Author Topic: Credit to Ainge?  (Read 13515 times)

0 Members and 0 Guests are viewing this topic.

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #45 on: March 24, 2022, 10:33:59 PM »

Offline gouki88

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31552
  • Tommy Points: 3142
  • 2019 & 2021 CS Historical Draft Champion
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #46 on: March 24, 2022, 10:37:41 PM »

Offline pokeKingCurtis

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3733
  • Tommy Points: 280
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.

I see it more as like a different strokes for different folks thing.

Danny goes for the kill always. I keep beating this drum but Kyrie, Hayward, Horford, Jays, with one of the Morris twins and Rozier off the bench - that would have been a team for the centuries.

Danny keeps his powder dry. I think he would have just lived out the rest of the Kemba contract, kept the 1st and kept adding value.

He did it before with KG, Ray. That group should have won multiple championships. Two potential perrenial contenders in the span of 10 **** years - what more can you ask for? Obviously there's gonna be down years but, man, high highs.

Brad builds his teams more organically, as you described. More than one road to Rome.

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #47 on: March 24, 2022, 10:46:09 PM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2116
  • Tommy Points: 94
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
« Last Edit: March 24, 2022, 10:53:20 PM by GreenlyGreeny »

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #48 on: March 24, 2022, 11:00:52 PM »

Offline gouki88

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31552
  • Tommy Points: 3142
  • 2019 & 2021 CS Historical Draft Champion
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
You're having an argument about something that I never said, but go off.

The Horford trade was definitely set up by Ainge. Without doubt. Horford was also initially an Ainge signing, and Ainge wanted to maintain Horford but he chose Philly's money.

Theis was an Ainge pickup that you're trying to credit to Brad. Al and Theis left because they got greedy (in Al's case) or got massive offers (in Theis' case).

Then you go onto inventing narratives about the 2018 draft and how staying "loyal" to IT would have been a good move (it would not have).

This post was almost as bad as some of your trade ideas.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #49 on: March 24, 2022, 11:13:27 PM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2116
  • Tommy Points: 94
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
You're having an argument about something that I never said, but go off.

The Horford trade was definitely set up by Ainge. Without doubt. Horford was also initially an Ainge signing, and Ainge wanted to maintain Horford but he chose Philly's money.

Let us get this straight: Ainge thought Horford was not worth paying what he got on the open market when we had his Bird Rights…and then, with absolutely no evidence, we think Ainge was all over a trade to take on the third year of that contract he previously considered not worthy of the Celtics? 🧐

Quote
Theis was an Ainge pickup that you're trying to credit to Brad. Al and Theis left because they got greedy (in Al's case) or got massive offers (in Theis' case).

Ainge literally traded Theis to Chicago a year ago. And then Brad traded to get Theis back weeks ago. How in the heck does this pickup get credited to Danny? He treated Theis wrong trading him out at the deadline last year. That was the 2021 version of telling Hayward to take a hike, which itself was the 2020 version of telling Horford to take a hike back in 2019. All three of those decisions surely had a huge, negative impact on morale/chemistry, which is why Brad fixed these mistakes by Danny ASAP. Brad gets credit for fixing Danny’s mistakes here…

Quote
Then you go onto inventing narratives about the 2018 draft and how staying "loyal" to IT would have been a good move (it would not have).

Given what Kyrie brought to us, we clearly would have been better off with a toast IT in 2017-2018 (whom would not have received the extension he desired because we knew he was toast in 2017) and the 2018 Nets pick that may have yielded another top caliber player like SGA, Bridge or possibly Doncic if we had moved the treasure chest to beat Dallas for the 3rd overall pick (recall Dallas moved up…if we had, had the 8th overall pick, perhaps we could have found a way to beat out Dallas). That’s the way Red would have done it, and we’d be owning the league if that happened. That’s why Red had 16 rings and Danny has 2008. That’s the difference between a legendary/great executive and a good executive. Why people continue to worship the Utah Jazz executive Danny Ainge like he’s Red is beyond me, particularly considering all signs point to Brad Stevens being the next Pat Riley of moving from coaching to being an excellent GM…

Quote
This post was almost as bad as some of your trade ideas.

Like the trade idea a year ago to move Kemba for Horford? Or how about the idea four months ago to move Schröder for Theis? Both those ideas were ridiculed and I was among the first to suggest them.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2022, 11:28:15 PM by GreenlyGreeny »

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #50 on: March 24, 2022, 11:31:13 PM »

Offline gouki88

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31552
  • Tommy Points: 3142
  • 2019 & 2021 CS Historical Draft Champion
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
You're having an argument about something that I never said, but go off.

The Horford trade was definitely set up by Ainge. Without doubt. Horford was also initially an Ainge signing, and Ainge wanted to maintain Horford but he chose Philly's money.

Let us get this straight: Ainge thought Horford was not worth paying what he got on the open market when we had his Bird Rights…and then, with absolutely no evidence, we think Ainge was all over a trade to take on the third year of that contract he previously considered not worthy of the Celtics? 🧐

Quote
Theis was an Ainge pickup that you're trying to credit to Brad. Al and Theis left because they got greedy (in Al's case) or got massive offers (in Theis' case).

Ainge literally traded Theis to Chicago a year ago. And then Brad traded to get Theis back weeks ago. How in the heck does this pickup get credited to Danny? He treated Theis wrong trading him out at the deadline last year. That was the 2021 version of the 2020 version of telling Hayward to take a hike, which was the 2019 version of telling Horford to take a hike. All three of those decisions surely had a huge, negative impact on morale/chemistry, which is why Brad fixed these mistakes by Danny ASAP. Brad gets credit for fixing Danny’s mistakes here…

Quote
Then you go onto inventing narratives about the 2018 draft and how staying "loyal" to IT would have been a good move (it would not have).

Given what Kyrie brought to us, we clearly would have been better off with a toast IT in 2017-2018 (whom would not have received the extension he desired because we knew he was toast in 2017) and the 2018 Nets pick that may have yielded another top caliber player like SGA, Bridge or possibly Doncic if we had moved the treasure chest to beat Dallas for the 3rd overall pick. That’s the way Red would have done it, and we’d be owning the league if that happened. That’s why Red had 16 rings and Danny has 2008. That’s the difference between a legendary/great executive and a good executive. Why people continue to worship the Utah Jazz executive Danny Ainge like he’s Red is beyond me, particularly considering all signs point to Brad Stevens being the next Pat Riley of coaching and being an excellent GM…

Quote
This post was almost as bad as some of your trade ideas.

Like the trade idea a year ago to move Kemba for Horford? Or how about the idea four months ago to move Schröder for Theis? Both those ideas were ridiculed and I was among the first to suggest them.
You're right about Theis being traded, I got confused.

Given the overpay Theis received, I don't have any problem with us moving him.

The Horford move was obviously influenced by, if not negotiated by Ainge.

Trying to paint moving the shell of IT as missing out on Doncic is hilariously dishonest.

A broken clock is right twice a day. You also wanted us to trade for Kyrie again (despite all your crapping on him in this post...), wanted us to trade Tatum & Horford for Lillard and Simmons, wanted to trade Tatum for OKC's trove of picks (while going on about how the Jays don't work as a duo, how Jayson is going to leave for LA first chance he gets), wanted to trade Tatum, Timelord and 5 firsts for Doncic, and my personal favourite - trading Tatum and Brown for Morant, Haliburton, Davion Mitchell, Harrison Barnes, Steven Adams and a pick.

Forgive me for not giving you credit for the ones you get right when there are 100 ones you've gotten wrong
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #51 on: March 24, 2022, 11:31:46 PM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2116
  • Tommy Points: 94
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.

I see it more as like a different strokes for different folks thing.

Danny goes for the kill always. I keep beating this drum but Kyrie, Hayward, Horford, Jays, with one of the Morris twins and Rozier off the bench - that would have been a team for the centuries.

Danny keeps his powder dry. I think he would have just lived out the rest of the Kemba contract, kept the 1st and kept adding value.

He did it before with KG, Ray. That group should have won multiple championships. Two potential perrenial contenders in the span of 10 **** years - what more can you ask for? Obviously there's gonna be down years but, man, high highs.

Good post. To me, though, the high highs is 17 titles, not just 2008. The reason why Celtic Pride is a thing and this franchise is legendary is all of the titles, not just 2008. Going a dozen years without a title was long enough. The guy was the poor man’s version of Red, which was just fine, but everyone needs to stop worshipping him like he was Red. He’s now an executive with the Utah Jazz, for crying out loud, and Brad oozes Celtic Pride and will prove to be the better GM very soon when he matches Danny’s one title in, what, 16 years?

The credit goes to current Celtics, not an executive of the Utah Jazz. Move on, Danny worshippers. It’s over…

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #52 on: March 24, 2022, 11:41:57 PM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2116
  • Tommy Points: 94
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
You're having an argument about something that I never said, but go off.

The Horford trade was definitely set up by Ainge. Without doubt. Horford was also initially an Ainge signing, and Ainge wanted to maintain Horford but he chose Philly's money.

Let us get this straight: Ainge thought Horford was not worth paying what he got on the open market when we had his Bird Rights…and then, with absolutely no evidence, we think Ainge was all over a trade to take on the third year of that contract he previously considered not worthy of the Celtics? 🧐

Quote
Theis was an Ainge pickup that you're trying to credit to Brad. Al and Theis left because they got greedy (in Al's case) or got massive offers (in Theis' case).

Ainge literally traded Theis to Chicago a year ago. And then Brad traded to get Theis back weeks ago. How in the heck does this pickup get credited to Danny? He treated Theis wrong trading him out at the deadline last year. That was the 2021 version of the 2020 version of telling Hayward to take a hike, which was the 2019 version of telling Horford to take a hike. All three of those decisions surely had a huge, negative impact on morale/chemistry, which is why Brad fixed these mistakes by Danny ASAP. Brad gets credit for fixing Danny’s mistakes here…

Quote
Then you go onto inventing narratives about the 2018 draft and how staying "loyal" to IT would have been a good move (it would not have).

Given what Kyrie brought to us, we clearly would have been better off with a toast IT in 2017-2018 (whom would not have received the extension he desired because we knew he was toast in 2017) and the 2018 Nets pick that may have yielded another top caliber player like SGA, Bridge or possibly Doncic if we had moved the treasure chest to beat Dallas for the 3rd overall pick. That’s the way Red would have done it, and we’d be owning the league if that happened. That’s why Red had 16 rings and Danny has 2008. That’s the difference between a legendary/great executive and a good executive. Why people continue to worship the Utah Jazz executive Danny Ainge like he’s Red is beyond me, particularly considering all signs point to Brad Stevens being the next Pat Riley of coaching and being an excellent GM…

Quote
This post was almost as bad as some of your trade ideas.

Like the trade idea a year ago to move Kemba for Horford? Or how about the idea four months ago to move Schröder for Theis? Both those ideas were ridiculed and I was among the first to suggest them.
You're right about Theis being traded, I got confused.

Given the overpay Theis received, I don't have any problem with us moving him.

The Horford move was obviously influenced by, if not negotiated by Ainge.

Trying to paint moving the shell of IT as missing out on Doncic is hilariously dishonest.

A broken clock is right twice a day. You also wanted us to trade for Kyrie again (despite all your crapping on him in this post...), wanted us to trade Tatum & Horford for Lillard and Simmons, wanted to trade Tatum for OKC's trove of picks (while going on about how the Jays don't work as a duo, how Jayson is going to leave for LA first chance he gets), wanted to trade Tatum, Timelord and 5 firsts for Doncic, and my personal favourite - trading Tatum and Brown for Morant, Haliburton, Davion Mitchell, Harrison Barnes, Steven Adams and a pick.

Forgive me for not giving you credit for the ones you get right when there are 100 ones you've gotten wrong

What can I say other than it’s very therapeutic to fantasize about ways to see us win when we’re losing? But do you know what? I love what we’ve got now. Of our ten highest paid players, I literally would not trade anybody now except potentially Pritchard (I’ve still got high hopes he’ll pull it together on defense) and Nesmith (little faith of him turning it around, but who knows?). Obviously if a top five player became available that changes the calculus since Tatum is our only true untouchable (and top five player now IMHO). Imagining Tatum with Doncic has always been my wildest fantasy, with Jokic a close second.

I love this style of play, I love this winning, I think title 18 is weeks away, and I’ll be [dang]ed staying silent while Danny worshippers who won’t let it go suggest a member of the Utah Jazz should get more credit than our head coach and GM/ex-coach…

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #53 on: March 24, 2022, 11:46:31 PM »

Offline gouki88

  • NCE
  • Red Auerbach
  • *******************************
  • Posts: 31552
  • Tommy Points: 3142
  • 2019 & 2021 CS Historical Draft Champion
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
You're having an argument about something that I never said, but go off.

The Horford trade was definitely set up by Ainge. Without doubt. Horford was also initially an Ainge signing, and Ainge wanted to maintain Horford but he chose Philly's money.

Let us get this straight: Ainge thought Horford was not worth paying what he got on the open market when we had his Bird Rights…and then, with absolutely no evidence, we think Ainge was all over a trade to take on the third year of that contract he previously considered not worthy of the Celtics? 🧐

Quote
Theis was an Ainge pickup that you're trying to credit to Brad. Al and Theis left because they got greedy (in Al's case) or got massive offers (in Theis' case).

Ainge literally traded Theis to Chicago a year ago. And then Brad traded to get Theis back weeks ago. How in the heck does this pickup get credited to Danny? He treated Theis wrong trading him out at the deadline last year. That was the 2021 version of the 2020 version of telling Hayward to take a hike, which was the 2019 version of telling Horford to take a hike. All three of those decisions surely had a huge, negative impact on morale/chemistry, which is why Brad fixed these mistakes by Danny ASAP. Brad gets credit for fixing Danny’s mistakes here…

Quote
Then you go onto inventing narratives about the 2018 draft and how staying "loyal" to IT would have been a good move (it would not have).

Given what Kyrie brought to us, we clearly would have been better off with a toast IT in 2017-2018 (whom would not have received the extension he desired because we knew he was toast in 2017) and the 2018 Nets pick that may have yielded another top caliber player like SGA, Bridge or possibly Doncic if we had moved the treasure chest to beat Dallas for the 3rd overall pick. That’s the way Red would have done it, and we’d be owning the league if that happened. That’s why Red had 16 rings and Danny has 2008. That’s the difference between a legendary/great executive and a good executive. Why people continue to worship the Utah Jazz executive Danny Ainge like he’s Red is beyond me, particularly considering all signs point to Brad Stevens being the next Pat Riley of coaching and being an excellent GM…

Quote
This post was almost as bad as some of your trade ideas.

Like the trade idea a year ago to move Kemba for Horford? Or how about the idea four months ago to move Schröder for Theis? Both those ideas were ridiculed and I was among the first to suggest them.
You're right about Theis being traded, I got confused.

Given the overpay Theis received, I don't have any problem with us moving him.

The Horford move was obviously influenced by, if not negotiated by Ainge.

Trying to paint moving the shell of IT as missing out on Doncic is hilariously dishonest.

A broken clock is right twice a day. You also wanted us to trade for Kyrie again (despite all your crapping on him in this post...), wanted us to trade Tatum & Horford for Lillard and Simmons, wanted to trade Tatum for OKC's trove of picks (while going on about how the Jays don't work as a duo, how Jayson is going to leave for LA first chance he gets), wanted to trade Tatum, Timelord and 5 firsts for Doncic, and my personal favourite - trading Tatum and Brown for Morant, Haliburton, Davion Mitchell, Harrison Barnes, Steven Adams and a pick.

Forgive me for not giving you credit for the ones you get right when there are 100 ones you've gotten wrong

What can I say other than it’s very therapeutic to fantasize about ways to see us win when we’re losing? But do you know what? I love what we’ve got now. Of our ten highest paid players, I literally would not trade anybody now except potentially Pritchard (I’ve still got high hopes he’ll pull it together on defense) and Nesmith (little faith of him turning it around, but who knows?). Obviously if a top five player became available that changes the calculus since Tatum is our only true untouchable (and top five player now IMHO). Imagining Tatum with Doncic has always been my wildest fantasy, with Jokic a close second.

I love this style of play, I love this winning, I think title 18 is weeks away, and I’ll be [dang]ed staying silent while Danny worshippers who won’t let it go suggest a member of the Utah Jazz should get more credit than our head coach and GM/ex-coach…
It's just funny to me that you're so adamant in the defence of Brad and this roster despite spending the majority of your time trying to trade every single player on this roster.
'23 Historical Draft: Orlando Magic.

PG: Terry Porter (90-91) / Steve Francis (00-01)
SG: Joe Dumars (92-93) / Jeff Hornacek (91-92) / Jerry Stackhouse (00-01)
SF: Brandon Roy (08-09) / Walter Davis (78-79)
PF: Terry Cummings (84-85) / Paul Millsap (15-16)
C: Chris Webber (00-01) / Ralph Sampson (83-84) / Andrew Bogut (09-10)

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #54 on: March 24, 2022, 11:48:56 PM »

Offline GreenlyGreeny

  • NCE
  • Bailey Howell
  • **
  • Posts: 2116
  • Tommy Points: 94
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.
There is an incredible amount of misinformation in this post

Danny is now an executive with the Utah Jazz, so feel free to continue believing ownership did not choose Brad over Danny and Danny chose to “retire”…the rest of us will believe something more compatible with Danny being an executive with the Utah Jazz now rather than, say, the Boston Celtics…
You're having an argument about something that I never said, but go off.

The Horford trade was definitely set up by Ainge. Without doubt. Horford was also initially an Ainge signing, and Ainge wanted to maintain Horford but he chose Philly's money.

Let us get this straight: Ainge thought Horford was not worth paying what he got on the open market when we had his Bird Rights…and then, with absolutely no evidence, we think Ainge was all over a trade to take on the third year of that contract he previously considered not worthy of the Celtics? 🧐

Quote
Theis was an Ainge pickup that you're trying to credit to Brad. Al and Theis left because they got greedy (in Al's case) or got massive offers (in Theis' case).

Ainge literally traded Theis to Chicago a year ago. And then Brad traded to get Theis back weeks ago. How in the heck does this pickup get credited to Danny? He treated Theis wrong trading him out at the deadline last year. That was the 2021 version of the 2020 version of telling Hayward to take a hike, which was the 2019 version of telling Horford to take a hike. All three of those decisions surely had a huge, negative impact on morale/chemistry, which is why Brad fixed these mistakes by Danny ASAP. Brad gets credit for fixing Danny’s mistakes here…

Quote
Then you go onto inventing narratives about the 2018 draft and how staying "loyal" to IT would have been a good move (it would not have).

Given what Kyrie brought to us, we clearly would have been better off with a toast IT in 2017-2018 (whom would not have received the extension he desired because we knew he was toast in 2017) and the 2018 Nets pick that may have yielded another top caliber player like SGA, Bridge or possibly Doncic if we had moved the treasure chest to beat Dallas for the 3rd overall pick. That’s the way Red would have done it, and we’d be owning the league if that happened. That’s why Red had 16 rings and Danny has 2008. That’s the difference between a legendary/great executive and a good executive. Why people continue to worship the Utah Jazz executive Danny Ainge like he’s Red is beyond me, particularly considering all signs point to Brad Stevens being the next Pat Riley of coaching and being an excellent GM…

Quote
This post was almost as bad as some of your trade ideas.

Like the trade idea a year ago to move Kemba for Horford? Or how about the idea four months ago to move Schröder for Theis? Both those ideas were ridiculed and I was among the first to suggest them.
You're right about Theis being traded, I got confused.

Given the overpay Theis received, I don't have any problem with us moving him.

The Horford move was obviously influenced by, if not negotiated by Ainge.

Trying to paint moving the shell of IT as missing out on Doncic is hilariously dishonest.

A broken clock is right twice a day. You also wanted us to trade for Kyrie again (despite all your crapping on him in this post...), wanted us to trade Tatum & Horford for Lillard and Simmons, wanted to trade Tatum for OKC's trove of picks (while going on about how the Jays don't work as a duo, how Jayson is going to leave for LA first chance he gets), wanted to trade Tatum, Timelord and 5 firsts for Doncic, and my personal favourite - trading Tatum and Brown for Morant, Haliburton, Davion Mitchell, Harrison Barnes, Steven Adams and a pick.

Forgive me for not giving you credit for the ones you get right when there are 100 ones you've gotten wrong

What can I say other than it’s very therapeutic to fantasize about ways to see us win when we’re losing? But do you know what? I love what we’ve got now. Of our ten highest paid players, I literally would not trade anybody now except potentially Pritchard (I’ve still got high hopes he’ll pull it together on defense) and Nesmith (little faith of him turning it around, but who knows?). Obviously if a top five player became available that changes the calculus since Tatum is our only true untouchable (and top five player now IMHO). Imagining Tatum with Doncic has always been my wildest fantasy, with Jokic a close second.

I love this style of play, I love this winning, I think title 18 is weeks away, and I’ll be [dang]ed staying silent while Danny worshippers who won’t let it go suggest a member of the Utah Jazz should get more credit than our head coach and GM/ex-coach…
It's just funny to me that you're so adamant in the defence of Brad and this roster despite spending the majority of your time trying to trade every single player on this roster.

I’ve already given the mea culpa more than once. I was wrong. All hail Brad and Ime. That’s my new MO.

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #55 on: March 25, 2022, 02:23:34 AM »

Offline JSD

  • NCE
  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12590
  • Tommy Points: 2159
I’d give him a ring.  Wasn’t he providing consultation services this season?

There’s plenty of credit to go around.  Danny bought most of the groceries, Brad came up with the recipe, and Ime cooked the dinner.

What a good way to put it

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #56 on: March 25, 2022, 02:25:15 AM »

Offline JSD

  • NCE
  • Frank Ramsey
  • ************
  • Posts: 12590
  • Tommy Points: 2159
Ainge gets full credit for the Jays.

Do we really think our head coach had no say in the matter? I’d love folks to name some comparable draft selections by Danny (even someone comparable to Timelord) when Doc was coach…

Big Al, Perk, Tony Allen, Bradley, Jared Sullinger, BBD, Powe, Gomes

Obviously he didn't draft the equivalent of JT and JB, because we didn't end up with the #3 and #1 pick in the draft.

You didn't even mention Delonte

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #57 on: March 25, 2022, 02:41:05 AM »

Kiorrik

  • Guest
Ainge gets full credit for the Jays.

Do we really think our head coach had no say in the matter? I’d love folks to name some comparable draft selections by Danny (even someone comparable to Timelord) when Doc was coach…

Big Al, Perk, Tony Allen, Bradley, Jared Sullinger, BBD, Powe, Gomes

Obviously he didn't draft the equivalent of JT and JB, because we didn't end up with the #3 and #1 pick in the draft.

You didn't even mention Delonte

I unironically miss watching Delonte play. Might go watch some highlights.

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #58 on: March 25, 2022, 08:44:38 AM »

Offline Surferdad

  • Reggie Lewis
  • ***************
  • Posts: 15238
  • Tommy Points: 1034
  • "He fiddles...and diddles..."
I’d give him a ring.  Wasn’t he providing consultation services this season?

There’s plenty of credit to go around.  Danny bought most of the groceries, Brad came up with the recipe, and Ime cooked the dinner.

What a good way to put it
I like mine better:  Danny bought the parts, Brad assembled the vehicle, Ime drove it.   ;D

That said, you don't get a ring for buying the groceries or the parts.

Re: Credit to Ainge?
« Reply #59 on: March 25, 2022, 09:06:48 AM »

Offline pokeKingCurtis

  • Ray Allen
  • ***
  • Posts: 3733
  • Tommy Points: 280
I think we need to give credit to Red Auerbach because if he had never brought in Danny as a player he never would have later given his endorsement of Danny for GM, which led to Danny being hired as GM, so we never would have got to this point without Red. Therefore it’s still Red’s team and Red gets the credit…even though Red’s been dead for 15 years 🙄

Obviously the owners picked Brad, not Danny, for 2021-2022. Obviously the head coach was hired by Brad, and Ime added coaches to the guys Stevens hired before. The coaching credit all goes to Ime and Brad. Danny gets some credit for hiring Brad, but Brad made the decision to leave Butler because of Celtic Pride, not Danny, and Brad hired Ime…

In terms of players, the Horford trade happened under Stevens and probably happened right away because Brad, Jayson, Jaylen and Marcus all told ownership that the team has never been the same since Al left, and we need Al back, so that’s exactly what happened ASAP under Brad. In contrast to the fact that trade was executed by Stevens, there’s zero evidence Danny would have done it, or had anything to do with it before leaving. That’s just revisionist history by the Danny Worshippers who won’t give it up even though Danny is now a Utah Jazz exec…

In terms of White, that’s clearly all Brad and Ime.

With regards to Theis, again, all Brad finding a way to bring him home.

Danny made a couple big mistakes at the end because he never did quite understand the importance of chemistry and legacy (he’s the dude who suggested trading Larry Legend, which led to Danny being traded instead and rightfully so): He let two of the most popular locker room guys in Al and Daniel go because of money. Because of money. And don’t forget what Danny did to IT and how that led to Kryme.  Even if IT had been toast in 2017-2018, if we had stayed loyal to him we still would have been just as good in 2017-2019 without Kyrie considering Kyrie was injured most of that first year and was a cancer the second year. And we likely would have had the 8th pick in the 2018 draft had we not done the Kyrie move, so we could have added cost-controlled SGA or Mikal Bridges. Heck, we possibly had the ammo to move up to 3 to add Doncic. Can you imagine how amazing we would be now?

Danny no longer has the job because he failed to win a title in over a dozen years and even failed to make an appearance in the Finals for 11 straight years. What did him in was probably letting Al walk, which led to a terrible two years despite a decent trip in the Bubble. It’s not a coincidence that Timelord and Grant are having their best seasons ever under Al’s wing. Kyrie did not help matters at all for Danny.

As soon as Hayward’s contract is up, we’ll probably be bringing him back, too, to fix another one of Danny’s final flawed decisions.

Chemistry matters. Celtic Pride matters.

I see it more as like a different strokes for different folks thing.

Danny goes for the kill always. I keep beating this drum but Kyrie, Hayward, Horford, Jays, with one of the Morris twins and Rozier off the bench - that would have been a team for the centuries.

Danny keeps his powder dry. I think he would have just lived out the rest of the Kemba contract, kept the 1st and kept adding value.

He did it before with KG, Ray. That group should have won multiple championships. Two potential perrenial contenders in the span of 10 **** years - what more can you ask for? Obviously there's gonna be down years but, man, high highs.

Good post. To me, though, the high highs is 17 titles, not just 2008. The reason why Celtic Pride is a thing and this franchise is legendary is all of the titles, not just 2008. Going a dozen years without a title was long enough. The guy was the poor man’s version of Red, which was just fine, but everyone needs to stop worshipping him like he was Red. He’s now an executive with the Utah Jazz, for crying out loud, and Brad oozes Celtic Pride and will prove to be the better GM very soon when he matches Danny’s one title in, what, 16 years?

The credit goes to current Celtics, not an executive of the Utah Jazz. Move on, Danny worshippers. It’s over…

Well I mean people were bagging Danny for picking Payton Pritchard and Grant Williams. So this team playing like the best team in the NBA with Ainge picks playing most of the available minutes is kind of vindicating to those who defended Ainge/those picks.