Author Topic: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season  (Read 3040 times)

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Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #15 on: Yesterday at 10:08:07 AM »

Offline dannyboy35

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #16 on: Yesterday at 04:20:11 PM »

Offline Boston Garden Leprechaun

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

amen brother. could not agree more. i may watch some but they will be at the bottom of my priority list for hobbies.
FIRE JOE NOW!

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #17 on: Yesterday at 05:09:02 PM »

Offline Boston Garden Leprechaun

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i'd give us a D+ like orlando

Yeah, C- seems generous.

An F would be acceptable. I'd go D- next.

How does that off-season get a C grade? Nuts!

u might be right. i was being generous. it might be a D- or an F!
FIRE JOE NOW!

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #18 on: Yesterday at 06:43:02 PM »

Offline Silas

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

amen brother. could not agree more. i may watch some but they will be at the bottom of my priority list for hobbies.

I support and follow/watch the Celtics come hell or high water.....Check out the definition below that AI gave me.

A fair-weather fan is a sports spectator or enthusiast who only supports or pays attention to a team when they are winning and performing well. The term draws a direct analogy to "fair weather," meaning these individuals are highly enthusiastic during trouble-free, successful times but quickly lose interest, stop watching, or stop cheering when the team faces adversity. 

I'm looking forward to this upcoming season.  We may not get #19 but it should be fun watching are young guys grow and to see what PG13 has left in the tank....Go Celtics!
I've lived through some terrible things in my life, some of which actually happened.   -  Mark Twain

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #19 on: Yesterday at 07:41:48 PM »

Online Roy H.

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

amen brother. could not agree more. i may watch some but they will be at the bottom of my priority list for hobbies.

I support and follow/watch the Celtics come hell or high water.....Check out the definition below that AI gave me.

A fair-weather fan is a sports spectator or enthusiast who only supports or pays attention to a team when they are winning and performing well. The term draws a direct analogy to "fair weather," meaning these individuals are highly enthusiastic during trouble-free, successful times but quickly lose interest, stop watching, or stop cheering when the team faces adversity. 

I'm looking forward to this upcoming season.  We may not get #19 but it should be fun watching are young guys grow and to see what PG13 has left in the tank....Go Celtics!

Except the reason he's not watching isn't because of wins and losses. 
I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER... AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #20 on: Yesterday at 08:11:41 PM »

Offline Silas

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

amen brother. could not agree more. i may watch some but they will be at the bottom of my priority list for hobbies.

I support and follow/watch the Celtics come hell or high water.....Check out the definition below that AI gave me.

A fair-weather fan is a sports spectator or enthusiast who only supports or pays attention to a team when they are winning and performing well. The term draws a direct analogy to "fair weather," meaning these individuals are highly enthusiastic during trouble-free, successful times but quickly lose interest, stop watching, or stop cheering when the team faces adversity. 

I'm looking forward to this upcoming season.  We may not get #19 but it should be fun watching are young guys grow and to see what PG13 has left in the tank....Go Celtics!

Except the reason he's not watching isn't because of wins and losses.

I understand his concern was ownership not wins and losses.  I was making a point using the phrase "fair weather" with respect to individuals that are highly enthusiastic during trouble-free, successful times but quickly lose interest, and stop watching, or stop cheering when the team faces adversity. 
I've lived through some terrible things in my life, some of which actually happened.   -  Mark Twain

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #21 on: Today at 12:56:42 AM »

Offline ozgod

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

amen brother. could not agree more. i may watch some but they will be at the bottom of my priority list for hobbies.

I support and follow/watch the Celtics come hell or high water.....Check out the definition below that AI gave me.

A fair-weather fan is a sports spectator or enthusiast who only supports or pays attention to a team when they are winning and performing well. The term draws a direct analogy to "fair weather," meaning these individuals are highly enthusiastic during trouble-free, successful times but quickly lose interest, stop watching, or stop cheering when the team faces adversity. 

I'm looking forward to this upcoming season.  We may not get #19 but it should be fun watching are young guys grow and to see what PG13 has left in the tank....Go Celtics!

Except the reason he's not watching isn't because of wins and losses.

I understand his concern was ownership not wins and losses.  I was making a point using the phrase "fair weather" with respect to individuals that are highly enthusiastic during trouble-free, successful times but quickly lose interest, and stop watching, or stop cheering when the team faces adversity.

The fun seasons for me tend to be the ones where expectations of the team are very low and they exceed them. Like last season, at least till the playoffs. If you're a championship or bust person where the only thing that matters is the championship or performance in the playoffs yes it sucked, but I loved how they exceeded expectations on the way to the eventual crash. This season is shaping up to be something similar. :police:
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D


Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #22 on: Today at 08:58:13 AM »

Offline celts55

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Agreed. I may watch them if they are on free tv, but I will not pay for league pass again. If the owners aren?t willing to spend money, why should I?
Trading a player like Brown, who not only was an all nba player, but a great community person to save some money makes my stomach hurt.
I may be biased, as Brown is one of my favorites, but getting back a 36 year old and some picks down the road makes no sense to me.
If the plan is to rebuild, why George and Conley? I just don?t understand. Seems like they are wasting some prime Tatum years

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #23 on: Today at 11:10:19 AM »

Offline Goldstar88

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Agreed. I may watch them if they are on free tv, but I will not pay for league pass again. If the owners aren?t willing to spend money, why should I?
Trading a player like Brown, who not only was an all nba player, but a great community person to save some money makes my stomach hurt.
I may be biased, as Brown is one of my favorites, but getting back a 36 year old and some picks down the road makes no sense to me.
If the plan is to rebuild, why George and Conley? I just don?t understand. Seems like they are wasting some prime Tatum years

They didn?t want to pay JB a supermax extension. George will be an expiring contract next year and I?m hoping Brad moves him at the Feb trade deadline. The Celtics will need to bring in another star next year. I can?t imagine Tatum wanting to be here if they don?t. I?m giving Brad till next summer to do something before pulling the cord.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #24 on: Today at 01:00:21 PM »

Online Roy H.

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Agreed. I may watch them if they are on free tv, but I will not pay for league pass again. If the owners aren?t willing to spend money, why should I?
Trading a player like Brown, who not only was an all nba player, but a great community person to save some money makes my stomach hurt.
I may be biased, as Brown is one of my favorites, but getting back a 36 year old and some picks down the road makes no sense to me.
If the plan is to rebuild, why George and Conley? I just don?t understand. Seems like they are wasting some prime Tatum years

They didn?t want to pay JB a supermax extension. George will be an expiring contract next year and I?m hoping Brad moves him at the Feb trade deadline. The Celtics will need to bring in another star next year. I can?t imagine Tatum wanting to be here if they don?t. I?m giving Brad till next summer to do something before pulling the cord.

You're just repeating their spin, though.  JB was under contract for 3 seasons, and played at an all-NBA level.  He was replaced by a significantly worse, older, less durable player.

When a team blows up a contending team because it's worried about paying market rate for a star player, it's pretty fair for a fan to not want to pay for the product.
I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER... AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #25 on: Today at 02:16:13 PM »

Offline Goldstar88

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Agreed. I may watch them if they are on free tv, but I will not pay for league pass again. If the owners aren?t willing to spend money, why should I?
Trading a player like Brown, who not only was an all nba player, but a great community person to save some money makes my stomach hurt.
I may be biased, as Brown is one of my favorites, but getting back a 36 year old and some picks down the road makes no sense to me.
If the plan is to rebuild, why George and Conley? I just don?t understand. Seems like they are wasting some prime Tatum years

They didn?t want to pay JB a supermax extension. George will be an expiring contract next year and I?m hoping Brad moves him at the Feb trade deadline. The Celtics will need to bring in another star next year. I can?t imagine Tatum wanting to be here if they don?t. I?m giving Brad till next summer to do something before pulling the cord.

You're just repeating their spin, though.  JB was under contract for 3 seasons, and played at an all-NBA level.  He was replaced by a significantly worse, older, less durable player.

When a team blows up a contending team because it's worried about paying market rate for a star player, it's pretty fair for a fan to not want to pay for the product.

It does not seem like Brad thought JB was worth $60M per season going forward and he didn?t view the team as a contender. I imagine how the postseason played out did not help matters . No one is saying that George is better than JB and I don?t think anyone expects PG to be here long.

It?s too bad Brad dropped the ball with the Giannis negotiations. That would have made the Celtics contenders.
« Last Edit: Today at 02:25:15 PM by Goldstar88 »
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #26 on: Today at 02:43:13 PM »

Online Roy H.

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Agreed. I may watch them if they are on free tv, but I will not pay for league pass again. If the owners aren?t willing to spend money, why should I?
Trading a player like Brown, who not only was an all nba player, but a great community person to save some money makes my stomach hurt.
I may be biased, as Brown is one of my favorites, but getting back a 36 year old and some picks down the road makes no sense to me.
If the plan is to rebuild, why George and Conley? I just don?t understand. Seems like they are wasting some prime Tatum years

They didn?t want to pay JB a supermax extension. George will be an expiring contract next year and I?m hoping Brad moves him at the Feb trade deadline. The Celtics will need to bring in another star next year. I can?t imagine Tatum wanting to be here if they don?t. I?m giving Brad till next summer to do something before pulling the cord.

You're just repeating their spin, though.  JB was under contract for 3 seasons, and played at an all-NBA level.  He was replaced by a significantly worse, older, less durable player.

When a team blows up a contending team because it's worried about paying market rate for a star player, it's pretty fair for a fan to not want to pay for the product.

It does not seem like Brad thought JB was worth $60M per season going forward and he didn?t view the team as a contender. I imagine how the postseason played out did not help matters . No one is saying that George is better than JB and I don?t think anyone expects PG to be here long.

It?s too bad Brad dropped the ball with the Giannis negotiations. That would have made the Celtics contenders.

The biggest issue is that we sacrificed two years of all NBA production without replacing it during Tatum's prime. It makes no sense to tear down a contender in hopes that we can better allocate money in three years or more.

We would have been a lot better off signing Robinson, adding a veteran voice to the coaching staff, and bringing in a better player than Mike Connolly is at this stage of his career.

That would have improved us in the presence, while seeing some of the other eastern conference contenders all get worse (NYK, Detroit, Philly).  Instead, we took ourselves out of contention, improved Philly, and didn't really improve our financial flexibility over the next two seasons.

I was 100% with you when you advocated for a Giannis trade.  I was fine trading JB for a better fit and a better player, even if he was older and less durable.  But, Brad had three options: 1) give up more than he wanted to for Giannis; 2) keep JB and add Robinson; or 3) make a bad trade.

#3 wasn't the preferred outcome for many fans.  If they want to vote with their eyeballs and dollars, more power to them. This will be the first season in a long time that I haven't gone to a game. Even though I knew the team was predicted to stink last season, I still showed up. That won't happen next season.
« Last Edit: Today at 02:54:12 PM by Roy H. »
I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER... AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!

Re: ESPN grades the Celtics off-season
« Reply #27 on: Today at 03:18:56 PM »

Online jambr380

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  I?m still in a mode where I don?t plan on watching the Celtics next year. I?m an older guy now and I time is precious. I don?t feel the need to spend it watching a team led by a front office and / or owner sitting up there lying to me, knowing that we know they?re lying. Silly political speech like optionally. We are the fans. They exist because WE do.
   I?ll probably change my mind but this is the sorts trade in history and we did it to a player who got finals mvp and who?s # will be retired. It?s one thing to trade him for equal or better return because the team comes first. But this was garbage I choose not to eat. At least for now. ? Optionality? Optionality ? Optionality .. Optionality. Stop Brad. We?re not stupid.

Agreed. I may watch them if they are on free tv, but I will not pay for league pass again. If the owners aren?t willing to spend money, why should I?
Trading a player like Brown, who not only was an all nba player, but a great community person to save some money makes my stomach hurt.
I may be biased, as Brown is one of my favorites, but getting back a 36 year old and some picks down the road makes no sense to me.
If the plan is to rebuild, why George and Conley? I just don?t understand. Seems like they are wasting some prime Tatum years

They didn?t want to pay JB a supermax extension. George will be an expiring contract next year and I?m hoping Brad moves him at the Feb trade deadline. The Celtics will need to bring in another star next year. I can?t imagine Tatum wanting to be here if they don?t. I?m giving Brad till next summer to do something before pulling the cord.

You're just repeating their spin, though.  JB was under contract for 3 seasons, and played at an all-NBA level.  He was replaced by a significantly worse, older, less durable player.

When a team blows up a contending team because it's worried about paying market rate for a star player, it's pretty fair for a fan to not want to pay for the product.

It does not seem like Brad thought JB was worth $60M per season going forward and he didn?t view the team as a contender. I imagine how the postseason played out did not help matters . No one is saying that George is better than JB and I don?t think anyone expects PG to be here long.

It?s too bad Brad dropped the ball with the Giannis negotiations. That would have made the Celtics contenders.

The biggest issue is that we sacrificed two years of all NBA production without replacing it during Tatum's prime. It makes no sense to tear down a contender in hopes that we can better allocate money in three years or more.

We would have been a lot better off signing Robinson, adding a veteran voice to the coaching staff, and bringing in a better player than Mike Connolly is at this stage of his career.

That would have improved us in the presence, while seeing some of the other eastern conference contenders all get worse (NYK, Detroit, Philly).  Instead, we took ourselves out of contention, improved Philly, and didn't really improve our financial flexibility over the next two seasons.

I was 100% with you when you advocated for a Giannis trade.  I was fine trading JB for a better fit and a better player, even if he was older and less durable.  But, Brad had three options: 1) give up more than he wanted to for Giannis; 2) keep JB and add Robinson; or 3) make a bad trade.

#3 wasn't the preferred outcome for many fans.  If they want to vote with their eyeballs and dollars, more power to them. This will be the first season in a long time that I haven't gone to a game. Even though I knew the team was predicted to stink last season, I still showed up. That won't happen next season.

I'm not a massive fan of the trade - not at all - but it's my guess that Brad doesn't think there will be much drop off at all. We can keep saying FMVP or 6th in All-NBA voting, but that's not the level of player Brad or other front offices view Jaylen as.

Maybe everybody is wrong and Jaylen really is that guy who elevates his teams. But with the way analytics have taken over the sport, he's going to be in a prove it situation until his next contract. Lucky for him, he's likely to be in a winning situation.

Anyway, I don't think this about ownership being cheap (George makes the same amount as Jaylen) other than them getting out of the repeater tax. I'll assume they'll be right back in the tax next year with another plan to take this team to the next level. If not, then I think fans have the right to get out their torches and pitchforks.

But right now, I'm just going to assume that Brad wanted out of Jaylen the player and contract at all costs and thinks Paul George will be a reasonable short term replacement. A healthy Paul George is a lot to ask, but he does a number of complementary things that Jaylen just doesn't do. And those seem to be the things Mazzulla really wants his players to do.