the Lakers again in the finals with an old Malone and Payton and take them down in 5 games and even up the score against them in this renewed rivalry.  Back to back to back!

In 2005 after a hard fought 7 games series against the Pistons in the eastern conference finals we go on to face the Spurs again who have easily been winning games in the playoffs.  This time a determined Duncan with Manu and Parker coming of age we go down in 7. 

In 2006 the eastern conference is pretty weak and even a D Wade on a mission won't stop us.   This is our easiest trip through the playoffs as we only lose only 1 game and sweep the Mavs in the finals to be champs again.

In 2007 Paul and Ray go down with season ending injuries that puts any hopes of another title down the drain.

In 2008 we know what happens and we gain the edge in this new era with 5 head to head matchups in the finals against the Lakers and us winning 3 of them;D

So for those keeping score that is 5 titles for our new Celtics

[Truck Lewis]

good stuff makes for a good day dream....who fills out those early rosters?

Dana? Do we keep the likes of David Wesley and Rick Fox? Tony Battie, Greg Minor, Bruce Bowen....

In my version of this dream, Dee Brown would have one rejuvenated year in either 2000 or 2001 and help contribute to the playoff run.

[Birdbrain]

TP very cool post. 

[JBcat]

good stuff makes for a good day dream....who fills out those early rosters?

Dana? Do we keep the likes of David Wesley and Rick Fox? Tony Battie, Greg Minor, Bruce Bowen....

In my version of this dream, Dee Brown would have one rejuvenated year in either 2000 or 2001 and help contribute to the playoff run.

That's the tough part and why I mentioned you could take the value of the role players last year and place them on each year.  For example each year the starting PG's play would be like Rondo's second year.  Many of the role players we have are interchangeable from years past  and with many players wanting to play with the big 3 we could fill out our bench nicely.   

It is fun stuff to dream about as I'm sitting here on my day off.

[Big Ticket]

Nice hypotheticals, I like it.  TP.

But one thing I can guarantee... if the Celtics had drafted KG in 1995, there is absolutely no way they would've had a good enough pick in 1998 to get Pierce.  Especially when throwing Allen into the mix in 1996.

Case in point... the Wolves, who did draft KG in 1995 AND Allen in 1996  (traded for Marbury, which I think helped them slightly in the short run) had the 17th pick in 1998.

[Redz]

I always have a hard time letting go of  the quantum holistics or whatever you call the cause and effect of hypotheticals.  For instance, we don't know that these 3 guys would have developed to the point of maturity that they are at now, if they came up together.  There may have been a lot less UBUNTU going on.  How would they have played under ML Carr or someone else?  Maybe the Spurs don't win the lottery if KG is a Celtic in `96....etc..etc...

OK, assuming I can get over all that and we have some semblance of the same state of maturity of the big 3 buying into the team concept from the get go...I'll say they win 3 like the Original Big 3.  Waltah would be a force!

[SShorefan 3.0]

This is a prime example of why I love this site.  Geek or Genius, either way, I find it great fodder.

TP

[Truck Lewis]

This is a prime example of why I love this site.  Geek or Genius, either way, I find it great fodder.

TP

haha tp

[Big Ticket]

I always have a hard time letting go of  the quantum holistics or whatever you call the cause and effect of hypotheticals.  For instance, we don't know that these 3 guys would have developed to the point of maturity that they are at now, if they came up together.  There may have been a lot less UBUNTU going on.  How would they have played under ML Carr or someone else?  Maybe the Spurs don't win the lottery if KG is a Celtic in `96....etc..etc...

OK, assuming I can get over all that and we have some semblance of the same state of maturity of the big 3 buying into the team concept from the get go...I'll say they win 3 like the Original Big 3.  Waltah would be a force!

I honestly don't think it would've been an issue.  I keep hearing that these three put aside the selfishness "because they are veterans and new it was necessary".  Well... KG has criticized his entire career for being too much of a team player.  Ray Allen has never been called selfish.  Pierce certainly has, but I guarantee that had he been around a player that dominated like KG did 5+ years ago, and a guy as classy and professional as Ray Allen, that Pierce would've had absolutely no issue falling in line (if he needed any incentive in the first place).

The bigger question would've been how do they resign them all and have anyone surrounding them.

[thecaptain34]

I've actually thought about this quite a bit.."what if the big 3 played together their entire careers" ....I think it would have been absolutely amazing...they were all past their primes when they joined forces...It would have been a masterpiece to watch and we would have over 20 championship banners hanging in the rafters

[dark_lord]

hyptheticals are cool for blogs and fodder, however there is no way to make a legit case as to how many titles one thinks the team could win.  moves in sports have ripple effects.  the ripples effect draft numbers, draft picks, salary cap space, trades, free agent signings, coaches, etc.

i would like to think we would run off a few titles, but one could never legitimately or accurately say.