Author Topic: This offseason seems weird  (Read 5839 times)

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Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #15 on: July 07, 2023, 09:48:15 AM »

Offline footey

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Let's see:

We are returning two All NBA Players, one made first team, the other 2nd team. Oh and they are 25 and 26 years old, just entering their prime.

We traded for an All Star level 7'3" center/power forward, 27, who just finished his best season, is an elite 3 point shooter who can post up and defend the paint.

We have 29 year old 2nd team all NBA defensive guard who is perfect complement to the other 3 named above, just finished his best shooting year.

We have 25 year old defensive center specialist fully recovering from knee surgery and is projected to be a future defensive player of the year candidate, who has the highest field goal percentage in the NBA.

We have dude how just won 6th man of the year, an elite 3 point shooter and decent dribble penetrator, who would start for most other NBA teams.

We return a stud 3 point marksman on a very team friendly contract.

I think we have to take stock of what we have to date, and feel quite good. I do.  Sure I hope we could get a decent big wing back up who can defend 4s on a minimum contract.  But all in all, I like where we are today a lot.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #16 on: July 07, 2023, 09:53:03 AM »

Offline celticinorlando

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Let's see:

We are returning two All NBA Players, one made first team, the other 2nd team. Oh and they are 25 and 26 years old, just entering their prime.

We traded for an All Star level 7'3" center/power forward, 27, who just finished his best season, is an elite 3 point shooter who can post up and defend the paint.

We have 29 year old 2nd team all NBA defensive guard who is perfect complement to the other 3 named above, just finished his best shooting year.

We have 25 year old defensive center specialist fully recovering from knee surgery and is projected to be a future defensive player of the year candidate, who has the highest field goal percentage in the NBA.

We have dude how just won 6th man of the year, an elite 3 point shooter and decent dribble penetrator, who would start for most other NBA teams.

We return a stud 3 point marksman on a very team friendly contract.

I think we have to take stock of what we have to date, and feel quite good. I do.  Sure I hope we could get a decent big wing back up who can defend 4s on a minimum contract.  But all in all, I like where we are today a lot.

The non court issues might their biggest obstacles...

1. Can they finish games without collapsing late
2. Can they not blow big leads
3. Will Joe improve as a coach and figure out how to use his rotation
4. Will Tatum become the alpha that he needs to be

I do like the additions of the assistant coaches. Cassell and Lee are GREAT. This should help quite a bit.
But Boston suffered from a lack of leadership and toughness at times and this has to be fixed.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #17 on: July 07, 2023, 10:00:16 AM »

Online DefenseWinsChamps

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I'm with you. We fans can sometimes fail to see the bigger picture. We will be in the mix again this year. Vegas has us as the favorites right now.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #18 on: July 07, 2023, 10:55:47 AM »

Offline Surferdad

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Feels about right for Brad. Signing marginal NBA players to play key roles off the bench. Basically the same as last season.

Don't think anything else is coming down the line to be honest with you. Team looks to be set other than a few 2 way deals at the end of the bench. Brissett was the big fish for Brad in free agency.

the more I think about it though, health aside our rotation is set. that is unless you believe PP/Hauser are not NBA rotation players. I personally think they are and can contribute. I mean are they any different than say Caleb martin/Struss talent wise?

Assuming heathly...I think regular season has a steady rotation of these players in some order

Tatum
Brown
White
KP
Rob
Al
Hauser
Brissett
PP

Walsh, Banton and Kornet play in garbage time.

only one you forgot there is Brogdon.

I added him. I am still wondering if he plays as the season starts tho with his injury. But if healthy he is a main piece.

Really like their 1-8 players. I do think Brissett can do the same things Grant did IF his shot from 3 is decent. He will hustle, rebound and defend. Same with Walsh. I would love to see the rookie get some minutes because he is uber athletic and works hard. Those two guys should be able to tag team and do well in everything but scoring departments.

Leaves PP and Hauser...hopefully Joe trusts them. Do not feel Kornet nor Banton bring anything to the party.
Y'all forgot about JD Davison. He will at least get garbage minutes but he better get more than that or it's a waste of a young asset and draft pick

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #19 on: July 07, 2023, 11:01:33 AM »

Offline footey

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Let's see:

We are returning two All NBA Players, one made first team, the other 2nd team. Oh and they are 25 and 26 years old, just entering their prime.

We traded for an All Star level 7'3" center/power forward, 27, who just finished his best season, is an elite 3 point shooter who can post up and defend the paint.

We have 29 year old 2nd team all NBA defensive guard who is perfect complement to the other 3 named above, just finished his best shooting year.

We have 25 year old defensive center specialist fully recovering from knee surgery and is projected to be a future defensive player of the year candidate, who has the highest field goal percentage in the NBA.

We have dude how just won 6th man of the year, an elite 3 point shooter and decent dribble penetrator, who would start for most other NBA teams.

We return a stud 3 point marksman on a very team friendly contract.

I think we have to take stock of what we have to date, and feel quite good. I do.  Sure I hope we could get a decent big wing back up who can defend 4s on a minimum contract.  But all in all, I like where we are today a lot.

The non court issues might their biggest obstacles...

1. Can they finish games without collapsing late
2. Can they not blow big leads
3. Will Joe improve as a coach and figure out how to use his rotation
4. Will Tatum become the alpha that he needs to be

I do like the additions of the assistant coaches. Cassell and Lee are GREAT. This should help quite a bit.
But Boston suffered from a lack of leadership and toughness at times and this has to be fixed.

I agree.  I think it is on Tatum and Brown to make their teammates better, to empower them to make plays. I can't count the number of times our best 3 point shooter (Hauser) is wide open and doesn't get the ball.   They have to fight tendency of hero ball. Ime got on them a lot for this.  Joe at least publicly does not.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2023, 11:15:43 AM »

Offline cman88

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Let's see:

We are returning two All NBA Players, one made first team, the other 2nd team. Oh and they are 25 and 26 years old, just entering their prime.

We traded for an All Star level 7'3" center/power forward, 27, who just finished his best season, is an elite 3 point shooter who can post up and defend the paint.

We have 29 year old 2nd team all NBA defensive guard who is perfect complement to the other 3 named above, just finished his best shooting year.

We have 25 year old defensive center specialist fully recovering from knee surgery and is projected to be a future defensive player of the year candidate, who has the highest field goal percentage in the NBA.

We have dude how just won 6th man of the year, an elite 3 point shooter and decent dribble penetrator, who would start for most other NBA teams.

We return a stud 3 point marksman on a very team friendly contract.

I think we have to take stock of what we have to date, and feel quite good. I do.  Sure I hope we could get a decent big wing back up who can defend 4s on a minimum contract.  But all in all, I like where we are today a lot.

The non court issues might their biggest obstacles...

1. Can they finish games without collapsing late
2. Can they not blow big leads
3. Will Joe improve as a coach and figure out how to use his rotation
4. Will Tatum become the alpha that he needs to be

I do like the additions of the assistant coaches. Cassell and Lee are GREAT. This should help quite a bit.
But Boston suffered from a lack of leadership and toughness at times and this has to be fixed.

I agree.  I think it is on Tatum and Brown to make their teammates better, to empower them to make plays. I can't count the number of times our best 3 point shooter (Hauser) is wide open and doesn't get the ball.   They have to fight tendency of hero ball. Ime got on them a lot for this.  Joe at least publicly does not.

And just to add. Will they actually move the ball and play as a team or just walk up the court and chuck up a poor 3

And

Will they actually come out every game with urgency? Or continue to act entitled that they can come out put up a lazy effort and still win based on talent?

Imo those 2 above are main reasons this team while they got far the past 2 years ultimately fell short. Inconsistent effort and just dumb basketball.

Other than the Nets series. Every series since then has just been inconsistent effort, and poor offense that dragged out series longer than they should've been and ended up in losses.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2023, 12:27:46 PM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Everyone is feeling out the new CBA

I hope they talk Brown into taking less so we can sign Oubre or Wood as they would add significant pop to our bench.

DL

Brown taking less in his extension has zero impact on anyone we sign this year.  We have a $5 million exception to use to sign a free agent, and if we use that exception, our salary is capped.  We can create about $4.8 million of space for that $5 million by dumping Champagnie and Kornet, so in essence we have $4.8 million.  Brown’s extension kicks in next year — we can’t touch his salary this year.

Brown taking less next year might have some small impact on the signings we could make next year, but with over $100 million committed to four other players, whether Brown makes $40 or $50 million, we’ll still be over the cap and have limited avenues for free agent signings, same as this year.  There might be a different trade we could make, but that’s about it.

Thanks for the clarification

Here is who I would be interested in signing

1. PJ Washington, F/C, Charlotte Hornets: At 6’7, 230 pounds, with a 7’3 wingspan, Washington is a big forward who finishes well inside and can stretch the floor as a solid three-point shooter. His defense graded out better than his offense according to EPM. He averaged one steal and 1.2 blocks per-36 minutes last season with the Hornets. He turns 25 years old before the season.

CHARLOTTE WOULD MATCH

2. Christian Wood, F/C, Dallas Mavericks: Wood is a gifted offensive big man who struggles on the defensive end. Wood made 59.4 percent of his two-pointers and 37.6 percent of his threes on 4.2 attempts per game last season with the Dallas Mavericks.

NO DEFENSE

3. Kelly Oubre, F, Charlotte Hornets: Oubre has a nice combination of size and athleticism on the wing, but his outside shot is streaky and his defense is a mixed bag. Oubre shot 31.9 percent from three last year with the Hornets, but still averaged a career-high 20.1 points per game by finishing well inside.

WOULD NOT BE HAPPY WITH BENCH ROLE

4. Ayo Dosunmu, G, Chicago Bulls: Dosunmu is a big guard who defends well but saw his three-point shot fall off in his second season. He uses his length to be an on-ball pest defensively, where he graded out in the 77th percentile of the league, per EPM. His offense was an eyesore last season (18th percentile, per EPM), but could get better if he can improve his 31.2 percent three-point stroke.

REGRESSED A BIT BUT TOUGH ON D

5. Paul Reed, C, Philadelphia 76ers: The 24-year-old big man attacks the glass hard on both ends and has racked up steals and blocks in a small role with the Sixers to start his career. His lack of shooting and passing skill limits him a bit, but he has some upside as a high-energy bench big.

WE NEED BIG DEPTH

6. Trenton Watford, F, Portland Trail Blazers: The 6’9 forward is an efficient scorer offensively but lacks mobility on the defensive end.

DEFENSE IS A PROBLEM

7. Dario Saric, C/F, Oklahoma City Thunder: Saric finally looked healthy during his brief stint with Oklahoma City last season after recovering from a torn ACL. He’s a skilled passer and shooter, but seems to have lost some mobility after the injury.

ANOTHER INJURED PERSON TO ADD TO OUR WALKING WOUNDED

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2023, 12:31:06 PM »

Offline Celtics2021

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Everyone is feeling out the new CBA

I hope they talk Brown into taking less so we can sign Oubre or Wood as they would add significant pop to our bench.

DL

Brown taking less in his extension has zero impact on anyone we sign this year.  We have a $5 million exception to use to sign a free agent, and if we use that exception, our salary is capped.  We can create about $4.8 million of space for that $5 million by dumping Champagnie and Kornet, so in essence we have $4.8 million.  Brown’s extension kicks in next year — we can’t touch his salary this year.

Brown taking less next year might have some small impact on the signings we could make next year, but with over $100 million committed to four other players, whether Brown makes $40 or $50 million, we’ll still be over the cap and have limited avenues for free agent signings, same as this year.  There might be a different trade we could make, but that’s about it.

Thanks for the clarification

Here is who I would be interested in signing

1. PJ Washington, F/C, Charlotte Hornets: At 6’7, 230 pounds, with a 7’3 wingspan, Washington is a big forward who finishes well inside and can stretch the floor as a solid three-point shooter. His defense graded out better than his offense according to EPM. He averaged one steal and 1.2 blocks per-36 minutes last season with the Hornets. He turns 25 years old before the season.

CHARLOTTE WOULD MATCH

2. Christian Wood, F/C, Dallas Mavericks: Wood is a gifted offensive big man who struggles on the defensive end. Wood made 59.4 percent of his two-pointers and 37.6 percent of his threes on 4.2 attempts per game last season with the Dallas Mavericks.

NO DEFENSE

3. Kelly Oubre, F, Charlotte Hornets: Oubre has a nice combination of size and athleticism on the wing, but his outside shot is streaky and his defense is a mixed bag. Oubre shot 31.9 percent from three last year with the Hornets, but still averaged a career-high 20.1 points per game by finishing well inside.

WOULD NOT BE HAPPY WITH BENCH ROLE

4. Ayo Dosunmu, G, Chicago Bulls: Dosunmu is a big guard who defends well but saw his three-point shot fall off in his second season. He uses his length to be an on-ball pest defensively, where he graded out in the 77th percentile of the league, per EPM. His offense was an eyesore last season (18th percentile, per EPM), but could get better if he can improve his 31.2 percent three-point stroke.

REGRESSED A BIT BUT TOUGH ON D -- IS A RESTRICTED FREE AGENT, QO IS MORE THAN $4.8M, CHI WOULD MATCH

5. Paul Reed, C, Philadelphia 76ers: The 24-year-old big man attacks the glass hard on both ends and has racked up steals and blocks in a small role with the Sixers to start his career. His lack of shooting and passing skill limits him a bit, but he has some upside as a high-energy bench big.

WE NEED BIG DEPTH - IS A RESTRICTED FREE AGENT, PHI WOULD MATCH


6. Trenton Watford, F, Portland Trail Blazers: The 6’9 forward is an efficient scorer offensively but lacks mobility on the defensive end.

DEFENSE IS A PROBLEM

7. Dario Saric, C/F, Oklahoma City Thunder: Saric finally looked healthy during his brief stint with Oklahoma City last season after recovering from a torn ACL. He’s a skilled passer and shooter, but seems to have lost some mobility after the injury.

ANOTHER INJURED PERSON TO ADD TO OUR WALKING WOUNDED

Added some additional context to your list above.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2023, 12:54:58 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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I really am not following this.  It started with kind of complaining that Brad is not doing anything, just signing cheap, mediocre players, but both this off season and last, the Celtics pulled off major trades that brought in impact players (Porzingis and Brogdon).  The year before that, there was a major trade that brought in Horford.  Also some "medium" moves such as signing Gallinari and trading for Muscala, that neither ended up helping much, but were moves.  But all people focus on are the vet min FAs that we don't sign.

Then the discussion drifted into how Tatum and Brown aren't finishers.  No off season move is going to fix that, if in fact that is even a real issue, but some how that is Brad Stevens fault too.

I think all in all, the moves that have been made to put a team around Tatum and Brown have been pretty good.  Sure, you can nit pick signing Noah Vonleh or whatever.  People complain about Hauser but he is a great value on his contract.  I have no complaints about Hauser, he was a great signing.  What do you expect from a min contract guy?

I see us as having a few holes still.  I would like to see the team make a trade with the TPE and some of the picks we have.  Target a bench PF to replace Grant.  I suggested Jalen Smith from IND.  I suspect they won't do a trade, that they will start the season more or less with what they have.  In the meantime, we have the best 1-7 in the league and Vegas has us as the favorite to win the title.  And people are complaining.  I don't get it.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2023, 01:32:18 PM »

Offline celticinorlando

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We need a back up PF that is nba talent

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2023, 01:42:33 PM »

Online Who

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We need a back up PF that is nba talent

I think that is Brissett.

Not sure there is any FA talent left available that can better him.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #26 on: July 07, 2023, 02:19:44 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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We need a back up PF that is nba talent

I think that is Brissett.

Not sure there is any FA talent left available that can better him.

The other option is a trade.  We have a $6.3M TPE and a bunch of draft picks.  The FA options are slim, looking at trades would open up a few more options.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #27 on: July 07, 2023, 02:24:31 PM »

Offline Atzar

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The thing that feels weirdest to me this offseason is how blatant the media bias has gotten.  So many "stories" and "reports" that are obviously fluff by one organization or another in attempts to sway public opinion or influence player value. 

"Brogdon's arm has fallen off.  Clippers concerned they won't be able to get it reattached in time for the start of next season."

"Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown looked to Marcus Smart for approval before eating their evening Spaghetti-O's, source says." 

"Come on guys!  You should want to pay $30M for Tyler Herro too!"

"Damian Lillard will commit seppuku if he doesn't get to play in Miami.  Don't care how, he wants it now."

Media guys have had loyalty to one team or another for a long time - spinning them favorable soundbites in exchange for early scoops or whatever.  But the campaigning and spinning and grandstanding has grown to absurd levels.  Unfortunately, I think I need to get used to it because it's here to stay. 

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #28 on: July 07, 2023, 02:41:56 PM »

Offline BitterJim

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Feels about right for Brad. Signing marginal NBA players to play key roles off the bench. Basically the same as last season.

Don't think anything else is coming down the line to be honest with you. Team looks to be set other than a few 2 way deals at the end of the bench. Brissett was the big fish for Brad in free agency.

the more I think about it though, health aside our rotation is set. that is unless you believe PP/Hauser are not NBA rotation players. I personally think they are and can contribute. I mean are they any different than say Caleb martin/Struss talent wise?

Assuming heathly...I think regular season has a steady rotation of these players in some order

Tatum
Brown
White
KP
Rob
Al
Hauser
Brissett
PP

Walsh, Banton and Kornet play in garbage time.

only one you forgot there is Brogdon.

I added him. I am still wondering if he plays as the season starts tho with his injury. But if healthy he is a main piece.

Really like their 1-8 players. I do think Brissett can do the same things Grant did IF his shot from 3 is decent. He will hustle, rebound and defend. Same with Walsh. I would love to see the rookie get some minutes because he is uber athletic and works hard. Those two guys should be able to tag team and do well in everything but scoring departments.

Leaves PP and Hauser...hopefully Joe trusts them. Do not feel Kornet nor Banton bring anything to the party.
Y'all forgot about JD Davison. He will at least get garbage minutes but he better get more than that or it's a waste of a young asset and draft pick

He was the 53rd pick. It's hard to say that pick was wasted no matter what
I'm bitter.

Re: This offseason seems weird
« Reply #29 on: July 07, 2023, 03:17:56 PM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Feels about right for Brad. Signing marginal NBA players to play key roles off the bench. Basically the same as last season.

Don't think anything else is coming down the line to be honest with you. Team looks to be set other than a few 2 way deals at the end of the bench. Brissett was the big fish for Brad in free agency.

the more I think about it though, health aside our rotation is set. that is unless you believe PP/Hauser are not NBA rotation players. I personally think they are and can contribute. I mean are they any different than say Caleb martin/Struss talent wise?

Assuming heathly...I think regular season has a steady rotation of these players in some order

Tatum
Brown
White
KP
Rob
Al
Hauser
Brissett
PP

Walsh, Banton and Kornet play in garbage time.

only one you forgot there is Brogdon.

I added him. I am still wondering if he plays as the season starts tho with his injury. But if healthy he is a main piece.

Really like their 1-8 players. I do think Brissett can do the same things Grant did IF his shot from 3 is decent. He will hustle, rebound and defend. Same with Walsh. I would love to see the rookie get some minutes because he is uber athletic and works hard. Those two guys should be able to tag team and do well in everything but scoring departments.

Leaves PP and Hauser...hopefully Joe trusts them. Do not feel Kornet nor Banton bring anything to the party.
Y'all forgot about JD Davison. He will at least get garbage minutes but he better get more than that or it's a waste of a young asset and draft pick

He was the 53rd pick. It's hard to say that pick was wasted no matter what

TP ….well done