KG and the 86 Team

[ZoSo]

Would KG be on the floor in the last five minutes of a big game if he were on the 1986 team instead of Bill Walton?

If you don’t want to read the rest of my post, it all boils down to that question. If you do, then here it is.

The reason any good playoff team succeeds is simple, they get stops on one end and score at the other.  The 1986 team was great at both. The reason they were great at getting buckets was not just that the Big Three were big, but that they dominated the paint. Mssrs 00, 32, and 33 all scored buckets in the paint when the game was on the line (and even when they didn’t they took shots in the paint).

For the most part, this is not true for KG. KG does not take it upon himself to takeover important games down the stretch, especially in the paint (not a criticism, but still true as a general proposition).

Which led me to wonder whether KC Jones would have even put KG on the court in the last five minutes of close games?

It seems like a ridiculous question.

KG is a defender for the ages, and a great passer.

But exactly who would KG replace on the floor?

 I say no way to Bird and McHale.  Other than MJ, Bird and McHale were probably the two most unstoppable scorers in the NBA.

So the only possibility is Parish. It’s possible KG could have been used instead of the Chief, as KC often went with Walton instead of Parish down the stretch. But keep in mind that Walton might have been an even more impressive post player than Parish. You don’t get that if you replace Parish with KG.

So, again, I’m just not sure KC puts KG on the court in the last five minutes of the fourth quarter of a close game in 1986.

Something to think about next time Cornbread tells us that KG is the best Celtic since Russell…

[Who]

I likely would not play him ahead of the other frontcourt players. Like yourself I wouldn't consider sitting McHale or Bird. That leaves Walton or Parish and I'd also rather their interior play. I'd consider playing KG as a guard on that team though.

Do you think KG's style of play would be any different if he had played with guys like McHale, Bird, Parish, Walton early in his career? I do

[Redz]

He sure would have been sweet to have off the bench though!

[CelticsPrideKG]

Different game back then, hard to even picture that situation for me.

[BballTim]

Would KG be on the floor in the last five minutes of a big game if he were on the 1986 team instead of Bill Walton?

If you don’t want to read the rest of my post, it all boils down to that question. If you do, then here it is.

The reason any good playoff team succeeds is simple, they get stops on one end and score at the other.  The 1986 team was great at both. The reason they were great at getting buckets was not just that the Big Three were big, but that they dominated the paint. Mssrs 00, 32, and 33 all scored buckets in the paint when the game was on the line (and even when they didn’t they took shots in the paint).

  I don't think that this is really the case. Bird took a ton of jumpers with games on the line.

[ZoSo]

Do you think KG's style of play would be any different if he had played with guys like McHale, Bird, Parish, Walton early in his career? I do

Good question.

Perhaps, like someone else responded, because of the different era, KG would have developed post moves he had more confidence in using...

[ZoSo]

The reason any good playoff team succeeds is simple, they get stops on one end and score at the other.  The 1986 team was great at both. The reason they were great at getting buckets was not just that the Big Three were big, but that they dominated the paint. Mssrs 00, 32, and 33 all scored buckets in the paint when the game was on the line (and even when they didn’t they took shots in the paint).

  I don't think that this is really the case. Bird took a ton of jumpers with games on the line.

You may want to consult the recently released 1986 championship DVDs--all six games from start to finish....

[ram]

You are suggesting putting another HOF player on the best team ever.

If KG was on the 1986 team along with Bird, McHale, Parish, Walton and Wedman, there would never have been any "down the stretch" games.

Imagine a 2nd unit front line of HOFs Walton & KG plus All-Star Wedman. Or a high-low game with KG and McHale.

 

[BballTim]

The reason any good playoff team succeeds is simple, they get stops on one end and score at the other.  The 1986 team was great at both. The reason they were great at getting buckets was not just that the Big Three were big, but that they dominated the paint. Mssrs 00, 32, and 33 all scored buckets in the paint when the game was on the line (and even when they didn’t they took shots in the paint).

  I don't think that this is really the case. Bird took a ton of jumpers with games on the line.

You may want to consult the recently released 1986 championship DVDs--all six games from start to finish....

  You may want to specify that you're only talking about the finals when you're only talking about the finals. And, no, I'm not going to re-watch 6 games from the 80s from start to finish just to respond to a post designed to cast KG in a bad light. The main reason that he doesn't make that lineup is that McHale (the only guy that really plays the same position as KG of the three) was A) one of the best post players of all time, B) the best defensive PF of his era, and C) in the height of his prime. Just checking the scores on basketballreference, though, there were only 2 really close games and we went 1-1 in those games. Doesn't say much for your argument..

[ZoSo]

The reason any good playoff team succeeds is simple, they get stops on one end and score at the other.  The 1986 team was great at both. The reason they were great at getting buckets was not just that the Big Three were big, but that they dominated the paint. Mssrs 00, 32, and 33 all scored buckets in the paint when the game was on the line (and even when they didn’t they took shots in the paint).

  I don't think that this is really the case. Bird took a ton of jumpers with games on the line.

You may want to consult the recently released 1986 championship DVDs--all six games from start to finish....

  You may want to specify that you're only talking about the finals when you're only talking about the finals. And, no, I'm not going to re-watch 6 games from the 80s from start to finish just to respond to a post designed to cast KG in a bad light. The main reason that he doesn't make that lineup is that McHale (the only guy that really plays the same position as KG of the three) was A) one of the best post players of all time, B) the best defensive PF of his era, and C) in the height of his prime. Just checking the scores on basketballreference, though, there were only 2 really close games and we went 1-1 in those games. Doesn't say much for your argument..

If you don't have a memory, independent of video confirmation, that the Celtics pounded the ball into Bird, McHale, and Parish during crunch time, the conversation isn't worth having.

Parish by himself probably averaged 2 shots per game in crunch time of close playoff games from 84-86, and he was the third option among the Big three.

[ZoSo]

You are suggesting putting another HOF player on the best team ever.

No, replacing Walton with KG

[BballTim]

The reason any good playoff team succeeds is simple, they get stops on one end and score at the other.  The 1986 team was great at both. The reason they were great at getting buckets was not just that the Big Three were big, but that they dominated the paint. Mssrs 00, 32, and 33 all scored buckets in the paint when the game was on the line (and even when they didn’t they took shots in the paint).

  I don't think that this is really the case. Bird took a ton of jumpers with games on the line.

You may want to consult the recently released 1986 championship DVDs--all six games from start to finish....

  You may want to specify that you're only talking about the finals when you're only talking about the finals. And, no, I'm not going to re-watch 6 games from the 80s from start to finish just to respond to a post designed to cast KG in a bad light. The main reason that he doesn't make that lineup is that McHale (the only guy that really plays the same position as KG of the three) was A) one of the best post players of all time, B) the best defensive PF of his era, and C) in the height of his prime. Just checking the scores on basketballreference, though, there were only 2 really close games and we went 1-1 in those games. Doesn't say much for your argument..

If you don't have a memory, independent of video confirmation, that the Celtics pounded the ball into Bird, McHale, and Parish during crunch time, the conversation isn't worth having.

Parish by himself probably averaged 2 shots per game in crunch time of close playoff games from 84-86, and he was the third option among the Big three.

  And if you don't have a memory of Bird hitting plenty of jumpers from outside the paint in close playoff games I'd wonder if you followed the team at the time.

[Kuberski33]

You are suggesting putting another HOF player on the best team ever.

Without having the chance to watch the Russell era teams on a night in night out basis, I don't think you can accurately declare the 86 team the best team ever. 

On the KG question, depends on the coach.  If Doc were coaching those guys, KG would have been on the floor in some of the games.  With KC Jones -- no.  The thing to remember is McHale was in his prime then and was one of the best big man defenders in the NBA-- maybe the best. As good as KG is, for the low post game McHale gives you, no way you make that swap.  And since you already have a great defending 4 out there, no need for another one over The Chief who could guard any center in the league.

[celticmaestro]

Different game back then, hard to even picture that situation for me.

yeah i can't really compare it either.

it is what it is

[Celtics17]

First of all, let me preface this by saying I watched most of the 86 team in the playoffs and am a huge fan of that team. Mchale, Parrish, and Walton would wreak havoc on any team in the nba today much more so then they did then. That being said, I still think in the last 5 minutes of a tight game, if KG was also on the team then he would be in there. Parish or Walton would sit while Kevin moved over to the center position and KG would allow a more flexible offense and a much more effective and flexible defense.