What do you think Derrick White is worth?

[celticsclay]

I don't think making an all nba team automatically makes someone elite.  He is an excellent defender, but excellent and elite are not the same thing.  He might not even be the best guard defender on this team.

What are you talking about? You’ve created your own definition of excellent and elite play? DWhite is good, JB is good, etc. The Celtics are a good team.

Um, everyone has their own definition of elite and excellent. If everyone had the same definition there wouldn't be discussions. To bring this actually on topic, in your view, is White as good a defender as Caruso?

Can you sit back and ask yourself a question. If there is one guard that may be better than him defensively, is this relevant to him being elite? You either think wemby is better than gobert or vise versa. That means one of them isnt elite? Again, you made a dumb comment. Nobody cares just stop with this nonsense and doubling down on a straw man. Derrick white is an elite defensive player. He probably isn’t elite at anything else.

your lack of reading retention is astounding.

Ahh yes the last flail of a losing argument. An insult. Derrick white is an elite defender is recognized for it around the league. You made a dumb comment. You got called out on it by multiple posters. It happens. Lets move on.

in my view, White is not an elite defender. This isn't an argument, that is my opinion. My opinion is baseqd on actual stats and watching games.  Mitchell has torched the C's this series and is shooting out of this world. Against the Magic and an actual elite defender in Suggs, Mitchell shot 25% from 3, scoring about 3 ppg less with basically same amount of shots. Rebounds and assists were down as well against the Magic. Garland also looks much closer to all star form this series than he did against the Magic.  Suggs is an elite defender, White is not. They are just a different tier of player.  As is Caruso, as is SGA.  The Celtics have a lot of great defenders, which makes everyone look better.

At the end of a close game where Boston needs a stop, I'd still take Holiday over White defensively if I had to choose between the 2. Holiday still has the higher peak and at his best he is an elite defender.  He can't go full bore all game long like he used to be able to though, but he certainly peaks out as elite. I just don't think White can hit that level. He is an excellent defender, but there is absolutely a difference between excellent and elite.

Dwhite's All NBA 2nd Team Defense recognition will beg to differ with you.  If D White isn't elite then the NBA doesn't have any elite defensive guards.

I mean Larry Hughes made an All Defense team (1st team even) as did Mikal Bridges, Dr. J, Latrell Spreewell, John Wall, John Starks, and countless other guys that weren't elite defenders, while Marc Gasol can win DPOY and have only have 1 2nd Team All Defense in his entire career

Not every All-Defense performer is KG or Mookie Blaylock.  That doesn't mean they're not elite compared to their peers.  The All-Defense team selections aren't perfect -- sometimes they award reputation and guys who make flashy plays -- but they're usually a pretty good indicator.

But, more than that, how can anybody watch Celtics games without recognizing that both Jrue and White are top-tier defenders?

Well said Roy

[Birdman]

Alway said Holiday is biggest part of Celtics success, he may not light up the box score but does all the little thing like defense same as white

[Who]

Elite is hard to define.  At any given time, there are roughly 450 NBA players.  Is elite top 10% (top 45)?  Top 5% (top 22)?  Top 1% (top 5)?  If your definition of "Elite" is top 1%, then no, Derrick White isn't elite at anything.  Is he a top 20 defender in the league?  Always tough to compare guards and bigs.  But say there are 150 guards in the league, top 5% would be top 7 or 8.

I don't think you should include 3rd stringers in these things. I normally use either relative to rotation players (top 300) or relative to his fellow starters (top 150) or to a player's specific position (top 30).

I don't think comparing quality players to 3rd stringers gives you anything meaningful. Compare him to guys who play. Play regularly.

[celticsclay]

How can anyone watch that half and not think white is elite defensively he literally turned the game around with his defense.

[Moranis]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

[green_bballers13]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

Why do you care about what # a player is on the team? I don't see anyone else as concerned about that. If DWhite is #5 on this team, does that make him less valuable than if he was the #2 player on the Hornets?

[jambr380]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

With the 140% rule, I don't think we can pay him for than $31-32M/yr anyway. With reports out there that both the Celtics and White want to get an extension done, I can't imagine this will be a grueling process.

Questions will loom about KP's health and Jrue's age, but with Tatum, Brown, and White locked up for at least the next 5 years, we will always be competitive.

[Moranis]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

With the 140% rule, I don't think we can pay him for than $31-32M/yr anyway. With reports out there that both the Celtics and White want to get an extension done, I can't imagine this will be a grueling process.

Questions will loom about KP's health and Jrue's age, but with Tatum, Brown, and White locked up for at least the next 5 years, we will always be competitive.

I think the max thet can be offered as an extension is 4 years 120 million or so. If White takes that and doesn't wait till free agency when he can get more, you do it. I think the thread was more if he goes to free agency or there wasn't a cap limit, what would you pay.

[Moranis]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

Why do you care about what # a player is on the team? I don't see anyone else as concerned about that. If DWhite is #5 on this team, does that make him less valuable than if he was the #2 player on the Hornets?

because there is only so much money to go around and if you are constantly overpaying guys, you are going to lose players you can't pay.  Money matters a great deal to team building. And while it isn't our money, we all know there is a limit to what can be spent.

[green_bballers13]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

Why do you care about what # a player is on the team? I don't see anyone else as concerned about that. If DWhite is #5 on this team, does that make him less valuable than if he was the #2 player on the Hornets?

because there is only so much money to go around and if you are constantly overpaying guys, you are going to lose players you can't pay.  Money matters a great deal to team building. And while it isn't our money, we all know there is a limit to what can be spent.

Sure, but we're in the window now. Overspend and pay the price later. The Patriots did this and won 3 more rings (after the original 3) by focusing on the now over the future.

If the Celtics win two more rings at the expense of the future, we will all be happy. Two more rings and the Celtics can be a lottery team for a half a decade.

[trickybilly]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

With the 140% rule, I don't think we can pay him for than $31-32M/yr anyway. With reports out there that both the Celtics and White want to get an extension done, I can't imagine this will be a grueling process.

Questions will loom about KP's health and Jrue's age, but with Tatum, Brown, and White locked up for at least the next 5 years, we will always be competitive.

Sheesh 31m sounds like a bargain.

Also, great tradable contract with KP if we need to get serious help for another title run

[Roy H.]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

With the 140% rule, I don't think we can pay him for than $31-32M/yr anyway. With reports out there that both the Celtics and White want to get an extension done, I can't imagine this will be a grueling process.

Questions will loom about KP's health and Jrue's age, but with Tatum, Brown, and White locked up for at least the next 5 years, we will always be competitive.

Yeah, if White wants to sign, you give him the max offer without hesitation.

[Kernewek]

Now that we are in the off season, has anyone's position changed on this. I'm still at no more than 35 million, which puts White in the KP and Jrue range. I'd prefer closer to KP, but would go to 35 to get it done.  I don't think the team should go higher than that as it is really a restricting contract and amount for a guy that is currently the 5th best player on the team.

Why do you care about what # a player is on the team? I don't see anyone else as concerned about that. If DWhite is #5 on this team, does that make him less valuable than if he was the #2 player on the Hornets?

because there is only so much money to go around and if you are constantly overpaying guys, you are going to lose players you can't pay.  Money matters a great deal to team building. And while it isn't our money, we all know there is a limit to what can be spent.

Sure, but we're in the window now. Overspend and pay the price later. The Patriots did this and won 3 more rings (after the original 3) by focusing on the now over the future.

If the Celtics win two more rings at the expense of the future, we will all be happy. Two more rings and the Celtics can be a lottery team for a half a decade.

The problem is that this sentiment runs into the salary cap quickly and severely. Just ask Golden State.

I do think that White is worth his maximum extension, though.

[Phantom255x]

In the current NBA at his current age, I?d say 40M a year

Does anyone know how much we can actually offer him though? I?m not a salary cap expert lol