Potentially Pleasant Problem: What if Brogdon Outplays Smart on D?

[GreenlyGreeny]

We all know Brogdon can shoot and facilitate better than Smart, but he’s always been known as a good defender too. His drawback has been his injury history. Now what if he out-shines Smart on both ends when he comes off the bench, and stays healthy? Brogdon is a high BBIQ guy who may just absolutely excel in this system.

I think the solution is simpler than may be obvious, and may solve the question of who replaces Horford in a year:

Brogdon/D-White
Smart/D-White
JB/Batman
JT/Horford
Timelord/Horford

I’m calling it right here and now: Assuming we make no more trades, that’s our starting lineup/main rotations no later than 1/1/23 with Pritchard, Gallinari and Hauser as the main backups when we have injuries (Kornet gets time when Timelord/Horford are both injured).

I think we are headed to banner 18. I really do.

[droopdog7]

I think smart going to the bench has the potential to also be bad.  I wouldn’t call if pleasant.

[GreenlyGreeny]

I think smart going to the bench has the potential to also be bad.  I wouldn’t call if pleasant.

He still starts and leads the defense, just at the 2 instead of point (like many years prior to 2021-2022). They could spin it to Smart as running a dual-PG, twin-headed monster.

[Who]

He can't. He is too slow.

Brogdon is a solid but unexceptional defender. He defends the SG position the best but can also defend the SF. He is at his worst man-to-man at PG but is a plus team defender there.

Smart is a truly great team defender and a solid man-to-man defender at PG. No comparison.

[gouki88]

Unless we actually traded for someone like Jrue Holiday, this isn't really possible. Brogdon is a solid defender with good versatility - Smart is the DPOY.

It's like wondering if Grant will suddenly become a superior defender to Al.

[pokeKingCurtis]

Greenly were you one of the people who wanted the Celts to get a "true PF" when they sucked early in the 2021-22 season?

I agree with the others here in that he won't outperform Smart, but feels like he'll end up outperforming expectations for some reason.

Much like how Rob Williams at PF somehow ended up being a good idea.

[No Nickname]

He can't. He is too slow.

Brogdon is a solid but unexceptional defender. He defends the SG position the best but can also defend the SF. He is at his worst man-to-man at PG but is a plus team defender there.

Smart is a truly great team defender and a solid man-to-man defender at PG. No comparison.

Solid but unexceptional?  Man, you’re just pulling that out of your ass.

He’s an excellent defender and has an ACC DPOY under Tony Bennett to prove it.

He’s also done it on the pro level. That’s nonsense.

[gouki88]

He can't. He is too slow.

Brogdon is a solid but unexceptional defender. He defends the SG position the best but can also defend the SF. He is at his worst man-to-man at PG but is a plus team defender there.

Smart is a truly great team defender and a solid man-to-man defender at PG. No comparison.

Solid but unexceptional?  Man, you’re just pulling that out of your ass.

He’s an excellent defender and has an ACC DPOY under Tony Bennett to prove it.

He’s also done it on the pro level. That’s nonsense.

Not only is your post rude, but the only evidence you've provided to counter the claim is an irrelevant college award. Brogdon has never sniffed defensive accolades in the NBA because he is solid. Not great, definitely not bad.

[#1P4P]

The Smart-Brown-Tatum-Horford-Williams was by far the best 5-player lineup during the NBA regular season and the main lineup that brought us to the Finals.

Pre-Brogdon acquisition, Smart was already defensive about the true PG talk and Brown still carried a chip on his shoulder from all the gossip and trade proposals from the Boston media and fans; bringing Brogdon in to sit prematurely sit Al, and take the ball out of Smart’s hands to put it into Brogdon’s is another slight to simmer on.

There will be plenty of time to explore how Brogdon looks in those lineups, just not as the starter to open the season. He’s going to have to wait and prove his value on the floor.

[nickagneta]

Stevens and Udoka have already declared the Celtics are sticking with their starting two big lineup and that Smart will be the starting PG. They mention players brought into the team must fit into the current chemistry, play their roles and understand the need to sacrifice in order for to be successful in their roles.

Brad's and Ime's released comments render this entire thread moot.

[Celtics2021]

Stevens and Udoka have already declared the Celtics are sticking with their starting two big lineup and that Smart will be the starting PG. They mention players brought into the team must fit into the current chemistry, play their roles and understand the need to sacrifice in order for to be successful in their roles.

Brad's and Ime's released comments render this entire thread moot.

While I for the most part believe this, I would also note that so long as a team has its starting 5 from the prior year still on the roster, they’re generally unlikely to announce a new starting lineup as a part of summer roster changes, barring something unusual like the signing/acquisition of a max contract player (which rarely coincides with a team maintaining its starting 5 anyway).

In other words, I would not take their words today as gospel for what will happen in October or November.

[Yuckabuck33]

Stevens and Udoka have already declared the Celtics are sticking with their starting two big lineup and that Smart will be the starting PG. They mention players brought into the team must fit into the current chemistry, play their roles and understand the need to sacrifice in order for to be successful in their roles.

Brad's and Ime's released comments render this entire thread moot.

This is spot on.
We finally got away from Danny's love of score first point guards and made the Finals. I feel like all the talk of benching Marcus (or playing him at the 2!) is like a guy looking for a new girlfriend but wanting her to be just like his ex. I don't understand the Smart hate around here.

[jay]

Smart 32 Brogdon 16
Brown 32 Brogdon 16
Tatum 24 White 24
Horford 16 Grant 8  Gallinari 16  Tatum 8
Rob 24 Horford 8 Grant 8 (Free Agent Center

Total minutes:

Smart 32
Brogdon 32
Tatum 32
Brown 32
White 24
Horford 24
Rob 24
Grant 16
Gallinari 16
Free Agent center 8
Pritchard 0

If they start with the 2 big lineup, I imagine they will start both halves that way. Probably end up playing "small ball" half the time.

[Kernewek]

Stevens and Udoka have already declared the Celtics are sticking with their starting two big lineup and that Smart will be the starting PG. They mention players brought into the team must fit into the current chemistry, play their roles and understand the need to sacrifice in order for to be successful in their roles.

Brad's and Ime's released comments render this entire thread moot.

Untill it doesn't.

[Who]

He can't. He is too slow.

Brogdon is a solid but unexceptional defender. He defends the SG position the best but can also defend the SF. He is at his worst man-to-man at PG but is a plus team defender there.

Smart is a truly great team defender and a solid man-to-man defender at PG. No comparison.

Solid but unexceptional?  Man, you’re just pulling that out of your ass.

He’s an excellent defender and has an ACC DPOY under Tony Bennett to prove it.

He’s also done it on the pro level. That’s nonsense.

The NBA is a bigger faster more athletic league than the NCAA. Just because you were a top defender in the NCAA does not mean you will be one in the NBA.

When Brogdon was in Milwaukee, it was noted he lacked the quickness to cover top athletes at the SG position he was playing. As a 3&D player in MIL, Brogdon was considered an elite offensive player (50-40-90 guy with 4apg along with 15ppg) but only a solid defender rather than an elite one. There were always questions whether he should be considered an elite or even true 3&D guy (like Raja Bell) because Brogdon's defense wasn't good enough (or whether he was just a very good offensive player with solid D).

When Brogdon went to Indiana, he shifted down a position and his so-so quickness at SG became even more exposed on defense against quicker ball-handling guards that he met at PG. His size and switchability allowed him to be a positive as a a team defender as a big PG but he struggled in his one-on-one assignments at his position.

Brogdon is a useful defender but he is not Smart. Nor is he D White. Both of who are high level / exceptional defensive players.


Edit: Remember that guy BOS drafted 10 years ago named JaJuan Johnson (JJJ). He was a defensive player in the college but he was awful in the NBA. He didn't have enough muscle for the NBA game. NBA is bigger, faster, stronger, more athletic. Just because you were a great defender in college does not mean you will be a great defender in the NBA.


Brogdon as a big defensive PG needs quick mobile bigs behind him to help cover his lack of speed. The good news is we have that in BOS. We have Horford and Rob Williams and Grant Williams. Lots of mobile big men defenders to cover Brogdon's weakness defensively and to allow Brogdon's strengths (size, switchability) to add to our team D. That is the good news. We should be happy with that.