2024 NBA Season and Playoffs

[Donoghus]

I'm watching the end of the Dallas/Minny game from last night and there's 47 seconds left, the ball goes out of bounds and it's called Minny's ball. Dallas challenges and in the replay, Kyrie clearly fouls McDaniels on the arm but because the review is "just" for who touched the ball last and Kyrie didn't hit the ball, he hit McDaniels on the arm, it winds up reversing the call and Dallas gets the ball back, down 2, winds up winning the game by 1.

Anyone else think that's incredibly messed up?

It was definitely messed up but the refs hands were also tied there.  The league definitely needs to address something like this. If the goal is to get things correct, they still got it wrong since technically that ball doesn’t go out of bounds if he’s not fouled by Kyrie. But the letter of the law wouldn’t allow common sense to come into play.

[SHAQATTACK]

I'm watching the end of the Dallas/Minny game from last night and there's 47 seconds left, the ball goes out of bounds and it's called Minny's ball. Dallas challenges and in the replay, Kyrie clearly fouls McDaniels on the arm but because the review is "just" for who touched the ball last and Kyrie didn't hit the ball, he hit McDaniels on the arm, it winds up reversing the call and Dallas gets the ball back, down 2, winds up winning the game by 1.

Anyone else think that's incredibly messed up?

It was definitely messed up but the refs hands were also tied there.  The league definitely needs to address something like this. If the goal is to get things correct, they still got it wrong since technically that ball doesn’t go out of bounds if he’s not fouled by Kyrie. But the letter of the law wouldn’t allow common sense to come into play.

I think many years ago this is very reason NBA didn’t want to get into the challenge a call , because of this very type of play of cause and effect that muddies up the game for the fans at the game , most who couldn’see or understand all,that transpired with the delay of the game.We watching TV have more info have the time and patience to wait out a correct historical analysis, investigation to unfold A sports glimpse in time rabbit hole. The question given the time the game is supposed to transpire , just because we can go back and study every cause and effect for every questionable play . Should we?
Not if , I’m sitting at the game and want to ever get home. 
I think they have to draw the line at some point , play the game and realize the refs human errors are a part of the sport .  Just the way the ball bounces.

[Who]

Minnesota benched the wrong big down the stretch last night. Towns should have been out there instead of Gobert.

Towns was 4-16 FGA and struggling all night long.

[Who]

Maybe I’m misremembering, but Gobert disappeared in the playoffs at Utah too, didn’t he?

The evolution of Gobert has been interesting. Early in his career he dominated defensively around the basket but was a liability on the perimeter. He developed his PnR defense and became a good PnR defender. He developed his positioning to help him in switches and force players to shoot over the top of him more often. He became a a good switch defender.

This led to an adjustment of how teams attacked him defensively in the playoffs. The early years they just put him in PnR. This no longer worked well. So instead LAC isolated him. They went small with Marcus Morris and sent Morris, a three point shooter, to the corner. This forced Gobert outside of the paint as a help defender but also kept him off-ball as a PnR and switch defender where he was causing LAC problems. This neutralized Gobert.

Don Nelson did a similar thing to David Robinson in the playoffs in 1990 or 1991. Sometime around then. I think it was Alton Lister. You had the illegal defense rules then meaning you had to stay close to your man. Lister was not allowed past the three point line and would often stand 5 feet behind the three point line. Stoppign David Robinson from camping out in the paint against a non-shooter and disrupting the Warriors offense. This also disrupted the Spurs team defensive concepts which involved funneling drivers into the shot-blocking David Robinson. The Spurs defense collapsed. The Warriors had a big upset.

Only nowadays this is easier to do because of growth of three point shooting. You can pull opposing shot-blockers out of the paint and neutralize their defense easier.

Furthermore, you can do this against Gobert whose limited offensive game makes him incapable of punishing sturdy defensively-able forwards in switches consistently as Marcus Morris ably showed.

Utah lost that series against LAC because they game-planned around Gobert's defense. They isolated him. They removed him from Utah's defensive team concepts. And without Gobert there to protect all of Utah's bad defensive players, they were wide open for attack and attack LAC did beating Utah in style.

[Who]

I don't like a lot of the narrative around Gobert.

He is a good PnR defender and a good switch defender. Luka and Kyrie are just amazing one-on-one attackers. There is no shame in a 7-2 guy on a switch getting beat by two of the best one-on-one players on the planet.

[Who]

I know the individual matchup doesn't favor Gobert (Gobert vs. Doncic, come on), but I personally don't get the Gobert hype on defense. I feel like every time I see him play against a great team, particularly in the playoffs, he gets pantsed often. Are there advanced metrics or something I'm missing??

Even in the Nuggets series, it felt like Naz Reid and KAT were the main guys who neutralized Jokic (especially Reid in Game 7), Gobert only did it like one game. What am I missing? DPOY? Huh?

It does feel odd that a 3-time DPOY is kind of a liability in some situations on defense, doesn't it?

Maybe I’m misremembering, but Gobert disappeared in the playoffs at Utah too, didn’t he? Wasn’t that one of the reasons that Ainge moved him? I was surprised at the time how much Minnesota gave up for him, but Danny gotta Ainge.

Yeah, and the funny thing is even Donovan Mitchell agrees. I know they had some beef (Mitchell-Gobert) on COVID-stuff too but Gobert was typically bad on defense in some of Utah's playoff runs and hurt them. I just think Gobert is kind of overrated. And there's many players around the league who agree too btw. Sorry but it's just baffling to me he's won DPOY 4 times

Again, even last round it felt like Naz Reid and Towns did more to help them than Gobert. Game 7 was Reid being fantastic defensively late. Not Gobert.

Naz Reid was killing Minnesota defensively throughout most of that series. He was blowing defensive coverages and leaving shooters wide open time and time again. He was driving a lot of Minny fans nuts with how bad his defense was in that series.

Gobert is a massive stabilizer for Minnesota. You can see this time and time again. The team is solid to very good with him on the floor and then starts to lose their lead when he sits. He has a major impact on defense and a major impact on rebounding.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

ON an earlier possession late in the 4th, the Wolves played Reid and Anderson and switched everything. My theory is that Gobert wanted to come in and switch late to help his team, and the Wolves coaches caved.

Late in games, Reid and Anderson switching in the front court gives the Wolves the best shot at a stop on any given possession.

[Redz]

ON an earlier possession late in the 4th, the Wolves played Reid and Anderson and switched everything. My theory is that Gobert wanted to come in and switch late to help his team, and the Wolves coaches caved.

Late in games, Reid and Anderson switching in the front court gives the Wolves the best shot at a stop on any given possession.

Max would be an amazing fit with the Celts. Well I guess with most teams…

[Who]

JJ Redick had two stats on Gobert's defense. Not sure whether it was Gm 1 or Gm 2. I think it was Gm 2.

(1) Luka was scoring 1.35 points per possession on Gobert's drop coverage versus 1.14 for Luka for the season against drop coverage which was 3rd best in the league.

(2) Dallas shot 55% at the rim with Gobert in the game. They shot 100% at the rim when he was out of the game. They were 14-14 at the rim when he was on the bench.

[Birdman]

Looks like both Mavs & Celtics gotta have a week to rest 😁

[cman88]

if both your stars play like garbage, its hard to win. so Wolves have to feel somewhat good that they only lost by 2.

but as you have seen with celtics in years past. losing constantly at home and having to win on the road to pull out series is not sustainable. it will be tough for them to come back. they need to win at least 2 in dallas. All dallas needs to do is split and its 3-1 with 3 chances to close it out.

Minnesota has a much better team IMO. but their stars playing like garbage leaving the Mavs close enough for Kyrie/Luka to take it with their clutch scoring and veteran knowledge vs. the young wolves essentially has been the difference in this series.

[liam]

if both your stars play like garbage, its hard to win. so Wolves have to feel somewhat good that they only lost by 2.

but as you have seen with celtics in years past. losing constantly at home and having to win on the road to pull out series is not sustainable. it will be tough for them to come back. they need to win at least 2 in dallas. All dallas needs to do is split and its 3-1 with 3 chances to close it out.

Minnesota has a much better team IMO. but their stars playing like garbage leaving the Mavs close enough for Kyrie/Luka to take it with their clutch scoring and veteran knowledge vs. the young wolves essentially has been the difference in this series.

The Wolves have a good mix of vets and young guys but they do have a kind of deer in the headlights kind of look out there. They looked the same in a couple of those Nugget's games...

[liam]

Dallas is a bad match up for the Wolves as so many of their points come from deep. They also have two guys who can get their own shot off whenever they want but also set up teammates for shots on nearly every play. The Wolves have a lot of trouble closing games. The Mavs are really good closers.

[Phantom255x]

Hope the Wolves win today. Even if Dallas wins the series as we expect, I hope it can go 6 or 7 games.

[jambr380]

Hope the Wolves win today. Even if Dallas wins the series as we expect, I hope it can go 6 or 7 games.

In watching the game the other night, I was pulling for the Wolves, but I was fine with either outcome as long as nobody did anything well in the clutch. And then the best player left in the WCF goes and hits a dagger over the DPOY to go up (and win) by one.

But, yeah, at this point, the Wolves entire season is on the line. They need to win this game. I'd still rather play Dallas, though, so I'm not going to be heartbroken if the Mavs win and solidify their spot in the Finals.