Double big issue.

[Csfan1984]

I'm not a numbers guy but can we not play double big against teams shooting 36% or better from three? Even better stop running it this year!

Our bigs are slow and lack mobility to get out to cover shooters. Vuc also has to learn the system and is terrible at spacing in our scheme. He doesn't fit double big on offense or defense either as he really wants to stay near the basket.

Cs have become easier to defend and worst defensively. Feel the double big is purposely throwing a wrench into things to get Tatum not to come back at this point. Please stop running it.

[Who]

Agreed -- these bigs cannot play double big. Only in exceptional circumstances. It should not be a regular thing.

All too slow defensively. Garza struggles to keep up with centers nevermind forwards. Vucevic is a slow center nevermind matching up with forwards. Queta is average in terms of quickness / mobility for a center. He shouldn't be defending quicker forwards. None of them defend the perimeter.

Too stagnant offensively. Not enough movement. Garza is an opportunistic scorer as a center. He is more skilled than most centers. He is not more skilled than most forwards. Nor does his skill-level cause as many problems for forwards unlike centers who want to hang back in the paint and rebound / block shots gifting Garza opportunities he gets fewer of at PF. Vucevic is highly skilled for a center. For a forward, his ball-handling + passing + outside shooting are all below average. The only advantage he has is his physical size and post game. To exploit that well, he needs the paint open. Queta clogs the paint and removes the advantage. Offense gets stagnant trying to create it.

Bad offense. Bad defense.

Double big combination is bad. Plain bad.

[Jiri Welsch]

This is the time of the year when teams tinker with their lineups in case certain matchup challenges/opportunities arise in the playoffs.

I agree it doesn?t look great right now, but I also can see a world where it helps stop a run or rebounding disparity in a random series.

[Csfan1984]

This is the time of the year when teams tinker with their lineups in case certain matchup challenges/opportunities arise in the playoffs.

I agree it doesn?t look great right now, but I also can see a world where it helps stop a run or rebounding disparity in a random series.

You shouldn't tinker against divisional opponents who are one game behind you in the standings. Tinker when you have a lead or play against a bad team. Also any person who has watched these players knows they don't fit double big. This would be experimenting for nothing. It's like saying I need to breath to live but what if I tried stopping, can I some how beat the odds and still live?  It's ridiculous.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

It worked pretty well against the Rockets

[Roy H.]

I think part of the issue is that Garza is too limited unless he's got.

[Celtics4ever]

It is all match up dependent, as I see it.  Some nights it may work, others it may not.

I think everyone is correct in that we don't have bigs who are not centers.  None of our bigs is a good switcher on wings or guards.   This is true of all three of them.  Tatum might help if he comes back but we are assuming the lateral speed pre-injury will be there.

[wdleehi]

With three data points now, I think it should be out as a heavily used lineup.   Maybe something to use as a changeup against larger teams, but not starting anymore.   


Hopefully Hauser is back soon and take that spot back. 


Until then, Walsh or Hugo? 

[Csfan1984]

It worked pretty well against the Rockets

Rockets aren't a three point shooting team. They are near the bottom for threes taken.

[Goldstar88]

I hate it. Play Walsh at the 4. He?s such a good defender.

[Neurotic Guy]

I hate it. Play Walsh at the 4. He?s such a good defender.

Love Wash. Right now I think he?s the only underused Celtic.

[ozgod]

This is the time of the year when teams tinker with their lineups in case certain matchup challenges/opportunities arise in the playoffs.

I agree it doesn?t look great right now, but I also can see a world where it helps stop a run or rebounding disparity in a random series.

You shouldn't tinker against divisional opponents who are one game behind you in the standings. Tinker when you have a lead or play against a bad team. Also any person who has watched these players knows they don't fit double big. This would be experimenting for nothing. It's like saying I need to breath to live but what if I tried stopping, can I some how beat the odds and still live?  It's ridiculous.

Actually I would think this would be the best time to tinker, against a team you are pretty sure you will meet in the playoffs. It's a good time to see if something might work, or how they might react to it. Sometimes you will lose the game due to tinkering, but you learn things that will help you in the playoffs, when the cost of losing is much higher.

As for the two-big lineup, I suspect, aside from tinkering, Joe is trying to work out how he can maximize the personnel he now has. He has swapped a wing for a big and  he wants to know how he can use the three bigs he now has at his disposal, without putting an undue burden on the remaining wings he has. Plus the fact that Hauser (one of the wings) wasn't available so he really only had Walsh and Gonzalez to eat up significant minutes at wing on the bench.

Also, Houston, when we first played Garza and Queta in the starting lineup, shoots 37% from 3. Not as good as NYK, and they shoot 9 less 3s a game, but they're decent shooters. I think the team is trying to work out how to be effective defending the perimeter with such a lineup, whether it's Q and Garza, Q and Vuc, or Vuc and Garza. Better to find out now than to have to do it in the playoffs if a wing gets injured and you have no choice.



I get it, it sucks to lose a game, especially against a team that we might be fighting for for the 2nd seed, but I think Joe (along with some other coaches) are less worried in the specific seeding they end up in than in being as prepared as they can with knowledge when they do get into the playoffs. I think Joe wants more data points so he can have access to more film, so he and the rest of the coaching staff can work out what coverages they could use in a two-big situation, and he's prepared for more losses and angst from the fan base before he discards it