shaky offense and pitching = no WS this year

[Triboy16]

PRetty good run still. Its a little annoying though we can't string up two or three trophys in a row.

This year we are too injured, jason bay is good but he is not manny plus francona is a numskull

we need to sign mark texeira calibre next year, i would trade bay and possibly ellsbury, bucholz if the price is right(kind of running out of patience with these rookies) for a decent starter(like matt garza) if we get texeira.

The thing with us at this point with bay is that we've become like the st louis cardinals the past years. We have too many similiar non clutch professionals that i doubt will help us win another trophy anytime soon.

Never thought the day would come when the rays would ever beat us in a regular season series , never mind playoff series.

[yall hate]

while I am not saying they will win this series, I will say that last year we were down 3-1 to the Indians.  They were starting Carmona and CC sabathia.  We still beat them.  We arent out of this yet.  Dice, Lester and Beckett are all capable of having great games.

It's not over yet.

[yall hate]

we need to sign mark texeira calibre next year, i would trade bay and possibly ellsbury, bucholz if the price is right(kind of running out of patience with these rookies) for a decent starter(like matt garza) if we get texeira.

The problem with this is that Texiera would require a ton of money.  Additionally, then you make Lowell a bench player.  because you cant trade him without eating probably close to his whole salary.  that clearly wouldnt be worthwhile. 

They wouldnt trade Garza...

What do you hope to trade ellsbury and buch for?  you end up selling low on them.  that makes no sense. 

The fact that we may not win it all this year doesnt mean they should make rash personel decisions.  Ellsbury and Buch are two players who will be cost controlled and parts of this team for a long time coming.  We arent the Yankee's.  when a young player isnt an all star, we dont get rid of them and pay overpriced veterans. 

[Triboy16]

we need to sign mark texeira calibre next year, i would trade bay and possibly ellsbury, bucholz if the price is right(kind of running out of patience with these rookies) for a decent starter(like matt garza) if we get texeira.

The problem with this is that Texiera would require a ton of money.  Additionally, then you make Lowell a bench player.  because you cant trade him without eating probably close to his whole salary.  that clearly wouldnt be worthwhile. 

They wouldnt trade Garza...

What do you hope to trade ellsbury and buch for?  you end up selling low on them.  that makes no sense. 

The fact that we may not win it all this year doesnt mean they should make rash personel decisions.  Ellsbury and Buch are two players who will be cost controlled and parts of this team for a long time coming.  We arent the Yankee's.  when a young player isnt an all star, we dont get rid of them and pay overpriced veterans. 

Well i wouldn't trade bay, ellsbury for a guy like garza. But i would trade bay for a decent starter like him. For bay and ellsbury you get a top two pitcher.

The thing you are forgetting is taht some cash is coming off the books next year. Like tek (doubt he will get resigned) , and if you trade bay tahts 16 million dollars approx. I'm sure texeira won't take anything less than 20 million but imo he is definitely worth it

Though youk is not the most athletic outfielders, he can play the right field easily behind the green monster with crisp. Then u can have texeira who is a gold glover and lowell another gold glover at third.

not saying he will happen for sure but its something to think about.

[twistedrico]

Don't the Red sox have their own blog board?

[pizzle214]

I think that the sox can afford to lose buch. even after the no-no, since then he hasn't really proven himself as a major leauge caliber pitcher. I dont think they should get rid of ellsbury with his raw talent all he needs is a little counseling and he could be a premier outfilder in the MLB. Texieria would help alot i agree, he's top notch and world class. Personally i wouldn't mind seeing crisp and bay go even though i think Bay is a good teammate and a decent player. If lowell stays healthy he's a huge assest but i think texieria is a better all around player and he hits switch with power, how can you go wrong. As always they need anoter starter other than Wake, maybe masterson could be developed into a starter or they need to ge someone, anyone other than Wake. Also Timlin NEEDS TO GO!!!

[LB3533]

It's not really the offense...it's the pitching.

We just don't have reliable starters other than Lester, whom if he gets hit hard, it's basically over.

[nickagneta]

I'm not saying that this team is going to play Lazarus one more time but, after a 3-0 comeback following a 19-8 drubbing and a 3-1 comeback while having to face that year's Cy Young winner, I'm not about to write them off just yet.

I'm still going to cheer and hope and I think it might be a bit premature to start rolling out the "I told you so, we can't win without Manny"s and calling Terry Francona, a 2 time World Series winning manager, names.

As has already been mentioned, pitching, primarily starting pitching, has been the main culprit, although Ellsbury, Varitek, Ortiz, Drew and Kotsay have all been somewhere between bad and simply horrendous at the plate. Ortiz is hurting, seriously hurting. It will come out after all is said and done and he will be in surgery real soon.

[Sun Devil]

Haha you people are crazy. I think we had (/are still having) a hell of a year despite all the injuries. If we don't pull this one out, so be it, there is always next year. You guys are sounding too much like we did back in '03, you'd think a couple of championships would change that mentality.

[yall hate]

Well i wouldn't trade bay, ellsbury for a guy like garza. But i would trade bay for a decent starter like him. For bay and ellsbury you get a top two pitcher.

The thing you are forgetting is taht some cash is coming off the books next year. Like tek (doubt he will get resigned) , and if you trade bay tahts 16 million dollars approx. I'm sure texeira won't take anything less than 20 million but imo he is definitely worth it

Though youk is not the most athletic outfielders, he can play the right field easily behind the green monster with crisp. Then u can have texeira who is a gold glover and lowell another gold glover at third.

not saying he will happen for sure but its something to think about.

There is less then a zero percent chance that they move youk to the outfield.  if you look (I am too lazy) reporters have asked theo and francona.  htye both basically said it was a horrible idea.  you dont move a gold glove caliber fielder to the outfield and weaken your defense so drastically.  The only way they will acquire teixera is if one of youk, ortiz, or lowell are no longer on the team and that is very unlikely).

I doubt they will move Bay.  his salary is VERY reasonable.

I also am not forgetting that cash is coming off of the books, but I think the team will likely spend it in a way that fills holes, not creates jams (which texiera would do).


And as for other posters about trading buch, that would be a horrible horrible mistake.  they tinkered with his mechanics so much this year that he never got comfortable/confident.  If he was untouchable in a trade for Santana, I dont think they are going to move him when his value is lower. 

[Triboy16]

yell hate i'am sorry but your mentality won't get us far against teams like the rays and even possibly a more developed angels squad. Jason bay cuz he is affordable is good for money pinching but not good for getting fear into the eyes of the opponents team.

We really need to replace manny. And our team right now even with lowell back is just an above average offensive team.

Whatever it takes epstein this summer(unless we comeback to beat the rays miracously) we meed to try to get a guy like texeira or matt holliday. And with that sacrifices has to be made. Outside of pedroia, youk, lester, dice k, papelbon and maybe masterson and ortiz i'm willing to give up pretty much anyone to get a player like those mentioned above

[yall hate]

yell hate i'am sorry but your mentality won't get us far against teams like the rays and even possibly a more developed angels squad. Jason bay cuz he is affordable is good for money pinching but not good for getting fear into the eyes of the opponents team.

We really need to replace manny. And our team right now even with lowell back is just an above average offensive team.

Whatever it takes epstein this summer(unless we comeback to beat the rays miracously) we meed to try to get a guy like texeira or matt holliday. And with that sacrifices has to be made. Outside of pedroia, youk, lester, dice k, papelbon and maybe masterson and ortiz i'm willing to give up pretty much anyone to get a player like those mentioned above

Bay is a 30+ HR hitter.  That is basically what Manny was giving us. Holliday's numbers outside of Coors were much much worse.  Is the difference really worth the financial and prospect course? no.

edit:  holliday's career numbers away from coors: .277/.341/.450 with only 39 HR in 1190 AB outside of Coors.  2.5 years of at bats(i think) generated those numbers? no thanks.  not worth the money.
In 2007, when he was discussed as a possible mvp: 
Home: .378, 15 HR, 55 RBI
Away: .298, 6 HR, 38 RBI


And again, if they were to get Texeira, where do you plan on playing lowell or Youk?  neither can play the OF.  We have a DH.  it doesnt make sense.  It's easy to just name a player and say yes we should have him, but looking realistically at where they would play and financial cost, you havent yet given a realistic, smart acquisition.  I am all for finding one, because the team needs to do something, I just dont think we are going to see any huge changes.  (I think we will see a coco trade, probably for either an avg prospect or a middle reliever  I think we will see a new catcher of some sort.  Maybe another pitcher....No huge splashes.)

[Nerf DPOY]

I don't think a major roster shakeup is necessary. Injuries are what killed this team( if we do in fact drop this series), most specifically Beckett's. The roster is sound for the most part. Maybe get a new catcher( as ya'll hate already mentioned ), replace Timlin & BBrdsma, and hope Beckett can get healthy this offseason.

The offense is fine. When Lowell's healthy, the lineup is 8 deep. We had TWO legitimate MVP candidates, neither of whom's last name was Ortiz. The lineup wasn't the culprit in these recent losses. Our pitching got tagged by the Rays so badly last night that the Citgo sign actually caught fire.

[Triboy16]

I don't think a major roster shakeup is necessary. Injuries are what killed this team( if we do in fact drop this series), most specifically Beckett's. The roster is sound for the most part. Maybe get a new catcher( as ya'll hate already mentioned ), replace Timlin & BBrdsma, and hope Beckett can get healthy this offseason.

The offense is fine. When Lowell's healthy, the lineup is 8 deep. We had TWO legitimate MVP candidates, neither of whom's last name was Ortiz. The lineup wasn't the culprit in these recent losses. Our pitching got tagged by the Rays so badly last night that the Citgo sign actually caught fire.

you are jokes man haha.

Rays were killing us though. Their offense is lethal. I seriously thought a guy like paul byrd could handcuff them but they took care of him fine.

Not sure what dice k has, but he has been the only one to beat them up(prob his shuuto and gyro)

the pitching coach must be going crazy now to figure out how to get this lineup down. Crazy part is that the rays pitching staff is doing a number on our offense

So you know i keep mentioning guys like texeira cuz he is a great hitter. Great hitters adjust and can't be studied. Jason bay, you know how you approach him?? Give him a full diet of off pitches. He will punish you for things you leave up or fastballs but real good offspeed stuff gets him out 9 out ot 10 times.

[GroverTheClover]

I think the key thing for the Sox is to get healthy and stay healthy. We had the injury bug all too often this year and can't be facing the new Rays at half strength. That being said, the pitching outside of Dice-K (surprisingly) in the ALCS has been atrocious. Beckett needs to get healthy and hopefully Lester just had a bad game. Wakefield, I'm afraid might be over the hill but for a #4 starter you could certainly do worse. I think in the offseason they need to target starters/or see if Masterson/Bucholtz can develop. Secondly, a true power hitter to protect Ortiz. I still have faith in the Sox, but realistically we're one Manny short and it's going to be alot more difficult against a Rays team who have been showing extreme poise for a first time playoff team. If we get beat, it will be because they are the better team.