Top Ten Celtic Players of All Time

[Celtic_E]

Hey guys, this is my first time to post an original topic so go easy on me at least on this one

I'm sure this topic has been long debated and probably posted before but I just came across this column from a newspaper website today so I guess this topic deserves a thread of its own. Anyway, the topic of the column is about the top ten greatest Celtic players of all time and the author lists his personal top ten. Here's an excerpt from the column:

10. Tiny Archibald. This was a rather complicated choice, since Archibald joined the Celtics late in the day, at the downswing of his career. He did, however, win a title in the 1980-81 season, alongside a young turk named Larry Bird. Archibald became the first and only player to lead the NBA in scoring and assists before playing for Boston, and, like Pete Maravich, became a Celtic more as a support player, but was great, nonetheless.

9.Dave Cowens. Tough call here. I had a hard time choosing between Cowens and Robert Parish. But Cowens gets the  nod because of the sheer intensity with which he played the game. The 6-9 left-hander played 10 of his 11 NBA seasons with the Celtics, holding his own against the giants of his time, including Wilt Chamberlain and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. He led the Celtics to two titles (1974 and 1976) and also earned one MVP from his peers. When you hear the expression “I would run through a wall for a loose ball,” that was Dave Cowens.

8. Kevin McHale. I seriously couldn’t put McHale ahead of some of the Celtics from the 1960’s but he was definitely the toughest match-up of his day. With long arms and a variety of moves, he carried the Celtics on the rare time when Bird was not really performing, or incapacitated. McHale won with Bird and couldn’t win without him, but was a unique talent, one of the few of his day who could truly play in the low post. But I couldn’t put him any higher, because, even at the end of his career, Bird, his own teammate, felt that he could have been even better.

7. Sam Jones. The bank is open. An automatic two points, off the glass. Jones was a class act on the fastbreak, and worked tirelessly around the basket. When you talk of Bill Russell starting the fastbreaks and Cousy running them in the early days, Jones was finishing them. And winning.

6. Kevin Garnett. An outstanding all-around talent who has had the misfortune of mediocre teammates or mediocre coaching.  Garnett only became a Celtic this year, and that’s not his fault. But that’s also the reason why I can’t place him any higher. If he wins a ring, he just might crack my top five. But that would be difficult, if you read on.

5. Dennis Johnson. When Larry Bird calls you the greatest teammate he’s ever had, that means something. Johnson, who died of a heart attack in February, 2007 at the age of 52, was a six-time member of the NBA All-Defensive Team, and won titles with the Celtics in 1984 and 1986, relentlessly hounding Magic Johnson when the Lakers and Celtics would meet. WhenBird famously stole Isiah Thomas’ inbound pass with five ticks left in Game Five of the 1987 Eastern Conference Finals, Johnson was the one streaking to the basket for the winning lay-up. He was always in the right place, at the right time: in your face.

4. John Havlicek. He would have started on any other team in the NBA, and defined the sixth man for generations to come. Havlicek never tired, and with his phenomenal resting heart rate of 48, would run you into the ground in the fourth quarter as hard as he would in the first. Many sportswriters would have Hondo start on their all-time Celtic teams, and why not? For me, one more significant note is that Havlicek was a youngster in the Auerbach-Russell dynasty, and played his last season in Bird’s rookie year. Just like a sixth man, he bridged the gap perfectly.

3. Bob Cousy. Underrated, unknown, pioneering. The typical Celtic, and to think Red Auerbach didn’t want the flashy Holy Cross kid he picked out of a hat. Cooz dazzled fans and was still fundamentally sound. He had a nose for the ball, and would find a way to get you the ball, or get to the hole. He and Russell were the bookends of the Celtic fastbreak. He was quick, smart, and ahead of his time. He had an arsenal that people underrestimated, from running hooks to no-look passes and changes of pace he knew when to use.

2. Larry Bird. Very few players define their sport for a generation, and Bird and Magic did just that. Coming out of the dark ages when the NBA was considered too black and drug-infested in the late 1970’s, Bird brought a shot in the arm, and a will that overpowered. He refused to lose, even when he was tired, in pain, had a broken finger or bad back. He called himself out – and his team – when they played poorly. And people said he was slow, white and couldn’t jump. But he was consistently in the top 10 in scoring and rebounds, and sometimes assists. He would tell you what he was going to do to beat you, and yet you couldn’t stop him anyway. Probably has the greatest mental toughness of any player of his era.

1. Bill Russell. I personlly don’t think anyone will ever displace Russ as the greatest Celtic player of all time. He defined Celtic basketball from that generation onward. Eleven championship rings, including the historic eight in a row. Countless changed shots, immeasaurable intimidation, among other milestones. Just when the Lakers seemed on the brink of a championship breakthrough,  Auerbach makes Russell the first African-American player-coach in NBA history, and he responds by promptly delivering another title to Boston. And we haven’t even begun to talk about his defense, not only blocking shots, but keeping the ball in play to spark the trademark Celtic fastbreak. Tragically, the league did not keep track of blocked shots in Russell’s first years, so we will never fully be able to measure the bearded lion’s greatness on that end of the floor.

He has a pretty good list but the bone I have to pick on here is the addition of Kevin Garnett on the no. 6 spot. Don't get me wrong, I love KG but adding him to this list at a very early stage is an insult to some of the other great Celtic legends. I feel that the Chief Robert Parish also deserves some love here because after all, he was a part of the original Big 3. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this one.

BTW, here's the link for the entire column:
http://www.philstar.com/index.php?Sports&p=49&type=2&sec=30&aid=20080613141

[screwedupmaniac]

as far as i'm concerned, it's an injustice for KG to be up there without paul pierce even cracking the top 10, let alone top 5, which is where he should be. when you have celtics greats calling him possibly the most versatile and prolific scorer the C's have ever had, and you see him playing D and O the way he has been this season especially, there's no way he's NOT top 5. the guy gets better every year.

[celticmaestro]

welcome aboard, celtic_e good to have you.

tp for the post too, this topic is often talked about here and the whole bird/russell debate raves on and on as they're widely considered to be the top 2. the problem with a top 10 celtics of all time discussion is, there are so many! a lovely problem to have indeed.

as for me, i disagree with putting kevin garnett ahead of paul pierce. not after everything our captain has given us throughout his career.

[RockinRyA]

philstar is a local newspaper.. bill velasco is a joke.. really makes stuff out.. i remember him proposing "the rectangle offense" just plain stupid

the other sports writer for the paper is good though, joaquin henson who incidentaly covering the nba finals for us here (knows his basketball, not too much nba though)

[Roy Hobbs]

1. Russell
2. Bird
------------
3. Havlicek
4. Cousy
5. Cowens
6. McHale
------------
7. Pierce
8. Sam Jones
9. Heinsohn
10t. Parish
10t. Sharman

The first two are clear.  I think the second tier can be arranged in any order, and the third tier is a little subjective.

I think a player needs to play at least five seasons here to be considered one of the greatest Celts ever.  Great players who just missed the cut: D.J., Tiny, Macauley, JoJo, Reggie.

As for the original list, anybody who has Dave Cowens as the ninth best Celtic of all time, and leaves Pierce off his list completely, doesn't know what he's talking about.  While I love D.J., he wasn't nearly as good a player as Cowens or Pierce.  He was an extremely important piece to our championship squads, but he just wasn't on the same level as some of the other Celtics greats.

[RockinRyA]

really, bill velasco?  seems were having trouble with mediamen named bill

[TrueGreen]

Cooz needs to be in the first group.

[TerreHaute]

I would definitely take out Archibald and DJ. I would put Pierce on the list considering he gets one more win this season. I don't know who I would put on for the other spot. Parish, KC Jones, Jo Jo White, Cornbread, Sharman. Just too many to choose from.

[EarthBall]

4. John Havlicek. He would have started on any other team in the NBA, and defined the sixth man for generations to come. Havlicek never tired, and with his phenomenal resting heart rate of 48, would run you into the ground in the fourth quarter as hard as he would in the first. Many sportswriters would have Hondo start on their all-time Celtic teams, and why not? For me, one more significant note is that Havlicek was a youngster in the Auerbach-Russell dynasty, and played his last season in Bird’s rookie year. Just like a sixth man, he bridged the gap perfectly.

Correct me if I am wrong, but didn't Havlicek retire the season before Bird's rookie year???

[RockinRyA]

i mean, really.. tommy isnt there? second most championships and hes not even there?

[Roy Hobbs]

Cooz needs to be in the first group.

I disagree.  Bird and Russell stand head and shoulders above all the rest.  You can make an argument that Havlicek was a better all-around player than Cousy, but nobody can reasonably argue that any of those in the second tier were better than Bird or Russell.  Cousy revolutionized the point guard position, and was the best point guard of his era, but he doesn't belong in a discussion with Russell and Bird.

[35Reggie]

i mean, really.. tommy isnt there? second most championships and hes not even there?

It's a tough list to compile because there are simply too many choices.  However, not only should Pierce be there but his all around game could potentially land him in that first group by the time he retires.

[Onslaught]

If we win some championships with them and they play 3-5 years with us do you think they would retire Ray and KG's numbers? I'm thinking no just because they didn't play with us long enough. And for that reason I also feel that KG shouldn't be on this list.

[BigDanz2000]

Earthball-- You are indeed correct my friend, Havlicek ended his career at the end of the 77-78 season.  Looks like a certain sports writer is trying to look smarter than he is by throwing out incorrect facts.  Then take those incorrect facts and making something up to make him look even smarter.

What a shame.

I get all my celtics news right here at celticsblog, I mean in all honestly is there anything more reliable?

[Roy Hobbs]

If we win some championships with them and they play 3-5 years with us do you think they would retire Ray and KG's numbers? I'm thinking no just because they didn't play with us long enough. And for that reason I also feel that KG shouldn't be on this list.

I'd say five year minimum and at least one championship for KG and Ray.  I suppose if we win something ridiculous like three titles in four years, you maybe amend that standard.

KG, I think, will ultimately have his number retired, because I see him sticking around awhile.  Ray, I don't see, because I think he'll move on.