Proposed Jaylen Brown Trade Ideas

[perks-a-beast]

How about this one if we absolutely MUST trade Jaylen - which I still prefer not to.

BOS outgoing:
Jaylen Brown
Sam Hauser
Jordan Walsh

BOS incoming:
Toumani Camara
Jrue Holiday
Santi Aldama
Walter Clayton Jr.
2027 1st from MEM (best of MIN, UTA, CLE)
2028 MIL Swap from POR
2031 POR 1st
2033 POR 1st

POR outgoing:
Toumani Camara
Jrue Holiday
Shaedon Sharpe
3 1sts

POR incoming:
Jaylen Brown
Sam Hauser
Jordan Walsh

MEM outgoing:
Santi Aldama
Walter Clayton
1st

MEM incoming:
Shaedon Sharpe

Grizzlies roster is a log jam right now. I think consolidating some of their talent while making a high upside swing on a player like Sharpe makes a ton of sense, especially at a position of need for them.

Portland gives up a lot but get to keep Henderson and Clingan. They get easily the best player in the trade as well as some much needed shooting in Hauser and bench depth in Walsh.

Let?s break it down for Boston.

Toumani Camara. Roughly 4 years/$80m left on his deal. Far from the offensive talent JB is, but has blossomed into one of the best 3 and D guys in the league who can do as good a job as anyone defending the opposing teams best wing every game. I view him as a very good fit next to Tatum.


Jrue Holiday. 2 years/$72m left on his deal. I was stunned when I learned that Cleveland could have traded for Holiday instead of Harden- simply because Jrue has a ton left in the tank, even for a 36 going on 37 year old. He knows the Celtics system and brings needed guard depth. The alternative would be taking on Jerami Grants contract - no thank you.

Santi Aldama. 2 years/$34m left on his deal, with a players option in 27-28.  I have long been a fan of Aldama. Hes kind of like a poor mans KP. 7 feet tall. Average 14/7/3 last season and shot 35% from behind the arc. Not the most physically gifted defender but really tries.

Walter Clayton. Rookie contract. I liked Clayton a lot leading up to the 2025 draft, and I think Brad would have gladly taken him had he fell to Boston. Nice upside swing on a high motor guy.

2027 MEM 1st (most favorable of CLE, MIN, UTA). not the juiciest pick (barring injuries) but another 1st in whata projected to be a deep draft.

2028 MIL Swap. Really good pick since I?m fairly certain MIL will still be awful in 2 years.

2031 and 2033 1sts for POR. JB will be in his mid thirties and who knows where the team will be in 5-7 years time.

Leaves the Celtics with:

PG: Payton Pritchard
SG: Derrick White
SF: Toumani Camara
PF: Jayson Tatum
C: Neemias Queta

Bench
PG: Jrue Holiday
SG: Hugo Gonzalez
SF: Baylor Scheierman
PF: Santi Aldama
C: Luka Garza

Deep bench

PG: Walter Clayton
SG: Ron Harper
SF: Dillon Mitchell
PF: Chris Cenac
C: Amari Williams

Im not saying this is a sexy trade - its definitely not. But if the relationship between JB and the Celtics is irreparable, and other teams know that and use it as leverage, Brad could do a lot worse.  This gives the team much more options moving forward with more tradable contracts and draft capital.

This does not make Boston a title contender next year - I dont think there is a trade out there that does. But I honestly think this trade makes the team better in the future AND potentially makes them better than last years team. If I were Tatum and thinking about my future with the team, I would view a trade like this, which gives the team a real defensive identity- as well as depth- as a step in the right direction.

[Who]

Listening to Brian Robb and Jay King. It was mostly about LaMelo & Trae Young but had a little bit on Jaylen at the end. 2 days old. Not much of interest there but there was 1 interesting point / question.

So Jay King pointed out that BOS felt Jaylen had less trade value than Giannis because they were willing to pay Jaylen & 2 first round picks for Giannis. So he asked, how would you view the offer from Miami minus 2 first round picks for Jaylen?

- Tyler Herro
- K Ware
- Jaime Jaquez
- Kasparas Jakucionis

- 1 first round pick
- 1 pick swap first rounder
- 1 2nd rounder

It was an interesting question.

And an interesting barometer of Jaylen's trade value.

It also seems to line up closer to some of the trade offers (like POR) that we are seeing reported that feel underwhelming. The lack of top tier star equivalent. A sub All-Star, a solid young big, a 6th man, a pick and a low level prospect.

[Celtics2021]

He is owed $70 million over the next two seasons, and that proposal costs $10 million more than JB, bringing the Celtics right up to the tax line

Jaylen Brown cost the next two years is  $57,078,728 and $61,015,192 respectively, and that totals 118,093,920 for the next two years how is that more than Grant's 70 million?  I know there will be other salaries.   But the comment he costs more than Brown is not true.   He makes $34,206,898  next year and has a player option the year after that for $36,413,790.   Then he will be off the books at the end of 2027-28.  Brown at that time still is on the books for more year for $64,951,656 in 2928-29. Then comes off the books at 2029-30.  What math am I missing here?


https://www.spotrac.com/nba/player/_/id/20208/jaylen-brown

https://www.spotrac.com/nba/player/_/id/15391/jerami-grant


I agree J. Grant has been in decline some.   We may have to take what the market is offering if moving him was the goal.  He shot 38.9 from downtown and averaged 18.6 PPG last year.   His rebounding is terrible for a forward at 3.5 PPG.    I think while not ideal, he is still a better player than Wallace was when he came to us.     I do like getting Sharpe who is locked into 20 million for 4 years and who is a 20 PPG who can attack the rim but is only a 33 3p shooter.

I would to get him and trade for Kessler immediately.

I bolded the key words you quoted from me: that proposal.  Grant + Sharpe + Scoot costs $67.8 million next season.  Jaylen costs $57 million.  That is $10 million more, nearly $11 million.  The Celtics are currently a little under $14 million from the tax line, so that trio would vaporize tax space, and all three might be bench players for us.  The Celtics should not take on the same or more long-term money in a deal for vastly lesser players, at the benefit of only two picks. 

The Celtics at a minimum need one of the following three things: a boatload of outright picks, substantial cap and tax relief, or three quality players, two of whom would be capable of starting on this year?s Brownless team and last year?s Tatumless version of this team.  Preferably they would get two of those theee things.  This deal provides zero.

[Vermont Green]

The Celtics at a minimum need one of the following three things: a boatload of outright picks, substantial cap and tax relief, or three quality players, two of whom would be capable of starting on this year's Brownless team and last year's Tatumless version of this team.  Preferably they would get two of those three things.  This deal provides zero.

This all makes sense, you need to get something of value for Brown or why trade him.  Whatever they do has to be better than adding a couple of pieces around Tatum and Brown and running with that.  If the trade is for a bunch of picks, then they need to flip those picks in the short terms to rebuild the team now, not in the future.

The idea of Scoot, Sharpe, Grant, and picks does not do it for me unless they are able to flip these assets and get some starter level players from another team.  That package seems like something MIL would have been interested in but I don't see how it works for BOS.

[Celtics2021]

The Celtics at a minimum need one of the following three things: a boatload of outright picks, substantial cap and tax relief, or three quality players, two of whom would be capable of starting on this year's Brownless team and last year's Tatumless version of this team.  Preferably they would get two of those three things.  This deal provides zero.

The idea of Scoot, Sharpe, Grant, and picks does not do it for me unless they are able to flip these assets and get some starter level players from another team.  That package seems like something MIL would have been interested in but I don't see how it works for BOS.

Despite having just railed against the deal, I think it is defensible with enough picks.  It probably takes about 5 picks for it to reach that status, but there is a threshold.  I look at it like this.  Last year, the Celtics were pretty successful for the first 2/3 of the year (pre-trade deadline) with a starting lineup of White, Pritchard, Brown, random wing, and Queta.  Even if all the players we got from Portland are bench players, as I assert, then the lineup would be White, Pritchard, Tatum, random wing, and Queta.  The bench is largely the same, with a bunch of other random wings buttressed by the Portland wings.  The only substantial change on the bench is Scoot instead of Simons.  Could a former #3 pick in his fourth year approximate what Simons gave to us if he gets healthy?  Not crazy.  Also, Tatum is better than Brown.  Last year?s team was a first-round exit, but could have probably gone further with a better first-round matchup (Toronto, for example, was a 5-seed and we dominated them all year).  This year, probably the same thing.  Not a championship, but not dire.

The Celtics would not need to make an immediate move.  They could, of course, but staying the course would leave the Celtics with a competitive team with upside.  Maybe Sharpe learns how to play basketball instead of just being an athlete.  Maybe it clicks for Scoot and he stays healthy, and the talent them made him the #3 pick shines.  Maybe Hugo takes another large step forward in year 2.  Reloaded with picks, maybe the Celtics can turn Jerami Grant on an expiring contract into whichever star hits the trade market next summer.  Right now the Celtics path forward is narrow.  More immediate (get the right free agent, get a healthy Tatum for a year, and see one young wing out of about 5 take a leap to be a true starter), but narrow.  The Celtics, with enough picks from Portland (in this example, but we can sub in several other teams and wind up in a similar place) are further from immediate contention but have way more possibilities of getting there than the current Celtics.  The Celtics with an insufficient number of picks have fewer avenues, however, while being further in the present to boot.  So that is the needle Brad must thread.

[Who]

I think the draft pick packages Brad is asking for Jaylen is a sign that Jaylen can't get any established star in return that is close to his level. They all downgrades. Considerable downgrades. So Brad is looking at alternative packages.

[Vermont Green]

I get what Celtics2021 is saying above but to me, the question isn't whether or not this year's team is better than last year's team, but rather if the team is better than what the team would be if it is Brown + Tatum.

So I agree that:

[White, Pritchard, Tatum, random wing, and Queta] > [White, Pritchard, Brown, random wing, and Queta]

But is:

[White, Pritchard, Tatum, random wing, and Queta] > [White, Pritchard, Tatum, Brown, and Queta] ?

You can potentially trade Brown and be better for it, or even equal but with some extra draft picks to help down the road.  But I don't want to see the team going backwards at this point in time.  I would rather trade for say Zion and Murphy or something like that to at least have a chance at being better.

Or say:

Lillard, White, Tatum, Camara, Queta, with Sharpe/Scoot added to the bench, or something like that.  I prefer that over 4 future picks and Grant.

[Who]

I would expect Jerami Grant to be the favourite to start at forward alongside Jayson Tatum if that POR does go through. I'd favour him over Hauser.

J Grant is a more dynamic player. He can create offense. He is also a more dynamic defender both in man defense & team defense. His rebounding has dropped off and his passing has always been appalling.

Hauser is more the low usage low mistake high efficiency alternative to J Grant's higher usage higher mistake middling efficiency.

I like what Jerami Grant has the potential to do in terms of making BOS a more aggressive athletic defensive starting unit over Hauser who is a position defender who can't take risks defensively because then he will get eaten alive.

--------------

G: Scoot, Pritchard
G: D White, S Sharpe
F: J Grant, Hauser
F: Tatum, Hugo / J Walsh
C: Queta, (FA)

I'd like to find Shaedon Sharpe a new home in a subsequent trade. I like him but I feel there aren't enough minutes for both him and Scoot with D White and Pritchard already in the backcourt. I think we should choose between the two of them - keep one, trade one. I'd keep Scoot. He is the more well-rounded player.

I am happy enough whichever 1 of the 2 we chose. I just do not think we should keep both. Or if we do keep both, we should trade one of D White or Pritchard to free up backcourt minutes for them.

-------------

Jerami Grant we are largely stuck with. His contract makes him untradeable unless you are giving up assets to move him. No point in giving up assets. Just keep him until his contract expires. His role would be variable. He could be a starter alongside Tatum. Or he could be a key bench bench piece (6th/7th man). Or the young wings (Hugo, J Walsh) could improve enough offensively to push him out of the rotation.

Whatever happens, it is only 2 years until his contract expires. Not long. He will even be a trade asset in that 2nd year with his expiring contract. If combined with those POR picks, we could get a good upgrade in a trade for J Grant in 12-18 months time. 

[Who]

Jrue Holiday. 2 years/$72m left on his deal. I was stunned when I learned that Cleveland could have traded for Holiday instead of Harden- simply because Jrue has a ton left in the tank, even for a 36 going on 37 year old.

I did not hear about that. Man, they blew that decision.

[Vermont Green]

Grant has only averaged about 53 games over the last 5 seasons.  I have not seen many POR games lately so I don't know what is going on with him but it doesn't feel like he will make much of an impact.  If you feel like he can be a solid starter on a playoff team, then maybe it is good to get him.  Maybe Scoot or Sharpe can start also and then you have two starters to replace Brown and "random wing" (as Celtics2021 called it).

I just don't know if that is what we get with Grant.

[Who]

Leaves the Celtics with:

PG: Payton Pritchard
SG: Derrick White
SF: Toumani Camara
PF: Jayson Tatum
C: Neemias Queta

Bench
PG: Jrue Holiday
SG: Hugo Gonzalez
SF: Baylor Scheierman
PF: Santi Aldama
C: Luka Garza

Deep bench

PG: Walter Clayton
SG: Ron Harper
SF: Dillon Mitchell
PF: Chris Cenac
C: Amari Williams

Not really about the trade. I am just looking at that deep bench - the 3rd stringers. Not an established NBA player among. Well, Walter Clayton is somewhat established. The other 4 guys have proven nothing at the NBA player.

We are essentially running a 10/11 man roster and giving 4-5 spots to projects who are completely untrustworthy in terms of giving you decent NBA minutes. And 4 of those 5 guys are likely to be on our roster this year. Although maybe Dillon Mitchell ends up being a two-way rather than a 3rd stringer - or maybe they make him a 3rd stringer in order to keep down team salaries.

[Who]

Grant has only averaged about 53 games over the last 5 seasons.  I have not seen many POR games lately so I don't know what is going on with him but it doesn't feel like he will make much of an impact.  If you feel like he can be a solid starter on a playoff team, then maybe it is good to get him.  Maybe Scoot or Sharpe can start also and then you have two starters to replace Brown and "random wing" (as Celtics2021 called it).

I just don't know if that is what we get with Grant.

I rate Jerami Grant as a high end backup PF/SF.

It is just that our forward rotation would be so bad that he might start here. He only has to beat out Hauser (limited spot up shooter) and the young wings (Hugo, J Walsh) who are both one-way players who cannot play offense yet. So Jerami Grant would have a good chance at starting here.

[Vermont Green]

Jrue Holiday. 2 years/$72m left on his deal. I was stunned when I learned that Cleveland could have traded for Holiday instead of Harden- simply because Jrue has a ton left in the tank, even for a 36 going on 37 year old.

I did not hear about that. Man, they blew that decision.

This begs the question, is:

Holiday > Grant  ?

[slamtheking]

Grant has only averaged about 53 games over the last 5 seasons.  I have not seen many POR games lately so I don't know what is going on with him but it doesn't feel like he will make much of an impact.  If you feel like he can be a solid starter on a playoff team, then maybe it is good to get him.  Maybe Scoot or Sharpe can start also and then you have two starters to replace Brown and "random wing" (as Celtics2021 called it).

I just don't know if that is what we get with Grant.

I rate Jerami Grant as a high end backup PF/SF.

It is just that our forward rotation would be so bad that he might start here. He only has to beat out Hauser (limited spot up shooter) and the young wings (Hugo, J Walsh) who are both one-way players who cannot play offense yet. So Jerami Grant would have a good chance at starting here.

which speaks volumes about how bad that roster would be

[Who]

Grant has only averaged about 53 games over the last 5 seasons.  I have not seen many POR games lately so I don't know what is going on with him but it doesn't feel like he will make much of an impact.  If you feel like he can be a solid starter on a playoff team, then maybe it is good to get him.  Maybe Scoot or Sharpe can start also and then you have two starters to replace Brown and "random wing" (as Celtics2021 called it).

I just don't know if that is what we get with Grant.

I rate Jerami Grant as a high end backup PF/SF.

It is just that our forward rotation would be so bad that he might start here. He only has to beat out Hauser (limited spot up shooter) and the young wings (Hugo, J Walsh) who are both one-way players who cannot play offense yet. So Jerami Grant would have a good chance at starting here.

which speaks volumes about how bad that roster would be

Yup.

(1) Plus how bad last year's roster was without Tatum.

(2) And how bad our supporting cast was in the playoffs around Tatum & Jaylen and why we should instead concentrate on improving that instead of breaking up Jaylen & Tatum.