Lebron calls Celtics fans racist

[MarcusSmartFanClub]

Just because people say racist things doesn't mean they are racist.

It does. I've been to games, I yelled things. I've booed. It's never once in my life crossed my mind to say something racially motivated. I think that's true of a lot of people.

If you're willing to scream racist things to get under a players skin during a game, you're in need of being honest with yourself.

I think this is a huge sign of racism. Thinking certain things are funny/worthy of mentioning, when others are disgusted.

[Kernewek]

Not that I believe the Red Sox example is being offered in anything even remotely resembling good faith, but let's play with it for a second.


If LeBron thinks Boston fans are racist af, what's a better way to stick it to those racists than to take their money and get rich off of it?


I mean, you go back three generations (or 100 years, take your pick) and black folks couldn't even play in the MLB - let alone own any part of the team.

It seems like entertaining racists would be something he'd look down on, regardless of how much money he made off of them?

Where do you draw the line on that logic?  In an extreme example, if a Jew is making a lot of money from the Nazis, is that really sticking it to Hitler?

Seriously. The comment made zero sense. Let me throw money at the racist owners and get rich with them. That will show them! Lol.

Speaking of things that make zero sense, no one is saying the owners of the Red Sox are racist except you.

I'll put it as plainly as I can: buying into the Red Sox ownership and saying Celtics fans can take you out of the game by being racist is not hypocritical.


The fact that you're struggling with this means that, for whatever reason, you don't understand what hypocrisy means or you don't understand how context works. I just want you to know that, whatever the reason may be, I'm here for you, and I support you in your journey.

Everyone is racist in Boston. Fans, Owners, parking attendants. Noticed how you didn’t want to answer Roy’s question regarding your logic. Guess that’s because there isn’t any.

Another strange post, as I replied to Roy's question right here:
https://forum.celticsstrong.com/index.php?topic=106921.msg3073674#msg3073674

[BruceBanner18]

Just because people say racist things doesn't mean they are racist.

It does. I've been to games, I yelled things. I've booed. It's never once in my life crossed my mind to say something racially motivated. I think that's true of a lot of people.

If you're willing to scream racist things to get under a players skin during a game, you're in need of being honest with yourself.

No it doesn't. Is Gandhi racist? He wrote a lot of racist things during his time as a lawyer in S Africa.

Curious, do you partake in the F player x chants? Do all the ppl who participated HATE LeBron and would act out that chant outside game time? Or would most of those ppl want a selfie and treat him with respect?

[Roy H.]

Just because people say racist things doesn't mean they are racist.

It does. I've been to games, I yelled things. I've booed. It's never once in my life crossed my mind to say something racially motivated. I think that's true of a lot of people.

If you're willing to scream racist things to get under a players skin during a game, you're in need of being honest with yourself.

No it doesn't. Is Gandhi racist? He wrote a lot of racist things during his time as a lawyer in S Africa.

Curious, do you partake in the F player x chants? Do all the ppl who participated HATE LeBron and would act out that chant outside game time? Or would most of those ppl want a selfie and treat him with respect?

I tend to agree with RJ87.  If you throw a racial slur at somebody to make them feel subhuman, it makes you a racist.

Vitriol isn't necessarily racist.  Racist vitriol is.

[RJ87]

Just because people say racist things doesn't mean they are racist.

It does. I've been to games, I yelled things. I've booed. It's never once in my life crossed my mind to say something racially motivated. I think that's true of a lot of people.

If you're willing to scream racist things to get under a players skin during a game, you're in need of being honest with yourself.

No it doesn't. Is Gandhi racist? He wrote a lot of racist things during his time as a lawyer in S Africa.

Curious, do you partake in the F player x chants? Do all the ppl who participated HATE LeBron and would act out that chant outside game time? Or would most of those ppl want a selfie and treat him with respect?

Gandhi? What does he have to do with how someone behaves at a basketball game?

No, I don't partake in the f player chants. I personally find it childish. But not all the people who do hate those players, but that is completely different from you what originally said.

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things. 

[MarcusSmartFanClub]

Just because people say racist things doesn't mean they are racist.

It does. I've been to games, I yelled things. I've booed. It's never once in my life crossed my mind to say something racially motivated. I think that's true of a lot of people.

If you're willing to scream racist things to get under a players skin during a game, you're in need of being honest with yourself.

No it doesn't. Is Gandhi racist? He wrote a lot of racist things during his time as a lawyer in S Africa.

Curious, do you partake in the F player x chants? Do all the ppl who participated HATE LeBron and would act out that chant outside game time? Or would most of those ppl want a selfie and treat him with respect?

Yes he was.

“In 1903, when Gandhi was in South Africa, he wrote that white people there should be "the predominating race." He also said black people "are troublesome, very dirty and live like animals."

After reading that, how can anyone conclude that he wasn’t racist? I guess one could deny that it was said, pretend like it was merely a joke, or say that he didn’t actually mean it….

The nuance that is being missed is that someone can be racist AND also have good character traits. It isn’t all or nothing.

The F player chants are horrible and embarrassing.

[Roy H.]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

[MarcusSmartFanClub]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

In theory, yes. Are they actually risking expulsion from the Garden? In my experiences, I’ve heard laughter, not derision from such behavior.

[Roy H.]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

In theory, yes. Are they actually risking expulsion from the Garden? In my experiences, I’ve heard laughter, not derision from such behavior.

I'm curious:  what have you heard from Celtics fans, and on how many occasions?  In comparison to how many times you've been to TD Garden?

I've heard lots of F-bombs and lots of annoying heckling, but never a racial slur or a remark that I deemed racist.  That doesn't mean they're not happening, I just haven't heard them.

[MarcusSmartFanClub]

Def not every time. I’ve prob been to over 50 Celtics games in my life and have heard the N word a handful of times. Primate comparisons, jokes about black people and fatherhood, jokes about intelligence, jokes about work ethic. I don’t keep a ledger. I know I’m not the only one that heard these comments. Most people don’t want to engage with a drunk person out of fear.

My thought is that this type of talk is normalized for many, so they don’t even blink. I’m 100% calling this crap out on a golf course or locker room going forward. My HS buddies would tell me to not be so sensitive. I’ve been called a N word lover. Here in beautiful MA.

Roy, I believe that you mentioned you live in Maine. The demographics are pretty similar. Are you shocked by this? You didn’t grow up with racism?

[RJ87]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

And to me, that says more than anything that the person arguing has been privileged enough to not be on the receiving of racist language or attacks. As someone who has had a few incidents in their lifetime including a really horrific one in high school where I was called the n-word and spit in the face, I could never want to make another person feel that way. Not just the athlete, but other fans in the stands who may be of that race or ethnicity.

[BruceBanner18]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

Yup that's it. And I'd argue that the person yelling about cancer, your kids, your ugly wife, your mom are just as "off kilter".

But let's be real .. it's part of basketball culture. Anyone see Hustle? Was Anthony Edwards character being racist comparing the Spanish player a bull and matador? Or off kilter when talking about his kids to get in his head?

Another question, if LeBron he was fine with the racist and/or ugly comments why do any of you care? He obviously sees it like I do.

If you said some racist stuff to me during competition or an argument I would take it as ish talking...just like LeBron. I certainly wouldn't go right to this dude wants to oppress or lynch me.

[MarcusSmartFanClub]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

Yup that's it. And I'd argue that the person yelling about cancer, your kids, your ugly wife, your mom are just as "off kilter".

But let's be real .. it's part of basketball culture. Anyone see Hustle? Was Anthony Edwards character being racist comparing the Spanish player a bull and matador? Or off kilter when talking about his kids to get in his head?

Another question, if LeBron he was fine with the racist and/or ugly comments why do any of you care? He obviously sees it like I do.

If you said some racist stuff to me during competition or an argument I would take it as ish talking...just like LeBron. I certainly wouldn't go right to this dude wants to oppress or lynch me.

So we’re moving from “this doesn’t happen” to “it’s not a big deal”?

[BruceBanner18]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

Yup that's it. And I'd argue that the person yelling about cancer, your kids, your ugly wife, your mom are just as "off kilter".

But let's be real .. it's part of basketball culture. Anyone see Hustle? Was Anthony Edwards character being racist comparing the Spanish player a bull and matador? Or off kilter when talking about his kids to get in his head?

Another question, if LeBron he was fine with the racist and/or ugly comments why do any of you care? He obviously sees it like I do.

If you said some racist stuff to me during competition or an argument I would take it as ish talking...just like LeBron. I certainly wouldn't go right to this dude wants to oppress or lynch me.

So we’re moving from “this doesn’t happen” to “it’s not a big deal”?

It wasn't according to the man quoted who is black and said "it's fine". then a bunch of apparently white folks have decided he's not smart enough to understand it's not fine?

[Roy H.]

We're just going to fundamentally disagree here. I can't reconcile or warp my mind enough to understand how someone who doesn't old any racial biases can turn around and yell racist things.

As an attorney, I can warp my mind, so I'll give it a try.

I think what he's saying is "Listen, everybody in America has been exposed to racist language.  We know what it looks like.  We know the slurs, the expressions, whatever.  And, we know it can get in the head of certain players.  It's similar to KG attacking Charlie V. about cancer.  It's a potential soft spot, so I'm going to exploit it.  I don't believe Black players are subhuman.  That's a ridiculous sentiment.  But, I'm willing to say anything to help get my team a win, and if that means mimic-ing racists to get under Lebron's skin, then that's a price I'm willing to pay".

So, that's the argument.  It would make me ask the question, though:  how off-kilter must a fan be to degrade himself to hurling racial slurs -- risking permanent expulsion from the Garden in the process -- just to get inside an opponent's head?

Yup that's it. And I'd argue that the person yelling about cancer, your kids, your ugly wife, your mom are just as "off kilter".

But let's be real .. it's part of basketball culture. Anyone see Hustle? Was Anthony Edwards character being racist comparing the Spanish player a bull and matador? Or off kilter when talking about his kids to get in his head?

Another question, if LeBron he was fine with the racist and/or ugly comments why do any of you care? He obviously sees it like I do.

If you said some racist stuff to me during competition or an argument I would take it as ish talking...just like LeBron. I certainly wouldn't go right to this dude wants to oppress or lynch me.

I suspect it bothers Lebron on a human level.  He's a professional with a high level of concentration that can compartmentalize stuff.  It doesn't really make it okay. 

Plus, even if you could somehow say "it's the same as trash talking on the court" (it isn't), aren't these people subjecting hundreds of people besides Lebron to racial slurs?  What about the ten year old black kid sitting two rows in front of you?