Would you be okay with this finish to the off-season?

[jambr380]

I feel like Simons is too good to waive and stretch. Maybe try and trade him for a cheaper worse player and a pick and then waive and stretch that player. I'm hoping we can dump Niang with a 2nd into a TPE/MLE, but I may aiming too high there.

I'm totally cool with getting Lillard and I'll be moderately annoyed at Al if he leaves us a 2nd time. I'd like some semblance of continuity to our roster moving forward. I don't think we are going to tank and it's not like retaining Al is going to add 15 wins to our total.

[Moranis]

Id rather just trade Brown to get assets and below the tax.

Your position is long-stated.  You haven't liked Brown in years.  I'm not sure what package is out there that brings us closer to a championship. The more likely result is that Tatum forces a trade.

I don't dislike Brown as a player, he just isnt the right 2nd fiddle to Tatum as he is essentially the same player but worse at basically everything.  They are very duplicative on the floor. Brown is also injury prone and getting old.  His value will never be higher.  Tatum's injury ended this run. The team simply isnt good enough and it won't be again without major changes. 

[Goldstar88]

Put me down for the draft lottery. Hopefully they can get a top pick and flip it for a good player during his the 2026/27 season.

[slamtheking]

Id rather just trade Brown to get assets and below the tax.

Your position is long-stated.  You haven't liked Brown in years.  I'm not sure what package is out there that brings us closer to a championship. The more likely result is that Tatum forces a trade.

I don't dislike Brown as a player, he just isnt the right 2nd fiddle to Tatum as he is essentially the same player but worse at basically everything.  They are very duplicative on the floor. Brown is also injury prone and getting old.  His value will never be higher.  Tatum's injury ended this run. The team simply isnt good enough and it won't be again without major changes.

you've been spewing this nonsense for years and were conclusively proven wrong with Brown winning the conference and finals MVP in 2024.  you haven't accepted that fact either in many other posts but it's now been clearly established Brown and Tatum can indeed function together to win a title and Brown can be the best player in that run.

[Moranis]

Id rather just trade Brown to get assets and below the tax.

Your position is long-stated.  You haven't liked Brown in years.  I'm not sure what package is out there that brings us closer to a championship. The more likely result is that Tatum forces a trade.

I don't dislike Brown as a player, he just isnt the right 2nd fiddle to Tatum as he is essentially the same player but worse at basically everything.  They are very duplicative on the floor. Brown is also injury prone and getting old.  His value will never be higher.  Tatum's injury ended this run. The team simply isnt good enough and it won't be again without major changes.

you've been spewing this nonsense for years and were conclusively proven wrong with Brown winning the conference and finals MVP in 2024.  you haven't accepted that fact either in many other posts but it's now been clearly established Brown and Tatum can indeed function together to win a title and Brown can be the best player in that run.

Sure they won a title, but that doesn't mean they are a great fit.  Lots of great players win titles with players that aren't great fits.  Lebron and Wade won back-to-back as an example.  They weren't very complimentary, which is why Dallas could beat them that first season. 

And if your "best" player scores less, rebounds less, and assists less, and has a worse +- and on/off differential, I'm not sure how you call him your best player. 

There are no guarantees, but I was big on trading for Kawhi in the lead up to his trade to Toronto.  The rumored deal, which Ainge reportedly refused, was Brown, Smart, and a future 1st for Kawhi.  Had Boston made that trade they almost certainly would have won the 2019 title (the year Kawhi led a much worse supporting cast Raptors team to the title).  Boston post-trade would have been Kawhi, Kyrie, Tatum, Horford, Hayward, Rozier, Morris, Baynes, Theis.  That Boston team would have been so stacked it might have actually beaten a healthy Curry/Durant Warriors team.  And who knows maybe Kawhi and Kyrie loved playing together and stayed in Boston, and Boston went on a mulitple championships run.  Or if not, the team could have reset around Tatum and already built another contender in the 5 years since then.

The simple reality is Boston lost in the 2nd round to the Knicks this year, Tatum blew out his achilles, and Brown just had surgery.  I don't see a path to Boston winning much of anything, let alone a title any more without some significant changes.  Tatum's knee injury ended any shot at that.  They are too old, too expensive, and the supporting cast is way too weak for that.  And they don't have any draft picks other than their own nor do they have any players still on the upswing that are worth anything.  The only way to get the pieces required to build another contender is to trade the few assets they have left and completely bottom out, while Tatum sits out the entire year.   Come back in the summer of 2026 with massive cap space, a high lottery pick of your own, and whatever future picks and young players you get for Brown and potentially White.  Wipe the slate clean and start over.  The status quo will just lead to years of no championships. 

I thought Stevens would see the error in the Ainge method of trying to win and trying to build for the future, but alas he only went partially in, just as Ainge did year after year, as other teams won titles that Boston should have been winning.  You shouldn't make the Mann and 22 salary dump, if you aren't going to go all the way into the tank, as there was no reason to get below the 2nd apron right then, and there were other ways they could have gotten out of the 2nd apron, like trading Hauser/Pritchard into an exception or dumping Niang (who wouldn't have cost nearly as much as Mann to dump).  Make the draft pick or try to trade up and get an actual player or trade back for a future 1st as several trades happened in that range. 

[smicker16]

Id rather just trade Brown to get assets and below the tax.

Your position is long-stated.  You haven't liked Brown in years.  I'm not sure what package is out there that brings us closer to a championship. The more likely result is that Tatum forces a trade.

I don't dislike Brown as a player, he just isnt the right 2nd fiddle to Tatum as he is essentially the same player but worse at basically everything.  They are very duplicative on the floor. Brown is also injury prone and getting old.  His value will never be higher.  Tatum's injury ended this run. The team simply isnt good enough and it won't be again without major changes.

you've been spewing this nonsense for years and were conclusively proven wrong with Brown winning the conference and finals MVP in 2024.  you haven't accepted that fact either in many other posts but it's now been clearly established Brown and Tatum can indeed function together to win a title and Brown can be the best player in that run.

Sure they won a title, but that doesn't mean they are a great fit.  Lots of great players win titles with players that aren't great fits.  Lebron and Wade won back-to-back as an example.  They weren't very complimentary, which is why Dallas could beat them that first season. 

And if your "best" player scores less, rebounds less, and assists less, and has a worse +- and on/off differential, I'm not sure how you call him your best player. 

There are no guarantees, but I was big on trading for Kawhi in the lead up to his trade to Toronto.  The rumored deal, which Ainge reportedly refused, was Brown, Smart, and a future 1st for Kawhi.  Had Boston made that trade they almost certainly would have won the 2019 title (the year Kawhi led a much worse supporting cast Raptors team to the title).  Boston post-trade would have been Kawhi, Kyrie, Tatum, Horford, Hayward, Rozier, Morris, Baynes, Theis.  That Boston team would have been so stacked it might have actually beaten a healthy Curry/Durant Warriors team.  And who knows maybe Kawhi and Kyrie loved playing together and stayed in Boston, and Boston went on a mulitple championships run.  Or if not, the team could have reset around Tatum and already built another contender in the 5 years since then.

The simple reality is Boston lost in the 2nd round to the Knicks this year, Tatum blew out his achilles, and Brown just had surgery.  I don't see a path to Boston winning much of anything, let alone a title any more without some significant changes.  Tatum's knee injury ended any shot at that.  They are too old, too expensive, and the supporting cast is way too weak for that.  And they don't have any draft picks other than their own nor do they have any players still on the upswing that are worth anything.  The only way to get the pieces required to build another contender is to trade the few assets they have left and completely bottom out, while Tatum sits out the entire year.   Come back in the summer of 2026 with massive cap space, a high lottery pick of your own, and whatever future picks and young players you get for Brown and potentially White.  Wipe the slate clean and start over.  The status quo will just lead to years of no championships. 

I thought Stevens would see the error in the Ainge method of trying to win and trying to build for the future, but alas he only went partially in, just as Ainge did year after year, as other teams won titles that Boston should have been winning.  You shouldn't make the Mann and 22 salary dump, if you aren't going to go all the way into the tank, as there was no reason to get below the 2nd apron right then, and there were other ways they could have gotten out of the 2nd apron, like trading Hauser/Pritchard into an exception or dumping Niang (who wouldn't have cost nearly as much as Mann to dump).  Make the draft pick or try to trade up and get an actual player or trade back for a future 1st as several trades happened in that range.

I would have been fine going the route of completely blowing it up by trading Brown or White especially if we got good offers.  I can definitely see how that coupld play out really well.  However I do not think that is a slam dunk path to being a championship contender.  I think both directions have some risk and you need to get lucky.  If you trade them both then you have to get lucky with the lottery, free agency and the draft of course.  And it is very likely the player you pick is not going to be able to be able to contribute very quickly to a championship team which could lead to Tatum wanting out with so little help around him. 

If you keep Brown and White you have some pieces still when Tatum comes back.  But you absolutely need to get lucky still with the draft and some vets wanting to take discounts to come here so that is not an easy path to competing either and I agree with how you feel there. 

So I can see the argument for both sides honestly and am not going to criticize either direction because they are both a bit of a crapshoot I feel.

My personal preference is to keep Brown and White, but have Brown be load managed most of the year and be shut down about halfway through to still tank and end up in the bottom 7 teams.  Still would require both lottery luck and draft luck but I would prefer to tank but still having those pieces for when Tatum returns.

[SHAQATTACK]

No,  that won?t do.   No stop gaps . Get the cap low as possible.  Play the lottery game .

I would be sure to get a top ten lottery pick,  while the best players are healing. That?s what the Spurs always do . 

[Vermont Green]

Do not trade Brown unless it is to get different premier player, Giannis or someone like that.  Do not trade Brown for a Bridges or Bane type deal.  If things don't go well in 2026-27, due to Tatum not recovering or whatever, then you start to think about blowing it up and trading stars for draft picks.

As to the debate, I agree that Tatum was the best player on the team even though Brown won the finals MVP.  But it is really hard to argue that Tatum and Brown can't win a title together or are somehow a bad fit.  This is partially due to the versatility of Tatum.  He is a natural wing but plays out of position for much of the game because that is the roster demands.

[Moranis]

Do not trade Brown unless it is to get different premier player, Giannis or someone like that.  Do not trade Brown for a Bridges or Bane type deal.  If things don't go well in 2026-27, due to Tatum not recovering or whatever, then you start to think about blowing it up and trading stars for draft picks.

As to the debate, I agree that Tatum was the best player on the team even though Brown won the finals MVP.  But it is really hard to argue that Tatum and Brown can't win a title together or are somehow a bad fit.  This is partially due to the versatility of Tatum.  He is a natural wing but plays out of position for much of the game because that is the roster demands.

Why would you want your best player to play out of position though?  Shouldn't you maximize your best player?

2 years from now, the market for Brown and White is going to be much lower.  If you are going to trade then, trade them now when their value is at its highest point

[dannyboy35]

Id rather just trade Brown to get assets and below the tax.

Your position is long-stated.  You haven't liked Brown in years.  I'm not sure what package is out there that brings us closer to a championship. The more likely result is that Tatum forces a trade.

I don't dislike Brown as a player, he just isnt the right 2nd fiddle to Tatum as he is essentially the same player but worse at basically everything.  They are very duplicative on the floor. Brown is also injury prone and getting old.  His value will never be higher.  Tatum's injury ended this run. The team simply isnt good enough and it won't be again without major changes.

you've been spewing this nonsense for years and were conclusively proven wrong with Brown winning the conference and finals MVP in 2024.  you haven't accepted that fact either in many other posts but it's now been clearly established Brown and Tatum can indeed function together to win a title and Brown can be the best player in that run.

Sure they won a title, but that doesn't mean they are a great fit.  Lots of great players win titles with players that aren't great fits.  Lebron and Wade won back-to-back as an example.  They weren't very complimentary, which is why Dallas could beat them that first season. 

And if your "best" player scores less, rebounds less, and assists less, and has a worse +- and on/off differential, I'm not sure how you call him your best player. 

There are no guarantees, but I was big on trading for Kawhi in the lead up to his trade to Toronto.  The rumored deal, which Ainge reportedly refused, was Brown, Smart, and a future 1st for Kawhi.  Had Boston made that trade they almost certainly would have won the 2019 title (the year Kawhi led a much worse supporting cast Raptors team to the title).  Boston post-trade would have been Kawhi, Kyrie, Tatum, Horford, Hayward, Rozier, Morris, Baynes, Theis.  That Boston team would have been so stacked it might have actually beaten a healthy Curry/Durant Warriors team.  And who knows maybe Kawhi and Kyrie loved playing together and stayed in Boston, and Boston went on a mulitple championships run.  Or if not, the team could have reset around Tatum and already built another contender in the 5 years since then.

The simple reality is Boston lost in the 2nd round to the Knicks this year, Tatum blew out his achilles, and Brown just had surgery.  I don't see a path to Boston winning much of anything, let alone a title any more without some significant changes.  Tatum's knee injury ended any shot at that.  They are too old, too expensive, and the supporting cast is way too weak for that.  And they don't have any draft picks other than their own nor do they have any players still on the upswing that are worth anything.  The only way to get the pieces required to build another contender is to trade the few assets they have left and completely bottom out, while Tatum sits out the entire year.   Come back in the summer of 2026 with massive cap space, a high lottery pick of your own, and whatever future picks and young players you get for Brown and potentially White.  Wipe the slate clean and start over.  The status quo will just lead to years of no championships. 

I thought Stevens would see the error in the Ainge method of trying to win and trying to build for the future, but alas he only went partially in, just as Ainge did year after year, as other teams won titles that Boston should have been winning.  You shouldn't make the Mann and 22 salary dump, if you aren't going to go all the way into the tank, as there was no reason to get below the 2nd apron right then, and there were other ways they could have gotten out of the 2nd apron, like trading Hauser/Pritchard into an exception or dumping Niang (who wouldn't have cost nearly as much as Mann to dump).  Make the draft pick or try to trade up and get an actual player or trade back for a future 1st as several trades happened in that range.

I would have been fine going the route of completely blowing it up by trading Brown or White especially if we got good offers.  I can definitely see how that coupld play out really well.  However I do not think that is a slam dunk path to being a championship contender.  I think both directions have some risk and you need to get lucky.  If you trade them both then you have to get lucky with the lottery, free agency and the draft of course.  And it is very likely the player you pick is not going to be able to be able to contribute very quickly to a championship team which could lead to Tatum wanting out with so little help around him. 

If you keep Brown and White you have some pieces still when Tatum comes back.  But you absolutely need to get lucky still with the draft and some vets wanting to take discounts to come here so that is not an easy path to competing either and I agree with how you feel there. 

So I can see the argument for both sides honestly and am not going to criticize either direction because they are both a bit of a crapshoot I feel.

My personal preference is to keep Brown and White, but have Brown be load managed most of the year and be shut down about halfway through to still tank and end up in the bottom 7 teams.  Still would require both lottery luck and draft luck but I would prefer to tank but still having those pieces for when Tatum returns.

   This is such a logical and refreshing post. Nobody can tell the future. Both paths have risks and you didn?t even have to attempt to talk down to anyone. Bravo!

[Who]

As to the debate, I agree that Tatum was the best player on the team even though Brown won the finals MVP.  But it is really hard to argue that Tatum and Brown can't win a title together or are somehow a bad fit.

I think there is still an argument over this.

Yes, they won a title last year but they won with D White, J Holiday, and kinda Porzingis. Along with a quality bench.

The argument I would see as having some validity would be - that we cannot put together a team that strong again due to the new CBA. And the question is to Jaylen & Tatum complement each other well enough to win another title? To be earning $60mil each $120mil total to still build a team good enough around them to win a title under the new CBA.

Or another argument, is Jaylen good enough to be worth $60mil under the new CBA. Should that be reserved for top 10 players in the league. Franchise players. Not All-Stars & sidekicks.



I see it more as a settled debate under the old CBA that has been reopened under the new CBA. I am not sure where I come down on it but I do see the debate as open again.

[boscel33]

Id rather just trade Brown to get assets and below the tax.

Your position is long-stated.  You haven't liked Brown in years.  I'm not sure what package is out there that brings us closer to a championship. The more likely result is that Tatum forces a trade.

I don't dislike Brown as a player, he just isnt the right 2nd fiddle to Tatum as he is essentially the same player but worse at basically everything.  They are very duplicative on the floor. Brown is also injury prone and getting old.  His value will never be higher.  Tatum's injury ended this run. The team simply isnt good enough and it won't be again without major changes.

you've been spewing this nonsense for years and were conclusively proven wrong with Brown winning the conference and finals MVP in 2024.  you haven't accepted that fact either in many other posts but it's now been clearly established Brown and Tatum can indeed function together to win a title and Brown can be the best player in that run.

Sure they won a title, but that doesn't mean they are a great fit.  Lots of great players win titles with players that aren't great fits.  Lebron and Wade won back-to-back as an example.  They weren't very complimentary, which is why Dallas could beat them that first season. 

And if your "best" player scores less, rebounds less, and assists less, and has a worse +- and on/off differential, I'm not sure how you call him your best player. 

There are no guarantees, but I was big on trading for Kawhi in the lead up to his trade to Toronto.  The rumored deal, which Ainge reportedly refused, was Brown, Smart, and a future 1st for Kawhi.  Had Boston made that trade they almost certainly would have won the 2019 title (the year Kawhi led a much worse supporting cast Raptors team to the title).  Boston post-trade would have been Kawhi, Kyrie, Tatum, Horford, Hayward, Rozier, Morris, Baynes, Theis.  That Boston team would have been so stacked it might have actually beaten a healthy Curry/Durant Warriors team.  And who knows maybe Kawhi and Kyrie loved playing together and stayed in Boston, and Boston went on a mulitple championships run.  Or if not, the team could have reset around Tatum and already built another contender in the 5 years since then.

The simple reality is Boston lost in the 2nd round to the Knicks this year, Tatum blew out his achilles, and Brown just had surgery.  I don't see a path to Boston winning much of anything, let alone a title any more without some significant changes.  Tatum's knee injury ended any shot at that.  They are too old, too expensive, and the supporting cast is way too weak for that.  And they don't have any draft picks other than their own nor do they have any players still on the upswing that are worth anything.  The only way to get the pieces required to build another contender is to trade the few assets they have left and completely bottom out, while Tatum sits out the entire year.   Come back in the summer of 2026 with massive cap space, a high lottery pick of your own, and whatever future picks and young players you get for Brown and potentially White.  Wipe the slate clean and start over.  The status quo will just lead to years of no championships. 

I thought Stevens would see the error in the Ainge method of trying to win and trying to build for the future, but alas he only went partially in, just as Ainge did year after year, as other teams won titles that Boston should have been winning.  You shouldn't make the Mann and 22 salary dump, if you aren't going to go all the way into the tank, as there was no reason to get below the 2nd apron right then, and there were other ways they could have gotten out of the 2nd apron, like trading Hauser/Pritchard into an exception or dumping Niang (who wouldn't have cost nearly as much as Mann to dump).  Make the draft pick or try to trade up and get an actual player or trade back for a future 1st as several trades happened in that range.

I would have been fine going the route of completely blowing it up by trading Brown or White especially if we got good offers.  I can definitely see how that coupld play out really well.  However I do not think that is a slam dunk path to being a championship contender.  I think both directions have some risk and you need to get lucky.  If you trade them both then you have to get lucky with the lottery, free agency and the draft of course.  And it is very likely the player you pick is not going to be able to be able to contribute very quickly to a championship team which could lead to Tatum wanting out with so little help around him. 

If you keep Brown and White you have some pieces still when Tatum comes back.  But you absolutely need to get lucky still with the draft and some vets wanting to take discounts to come here so that is not an easy path to competing either and I agree with how you feel there. 

So I can see the argument for both sides honestly and am not going to criticize either direction because they are both a bit of a crapshoot I feel.

My personal preference is to keep Brown and White, but have Brown be load managed most of the year and be shut down about halfway through to still tank and end up in the bottom 7 teams.  Still would require both lottery luck and draft luck but I would prefer to tank but still having those pieces for when Tatum returns.

   This is such a logical and refreshing post. Nobody can tell the future. Both paths have risks and you didn?t even have to attempt to talk down to anyone. Bravo!

Good offers is not enough for White or Brown, they need to be transformational offers!  Look at what Bane was just traded for.  That's a start!

[Who]

If their goal is to get below the tax, well they have a lot of work to do. They are about 21 million over. Dumping Niang would save 6, dumping Hauser (which I don't think they want to do) saves 8. They HAVE TO trade Simons for less money coming in to have any shot at it. I could very easily see them simply deciding to stay 5-15 million over if getting under becomes too damaging to future rosters.

This is my concern. And my desire to stay above the tax.

If we cut down the roster and get rid of these players, we will have no way to replace them. We will still be over the cap with Tatum, Jaylen and D White. We will only have the MLE to replace those guys. That won't cut it. We won't be able to strengthen enough to get back to title contention. Not for 2026-27.

And we will only have MLEs in the summers ahead to rebuild to try and get back to title contention in 2027-28 or 2028-29. Is Tatum, Jaylen, D White and 2-3 MLE players enough to win a title? That is a dangerous gamble.

I want to pay the tax. I want to keep our productive role players like Sam Hauser. I want to keep A Simons so that we can trade him (coupled with 1st round picks) for a 4 star / quasi-star to put alongside our core of Tatum, Jaylen & D White. That is the strongest road back to title contention. Both in terms of likelihood to succeed + how quickly we can get back to title contention (compared to blowing it up and rebuilding around draft picks / youth which would be a long road).

[Roy H.]

If their goal is to get below the tax, well they have a lot of work to do. They are about 21 million over. Dumping Niang would save 6, dumping Hauser (which I don't think they want to do) saves 8. They HAVE TO trade Simons for less money coming in to have any shot at it. I could very easily see them simply deciding to stay 5-15 million over if getting under becomes too damaging to future rosters.

I think they're going to try to move Simons in a series of deals to cut salary, most likely.  So, a deal like $29 million in expiring salary for $23 million; then $23 million for $18.5 million; etc. Eventually it will get down far enough to get below the tax, and if it doesn't, we'll stretch whatever is left.

I don't think Simons is a player they want to keep beyond this season, so what would be the point of keeping him this year?

Obviously, I don't really know, but I don't think the team has much interest in an expensive guy who is fairly inefficienct and doesn't play defense.  He's not as good as Sexton, and Sexton just had negative trade value.

[Vermont Green]

Do not trade Brown unless it is to get different premier player, Giannis or someone like that.  Do not trade Brown for a Bridges or Bane type deal.  If things don't go well in 2026-27, due to Tatum not recovering or whatever, then you start to think about blowing it up and trading stars for draft picks.

As to the debate, I agree that Tatum was the best player on the team even though Brown won the finals MVP.  But it is really hard to argue that Tatum and Brown can't win a title together or are somehow a bad fit.  This is partially due to the versatility of Tatum.  He is a natural wing but plays out of position for much of the game because that is the roster demands.

Why would you want your best player to play out of position though?  Shouldn't you maximize your best player?

2 years from now, the market for Brown and White is going to be much lower.  If you are going to trade then, trade them now when their value is at its highest point

I don't want to play my best player out of position, and I have commented on this all along.  But that isn't a Brown problem.  That is a problem with not having enough bigs and having too many guards.  I feel that this issue has been largely addressed by trading Holiday.  I see the starters in 2026 as:

White
Brown
Tatum
Big - TBD
Big - TBD

This problem can easily be solved without trading Brown.  As I said, 2025-26 is the reset year, Tatum is coming back, they are not blowing it up this season.  I expect BOS to be a top team in 2026-27 with Tatum and Brown as the key players.  If you want to trade Brown for Giannis (not likely) or maybe even say Sabonis or Adebayo or Banchero or another high level big to balance the roster some, that is fine.  But that has nothing to do with whether Brown and Tatum can play together.

White and Brown will have plenty of value going forward.  Every move the team makes needs to be with an eye on maximizing the 2026-27 roster.  Trading Brown for draft picks does not accomplish that.  The Celtics have said (or so it has been reported) that they would trade Brown or White for a King's ransom type of trade.  That is not the same as actively trying to blow up the team.  I see no need to do that (for now) and I do not expect BOS will do that.