Author Topic: Doc calling out bloggers  (Read 30076 times)

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Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #75 on: May 30, 2008, 06:07:05 PM »

Offline Yakmanev

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After the way Rivers overused his starters in game 5, I think a Detroit blowout win is quite likely this evening.  I just hope that Rivers has the sense to pull his starters after Detroit goes up by 25 midway through the third quarter.

Overusing the starters in game 5 was the correct decision though, and I'm pretty sure many here feel that way.

The only players that really played more than usual were Rondo and Perk. Perk had an extremely good game, and as for Rondo, people have been making cases that he should be playing 40 minutes every night... so what's a 46 minute night? No big deal.

I agree.  I think Doc needs to find a few extra minutes of rest for both Perk and Rajon, but I'd rather have him ride his starters rather than rely heavily on Sam and BBD. 

This is true if they ride the starters hard tonight and get the win there will be a full week's of rest to have.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #76 on: May 30, 2008, 06:13:13 PM »

Offline Brickowski

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I don't think the point of this thread is to split hairs about whether or not someone is a "blogger."  The clear implication of Rivers' comments is that if you haven't played or coached in the league, you don't have standing to criticize him.  That's just more bull manure from one of the NBA's premier bull manure artists.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #77 on: May 30, 2008, 06:31:37 PM »

Offline Sweet17

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You might think Doc has a point but the truth is the collective wisdom of "common people" is often far greater then that of so called individual "experts"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wisdom_of_Crowds


So I wouldn't sweat it. I think he gives reporters a free pass though. Journalists LOVE to pontificate and fix things they know nothing about. They don't have the benefit of collective wisdom either..

Pete

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #78 on: May 30, 2008, 06:36:29 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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I don't think the point of this thread is to split hairs about whether or not someone is a "blogger."  The clear implication of Rivers' comments is that if you haven't played or coached in the league, you don't have standing to criticize him.  That's just more bull manure from one of the NBA's premier bull manure artists.

He said that his opinions and those of his coaching staff should carry more weight around than those who haven't played or coached and claim they know something about a situation. Nothing wrong with that. You can criticize all you want, but there's no reason why people should take the word of random people who claim to be experts of a situation over people that actually have played and coached the game. I see nothing wrong with that. Also, he started the quote by calling out "some" of the criticism, so he at the same time is allowing some space for criticism that are actually valid. Not all criticism have validity in them, and those are the ones he's alluding to when he laughs at them, and those are the criticisms that people shouldn't listen to.

Sweet17, just because you have a crowd, it doesn't mean that you have a wise crowd. As the article explains, there are some elements that are needed to form one, most importantly there's little "Indipendance" and no "Aggregation", and the crowd is "Too Emotional" among other things.

Also, I don't think he's given reporters a free pass... given, he thinks less of bloggers, but there's that little word "some" used, that once again means that he's including some reporters on his allusions.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 06:47:16 PM by BudweiserCeltic »

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #79 on: May 30, 2008, 07:05:23 PM »

Offline Chris

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Interesting quote from the Herald today:

But then, in so many words, the good Doc did tell his critics to kiss off.

“I like what we’ve done,” he said. “I coach the way I coach. I’ve always laughed at some of the criticism. I was joking with someone the other day, and I said, ‘Answer me this. Why would someone listen to a guy that hasn’t played, he hasn’t coached . . . some of the guys have never even been reporters, they’re bloggers, and not listen to a guy and his whole staff who have played and coached? Now who’s the fool? Me, or the people listening to them?’ ”


Doc really calling out his critics.  Ya know what?...good for him.  We've mostly all criticized him at some point.  He is a professional doing his job, and quite frankly, has his team one win away from the NBA Finals.  He knows he must be doing something right.

I wish he would just call out Simmons...or do an interview with him.  That would be entertaining.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #80 on: May 30, 2008, 07:06:53 PM »

Offline jblaze

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^ Me too. Simmons will probably try to suck up to him, though.  ::)

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #81 on: May 30, 2008, 07:07:31 PM »

Offline Sweet17

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Quote
Sweet17, just because you have a crowd, it doesn't mean that you have a wise crowd. As the article explains, there are some elements that are needed to form one, most importantly there's little "Indipendance" and no "Aggregation", and the crowd is "Too Emotional" among other things.

Agreed. Individual blogs can often get driven the wrong way by influential posters. But i am disputing that validity that "expert" opinion is needed to form a smart conclusion in many fields.

"Also, I don't think he's given reporters a free pass... given, he thinks less of bloggers"

I think that's a mistake. Some reporters like Bill Simmons were much harder on him then bloggers who had varied opinions about his performance. In general I think bloggers are a bit more in touch then alot of journalists who seem to get very little out of their access even if they have it.. Personally I don't think guys like Bob Ryan who bashes the Pats really are writing from position of access..

Pete

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #82 on: May 30, 2008, 07:16:56 PM »

Offline RebusRankin

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Doc's comments are like Dubyah saying you shouldn't criticise foreign policy unless you've been President or Secretary of State.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #83 on: May 30, 2008, 07:20:30 PM »

Offline BudweiserCeltic

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Quote
Sweet17, just because you have a crowd, it doesn't mean that you have a wise crowd. As the article explains, there are some elements that are needed to form one, most importantly there's little "Indipendance" and no "Aggregation", and the crowd is "Too Emotional" among other things.

Agreed. Individual blogs can often get driven the wrong way by influential posters. But i am disputing that validity that "expert" opinion is needed to form a smart conclusion in many fields.

"Also, I don't think he's given reporters a free pass... given, he thinks less of bloggers"

I think that's a mistake. Some reporters like Bill Simmons were much harder on him then bloggers who had varied opinions about his performance. In general I think bloggers are a bit more in touch then alot of journalists who seem to get very little out of their access even if they have it.. Personally I don't think guys like Bob Ryan who bashes the Pats really are writing from position of access..

Pete

Yep, you have some truth in here... but can you fault a guy who is an expert for being dumbfounded on how people with less credibility (by default) get listened to over some expert's opinion (himself)?

Also, I have to point out the fact of him using the word "some"... he's mostly alluding to unwarranted and unvalid criticisms (as he sees it) that get overblown over and over by the media, blogs, etc.  That's what he's alluding to.

And although there are some great blogs out there, there's simply too many crappy blogs around you know. Just as there are crappy reporters, journalists, etc. there are much more bloggers around that are worth crap, and blogs like the one here in CelticsBlog are a real minority in regards to knowledge of the game, etc. So, if anything, blame all those blogging wannabes instead of Doc for doing a generalization (wether he be right or wrong for doing so) because truth of the matter is that good opinions and criticisms are hard to come by and often are buried by all the crap that surrounds it.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #84 on: May 30, 2008, 07:29:08 PM »

Offline vinnie

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Doc has taken 20 games thus far to get to game 6 of the ECF.  Phil took 15 games and the Lakers are at home resting.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #85 on: May 30, 2008, 07:47:18 PM »

Offline Andy Jick

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well, at least this thread is teaching us that danny has a short-list for doc's replacement since we have so many basketball coaching experts here...

i bet it would be a little different in the cyberworld of opinions if people didn't have the opportunity to hide behind a username and bloat themselves up about their basketball playing and coaching experiences that aren't probably anything close to the truth. :)
"It was easier to know it than to explain why I know it."

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #86 on: May 30, 2008, 08:04:11 PM »

Offline Triboy16

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doc is a moron. i bet you to get some answers on the court all he does is visit celticsblog and read us criticize his face

i'am happy doug collins got hired with chicago and dantoni with new york. I doubt phoenix will totally change their ways of play and hire a guy like thibadeau.

our real coach to me is thibadeau

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #87 on: May 30, 2008, 08:50:53 PM »

Offline Casperian

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Well, imo, we`re experiencing the old conflict of insight vs. overviewing (right term? bare with me)

Doc is the insight. He knows much more about any detail concerning the team and ultimately his job than anyone else. But this also means he is caught in his job, his life as a NBA coach. He looks from the inside out.

The Blogs are the voice of the bystanders, the people who can only see the whole appearance. It´s much easier for us to come to absolute conclusions, especially about the general direction things take. But we don´t have enough insight to rightfully point to a reason for this direction. We´re looking from the outside in.

An example:

I earn my money with music. Let´s say I write a song which I love, I`m convinced, I know I did a great job, study it with my band and play it at a concert. The people hate it, and they start to feel annoyed and some people even boo me.

Who`s right? Me, who actually wrote this song and is convinced it´s the best thing I´ve ever done, who spent his life to master the art of songwriting? Or the people, although most of them can`t play a music instrument?

I can`t tell you. All I know is that if I continue to turn the people off, I won´t play any concerts at all in the future. Although I might be completely right and wrote a brilliant song, I have to listen to the people. I am the one who has to change, cause they won`t, they only judge, and it won`t help me to criticize the people for judging me. In fact, it is a big part of my job to listen to exactly these people and to take their opinion into consideration. If I stop doing this, I´m bound to fail.

Another example, a different angle:

I am a big movie fan. 5 years ago, I had to listen to all kinds of people from the industry (critics, directors, actors, producers, journalists, etc). It was the only way to inform myself about new movies, and to find out which movie I want to see and which not. There were a lot of good movies I´ve missed, and I saw even more crappy movies. For whatever reason (PR, personal agendas, bias), I couldn`t trust the information I had.

Nowadays, I go to IMDB.com (I hope it´s ok to mention it here).
Tons of people feel the need to post reviews about the movies they have seen. Although some think one movie is excellent, and others think the same movie is boring and makes no sense, I just have to read enough reviews and I pretty accurately know what to expect. I can honestly say that the quality of the time I´ve spent on movies increased dramatically since I visit this site.

Do the guys who post their reviews there know more about movies than the guy who directed it? I don`t think so, but I trust their opinion a lot more, and I have good reasons to do so...
In the summer of 2017, I predicted this team would not win a championship for the next 10 years.

3 down, 7 to go.

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #88 on: May 30, 2008, 08:57:50 PM »

Offline ma11l

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Doc has taken 20 games thus far to get to game 6 of the ECF.  Phil took 15 games and the Lakers are at home resting.


3 coaches are left coaching.  Doc is one of them.  I'm happy with that result.
"Take this down," said O'Neal. "My name is Shaquille O'Neal and Paul Pierce is the (expletive) truth. Quote me on that and don't take nothing out. I knew he could play, but I didn't know he could play like this. Paul Pierce is the truth."

Re: Doc calling out bloggers
« Reply #89 on: May 30, 2008, 09:11:49 PM »

Offline Eja117

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Doc has taken 20 games thus far to get to game 6 of the ECF.  Phil took 15 games and the Lakers are at home resting.


3 coaches are left coaching.  Doc is one of them.  I'm happy with that result.

he should be one of the ones left. He had the most talent