Changing your opinion on Doc Rivers (revisited)

[nickagneta]

Okay, I know this is a big if, it takes into consideration a lot of hypothetical variables but play along, please.

Let's say that the Boston Celtics in two weeks or less are the new NBA Champions. If Doc Rivers is perceived by many to have outcoached Phil Jackson or at least coached Phil Jackson to a stand still, does this change your opinion on Doc Rivers? And by that I mean in any way possible.

Do you revisit you opinion on his coaching abilities?

Do you revisit your opinion on whether he was the right man for the job?

Do you revisit your opinion on whether he is the right coach going forward?

Or did the Celtics win despite Doc and any organism with the IQ higher than a sponge could have coached this team to a world title?

I'm interested to know.


My position, as most of you know is that I support Doc Rivers as long as he is our coach. On the good side, I think he does some wonderful coaching away from the court and handles the pressure of the press well. He seems to have a good handle on developing young talent. His players come to play every game no matter the talent level.

On the other hand, his substitutions can be maddening as he seems to go by a Grady Little hunch type of mentality sometimes. He doesn't have the best offensive scheme. I hate his last second iso plays with a freaking passion. His rotations, though making more sense as the playoffs go on seemingly being  tighter and more thought out, are usually very questionable.

He has definitely been a work in progress as a playoff coach and as I said has made strides forward. But my opinion is still going to be the same. I think he was a great choice for what this team needed and overall did a very, very good job. Perhaps not great, but definitely very, very good. He would have done a great job if the Celts hadn't taken 8 losses to get to the Finals.

[Roy Hobbs]

Talk to me in two weeks.

I'm happier with Doc now than I was two weeks ago.  I've been pretty positive about his off-the-court attributes this season, but towards the end of the Cleveland series and throughout much of the Detroit series, he was better.  If he shows continued improvement, I'm open to further readjusting my opinion.  On the other hand, if he makes poor decisions, but we win in spite of them, I'm sure my opinion will remain pretty consistent with what it is now.

[connerhenry43]

i am not a huge doc fan, but will admit he is a much better coach this year than last year (duh). it is tough to be the kind of guy to win with young players like in 2006-2007, and I think Doc was the wrong guy for that. with this year's team, i think he is more comfortable and doing a much better job.

i thought doc did a great job in the detorit series, shortening the bench big time in game 5, and inserting posey late in the fourth to guard hamilton. still worried about how they strggledf against that trap, and wonder if we will see that style in this series and i still wonder why cassell plays, but i think doc has improved.

[Redz]

Talk to me in two weeks.

Two weeks?  Will a Celts sweep take that long?

[Roy Hobbs]

Talk to me in two weeks.

Two weeks?  Will a Celts sweep take that long?

Post-sweep celebratory hangover.

[imsointoyou]

Folks:

If you don't appreciate Doc with 60 plus wins, the NBA Finals, and establishing defensive presence in Boston, somebody surely will!

I know it's hard to please C fans (ask Bill Fitch and Pitino), but the good thing is that when love, you love with everything you got.

Go C's.  Go Doc, I'm proud of you.  Many franchises would be oh so lucky to have you.

KC Cristian
<edit - no linking to private blogs without prior permission>

[Redz]

Talk to me in two weeks.

Two weeks?  Will a Celts sweep take that long?

Post-sweep celebratory hangover.

Thanks for clarifying.  For a moment I thought your confidence was waning.

[ibby]

I was curious about this as well. I was one of the most anti Doc people I know.  But now, well I don't know.  I know we give Thibodeau a lot of credit, but Rivers must have done something right.  I'm now not sure what to think about him.

[fairweatherfan]

Talk to me in two weeks.

I'm happier with Doc now than I was two weeks ago.  I've been pretty positive about his off-the-court attributes this season, but towards the end of the Cleveland series and throughout much of the Detroit series, he was better.  If he shows continued improvement, I'm open to further readjusting my opinion.  On the other hand, if he makes poor decisions, but we win in spite of them, I'm sure my opinion will remain pretty consistent with what it is now.

TP to Roy for predicting the exact date (2 weeks from June 3rd) that we'd win the title.  I agree, Doc (and the team in general) was very, very shaky for the first 13 games of the series.  Afterward, both the players and Doc began to put things together and play like the 66 win team we saw all year.  I am beginning to buy Danny's reasoning prior to this year that Doc is a young coach who's still learning how to excel in the league.  We tend to expect coaches to be at their best from Day 1, but coaching is a learning process like anything else.  It was painful to go through that learning process with Doc, and it probably isn't over, but at his best he's been a very, very good coach.

[Tr1boy]

Even though i wanted to give a little break because after all we did win it all, he manages to shoot himself in the foot again by saying

"Rookies(giddens and walker) should travel the way every one else travels for the first month.” (he really has something against rookies. Listen doc this aint the army so relax buddy)

I understand not everyone can dress but everyone on the bench should play every other game or third game 2 or 3 mins. Giddens ,walker or obryant can be sent down, but the ones active should be given a chance to play without being yanked with every little mistake made.

Maybe also if they get some proper taste on the real court they will try harder on practice too

I really wish we could have back a great coach like heinson who would first never make unprofessional comments like the one above, took risks playing the young guys and overall ignited their confidence and play 150 percent.

[celticmaestro]

I've always been a Doc fan, I'm not afraid to admit that and nor am I afraid to defend him when the going gets tough.

[Brickowski]

I've never been a Doc fan and the championship did not alter my views.  He's a mediocre coach whose biggest strength is his personality.  Players like him and are willing to play for him.

The three major contributing factors to banner 17 were Thibodeau's defensive schemes, Garnett's intensity and Pierce's willingness to elevate just about every aspect of his game and become a complete player, not just a scorer.

Rivers' contributions were further down the list, but I will give him credit for "ubuntu," which brought the team together in a positive way.

[guava_wrench]

Even though i wanted to give a little break because after all we did win it all, he manages to shoot himself in the foot again by saying

"Rookies(giddens and walker) should travel the way every one else travels for the first month.” (he really has something against rookies. Listen doc this aint the army so relax buddy)

I understand not everyone can dress but everyone on the bench should play every other game or third game 2 or 3 mins. Giddens ,walker or obryant can be sent down, but the ones active should be given a chance to play without being yanked with every little mistake made.

Maybe also if they get some proper taste on the real court they will try harder on practice too

I really wish we could have back a great coach like heinson who would first never make unprofessional comments like the one above, took risks playing the young guys and overall ignited their confidence and play 150 percent.

I don't think Doc is the one who needs to relax. I think you are.

There's nothing problematic in what Doc said.

[Roy Hobbs]

Yeah, I don't have much of a problem with the "the rookies should travel" comment.  That sounds pretty innocuous.

Playing four bench players at the same time, especially when the bench is struggling?  That bothers me.

[Tr1boy]

Never stated at the same time. But mix it up a little. Put in pruitt sometimes with the 2nd unit or even first unit and see what he can do. He is certainly a better matchup against some pg than house. Same goes for obryant, walker etc.

Doc to me is not smart enough to know which matchups he can capitalize in this way.

That comment is also very negative to a rookie player. Why not rather say "with experience i'm sure giddens will be better". (instead of saying negative comments like "he is below walker right now", "obryant is slow right  now") . In the end those comments make him look like an idiot because he is part of their development too