Author Topic: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?  (Read 11556 times)

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Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #30 on: July 09, 2008, 08:16:16 PM »

Offline Who

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I hope not

Childress is an awful defender. Not just bad, he's awful. He can't defend either position on the wing. He has awful lateral quickness so regularly gives 3-4 feet of daylight between himself and his man from 20 feet on out. He can't defend the post as a wing and he can't defend players off the ball moving through screens. He is an awful man-to-man defender.

Childress is not just a poor shooter, he's an awful shooter. It's not just that he has no range and can't shoot from the perimeter, he also can't shoot from 15 feet. He shot 40% on jump shots this past season and only took 25% of his shots as jumpers because in fairness (and credit to him) he knows he can't shoot a lick and shouldn't be shooting jumpers.

He's a junkyard dog. He roams the baseline and adds hustle around the rim as an athletic wing. Gets a few offensive rebounds or loose balls, cuts to the rim nicely off the ball, and scores extremely well in the paint.

That's fine but I want role players who play defense and can shoot so the floor is spaced for Pierce, Ray, KG and Rondo ... especially the C's 6th man and backup wing.

Childress is ridiculously overrated

Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #31 on: July 09, 2008, 08:18:14 PM »

Offline kozlodoev

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I dont get it. Why all the love for Josh Childress? He's a decent spot up shooter with a fugly stroke. ATL is dumb enough to match any offer any give him, but he won't get one from Boston. I'd resign Tony Allen before I'd offer anything to Childress...
He can play, he's fairly consistent, and doesn't seem to fumlbe under pressure. Also, he's unpleasantly long at his position -- 6'8 SGs have their way of being annoying. And he's still young.
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #32 on: July 10, 2008, 09:24:09 AM »

Offline RonJohn

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Who, I thought he played pretty good defense against the Celtics in their series. He's smart, does not make bonehead plays. Who would you prefer? Obviously, I would prefer Posey as well, but saying he's off the board?

I wouldn't say he is an awful shooter either. You shoot 50% from the floor and you're not a big man, you are making some shots.

Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #33 on: July 10, 2008, 09:58:47 AM »

Offline Who

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Who, I thought he played pretty good defense against the Celtics in their series. He's smart, does not make bonehead plays. Who would you prefer? Obviously, I would prefer Posey as well, but saying he's off the board?

I wouldn't say he is an awful shooter either. You shoot 50% from the floor and you're not a big man, you are making some shots.
I'd pay Posey the MLE for 4 years or anything less happily.

If Posey were to sign elsewhere .... I wouldn't pay any other wing player still on the market the MLE. The reason I wouldn't spend the MLE is because it will be very hard to spend in consecutive years while paying the Big Three and preparing for Rondo/Perk's extensions. If it's spent it needs to be on someone who can be one of the top players in your rotation which for Boston is their 6th man since the starting lineup is set. I don't think there's anyone else out there that's deserving of that money or long term role.

For a short list of guys I'd look to - Walter Herrmann, Mo Evans, Kareem Rush, bring back Tony Allen, Devean George, possibly Bonzi Wells. There's a few others but fall back options after them. Short contract and at lower money 1-3mil. Then hopefully spend the MLE next season.

The only other player in FA I'd consider signing to the MLE is Jannero Pargo as a backup guard. I don't see any of the proven restricted free agents been prized away for the MLE.



Childress is a poor jump shooter. I'm only talking about his jump shot. Shaq shoots 55-60% but he can't make jump shots either. Childress shot just under 40% on his jump shots this season. He's an efficient scorer and shoots a high FG% overall because he's an excellent finisher (65%) around the rim and takes the majority (75%) of his shots in the paint (normally created by someone else, or a broken play or a hustle play rather than driving off the dribble or a post move).

Here's a fun stat for you, in the Celtics series Childress only took three shots outside of the paint. 7 games and he's playing 30 minutes a night and he only takes 3 shots from outside the paint. That's how little belief he has in his jump shot and it's a good belief for him to hold because he won't make those shots at a good enough clip. He also missed all three jump shots he took in the postseason. He's a poor shooter.

The Hawks defensive efficiency was over 4 points worse per 100 possessions with Childress on the court than off it (he's had the same mark for 3 out of 4 seasons). That's a very big difference and not surprising in the slightest. If not for the incapable defensive skills of Mike Bibby (almost 6 points) he'd lead the team with that. His opposition PER is unflattering also at 18.4 and an opposing FG% of 52%. None of this is surprising.

I disagree that he played good defense against Boston, I thought he played lousy defense. He left 2-3 feet of daylight between himself and Ray Allen on every screen off the ball that Ray ran him through, we didn't see Childress punished for that because Rondo regularly failed to get Ray the ball on these instances. Childress also had to stand about 3 feet off Pierce whenever Paul had the ball outside of 20 feet because he wasn't quick enough to stay with Paul's drive off the dribble. Then Paul Pierce puts him in the mid-post and low-post and cooks Childress again. Childress is a very poor one-on-one defender. In fairness to him he is a mediocre help defender mainly by the virtue of his length and intelligence. Again none of these flaws are surprising, they've been on display throughout the regular season.

Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #34 on: July 10, 2008, 10:21:18 AM »

Offline papa shuttlesworth

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Nice analysis, Who.

I like Childress for many of the reasons people stated.  He just seems to know how to play and makes the best of his abilities.  I thought he was a decent defender, but I've honestly never watched him for a whole game and may be just thinking of his reputation among TV people.

 

Josh Childress?
« Reply #35 on: July 10, 2008, 11:37:25 PM »

Offline Dchuck

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Obviously, most of us would be happy if Pose' signs on the dotted line. 

On the other hand if he doesn't, how does Josh Childress sound as a replacement?  I'm all for giving Posey the full MLE, but like most of us, only for three, MAYBE four years.  In the event he does sign somewhere else, Childress seems to be a great fit.  Young, athletic, long, great energy, great nose for the ball...did I say young?  Remember, he had a great series against us.  He especially came up with key rebounds against us late in games.  There was even a sigh of relief, when he suffered an injury in game six and his availability for game seven was doubtful. 

Atlanta might have their hands full with trying to keep Josh Smith.  Surely, he is their first priority.  That just might leave Childress expendable.  There have been reports that he MIGHT be available using the MLE.  He is certainly someone that would be worth the MLE for five years.

Understand, by no means do I think he could completely replace Pose' (intangibles that make him a favorable acquisition), but he would be a great option!

Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #36 on: July 10, 2008, 11:49:17 PM »

Offline sk7326

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I hope not

Childress is an awful defender. Not just bad, he's awful. He can't defend either position on the wing. He has awful lateral quickness so regularly gives 3-4 feet of daylight between himself and his man from 20 feet on out. He can't defend the post as a wing and he can't defend players off the ball moving through screens. He is an awful man-to-man defender.

Childress is not just a poor shooter, he's an awful shooter. It's not just that he has no range and can't shoot from the perimeter, he also can't shoot from 15 feet. He shot 40% on jump shots this past season and only took 25% of his shots as jumpers because in fairness (and credit to him) he knows he can't shoot a lick and shouldn't be shooting jumpers.

He's a junkyard dog. He roams the baseline and adds hustle around the rim as an athletic wing. Gets a few offensive rebounds or loose balls, cuts to the rim nicely off the ball, and scores extremely well in the paint.

That's fine but I want role players who play defense and can shoot so the floor is spaced for Pierce, Ray, KG and Rondo ... especially the C's 6th man and backup wing.

Childress is ridiculously overrated

Josh Childress has crappy form ... it also works ... 

He only took 60 threes this year in 76 games.  But he made them at a pretty [dang] good 36.7% clip, which lines up with the rest of his career.  So if awful = 36% from three point land, sign me up.

The truest test of shooting, foul shots .. Childress shoots a non awful 79.9%, including 80.7% last year. 

I am sure you think Shawn Marion is an awful shooter too ... substance != form.

And taking good shots is a skill.

Posey is a more prolific, more confident 3 point shooter, but his career percentage is 35%.  Childress is not a space the floor "shooter", but he can make it.  He is 26, his per minute stats are MUCH better than Posey all around.  Now I prefer Posey to come back because he DOES fit this team, while Childress merely COULD fit this team well.  Familiarity and a good player.  But Childress is certainly a good player.

Re: Josh Childress as an Option or Will the Hawks Match?
« Reply #37 on: July 11, 2008, 12:55:53 AM »

Offline jimmyt

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Aside from the NBA Playoffs, I find it hard to believe that anyone on this site has seen a whole lot of Childress' game, including myself. He played great against us in the playoffs and adds a lot of hustle off the bench. Hes a great energy guy and would take the load off pierce and allen in certain games. He's not a Maggette like scorer but he definitely can fill some needs. I'm not saying that he should be our first option, but if we can't get posey, I think it might be worth a shot.

Again, everyone has their own opinion on every player. It's hard to predict how a player will perform on a completely different team. There were a lot of people who didnt think KG Pierce and Allen would play well together, but we know how that turned out. Also, for all the people out there saying how poor a defender he is, Pierce and Allen weren't great defenders until this year but they bought into the defense wins championships theory. I'm pretty sure if the entire team preaches defense then Childress' defensive effort and production will grow.

I love Posey, but it is extremely important that we dont overpay for this guy or give him too many years. I dont see us as contenders two seasons after this upcoming season so having Posey during those extra years will really eat up much needed cap space. If we could sign Posey for 3 years that would be amazing, but it just wont happen.