I miss Smart but this isn't so good...

[liam]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

[colincb]

I suspect this is one of the main reasons why White is here with his career TO% of  11.8%, One of his traits, besides making quick decisions, is that he makes simple plays. Smart tries to be Magic.

[liam]

I suspect this is one of the main reasons why White is here with his career TO% of  11.8%, One of his traits, besides making quick decisions, is that he makes simple plays. Smart tries to be Magic.

Maybe so. Smart needs to improve this. I'd tell him to look in the mirror but he'd probably punch it. 

[liam]

This isn't an anti-Smart thread but I was genuinely shocked by this.

[showtime]

I suspect this is one of the main reasons why White is here with his career TO% of  11.8%, One of his traits, besides making quick decisions, is that he makes simple plays. Smart tries to be Magic.

but comes out looking more like Tragic!

[wdleehi]

I need a better explanation. 

Smarts Assist to TO is 2.87.    That's 87th in the league.   


Where did those numbers come from?

[Who]

I need a better explanation. 

Smarts Assist to TO is 2.87.    That's 87th in the league.   


Where did those numbers come from?

It is one of those stats that is heavily influenced by how much a player shoots the ball. So if a guy takes 5 more shots a game and misses all 5 of them, his TOV% will be better.

[wdleehi]

I need a better explanation. 

Smarts Assist to TO is 2.87.    That's 87th in the league.   


Where did those numbers come from?

It is one of those stats that is heavily influenced by how much a player shoots the ball. So if a guy takes 5 more shots a game and misses all 5 of them, his TOV% will be better.

So having a weaker shooter who has a good assist to TO ratio have a "bad" number in this is a good thing because they are not shooting to much.


Correct? 

[Celtics2021]

I need a better explanation. 

Smarts Assist to TO is 2.87.    That's 87th in the league.   


Where did those numbers come from?

It is one of those stats that is heavily influenced by how much a player shoots the ball. So if a guy takes 5 more shots a game and misses all 5 of them, his TOV% will be better.

Correct.  Turnover rate is:

(100 x TO)/(FGA + (FTA x 0.44) + TO)

It’s not my favorite stat.  You’re considered to use a possession by taking shots and committing turnovers.  If you reduce your shots because you pass more, but commit the same amount of turnovers, your TO rate goes up.

Also, it’s hard to read the table in the OP, but Smart’s TO rate this year is 15.7, and his FG% is 41%.  From the table I think I’m reading 22.9 and 36%, which is wrong.

[Celtics2021]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

Where are these numbers coming from?  Every player I’ve checked has been several percentage points off for both FG% and turnover rate, and I can eyeball and see that PPP (assuming that means points per possession) isn’t going to be anywhere close to accurate.

[liam]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

Where are these numbers coming from?  Every player I’ve checked has been several percentage points off for both FG% and turnover rate, and I can eyeball and see that PPP (assuming that means points per possession) isn’t going to be anywhere close to accurate.

I found this in an article on the Ringer. It's about Jalen Suggs. I would be happy if that was bad info.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/2/17/22938280/nba-rookies-cade-cunningham-jalen-suggs

[Celtics2021]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

Where are these numbers coming from?  Every player I’ve checked has been several percentage points off for both FG% and turnover rate, and I can eyeball and see that PPP (assuming that means points per possession) isn’t going to be anywhere close to accurate.

I found this in an article on the Ringer. It's about Jalen Suggs. I would be happy if that was bad info.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/2/17/22938280/nba-rookies-cade-cunningham-jalen-suggs

Got it.  It’s for ball handlers in pick-and-roll plays only.   It’s not his strength, but something he does fewer than 3 times per game.

[liam]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

Where are these numbers coming from?  Every player I’ve checked has been several percentage points off for both FG% and turnover rate, and I can eyeball and see that PPP (assuming that means points per possession) isn’t going to be anywhere close to accurate.

I found this in an article on the Ringer. It's about Jalen Suggs. I would be happy if that was bad info.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/2/17/22938280/nba-rookies-cade-cunningham-jalen-suggs

Got it.  It’s for ball handlers in pick-and-roll plays only.   It’s not his strength, but something he does fewer than 3 times per game.

It just caught me off guard to see Smart's name on this list. A list of young guys and Bledsoe. Sorry I didn't put that link in the first place.

[Celtics2021]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

Where are these numbers coming from?  Every player I’ve checked has been several percentage points off for both FG% and turnover rate, and I can eyeball and see that PPP (assuming that means points per possession) isn’t going to be anywhere close to accurate.

I found this in an article on the Ringer. It's about Jalen Suggs. I would be happy if that was bad info.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/2/17/22938280/nba-rookies-cade-cunningham-jalen-suggs

Got it.  It’s for ball handlers in pick-and-roll plays only.   It’s not his strength, but something he does fewer than 3 times per game.

It just caught me off guard to see Smart's name on this list. A list of young guys and Bledsoe. Sorry I didn't put that link in the first place.

Yeah, Smart is fourth on the team in P&R per game.  Schröder ran them a lot and was good at them, but White also ran them frequently with even more success in San Antonio, so imagine Marcus will continue not to be someone who utilizes that play often.  Which is good, since he’s been bad at it.

That said, when you only do something 2.6 times per game, there are lot of small sample size issues.  Smart’s numbers each of the prior two years would be best on the team this year, so I wouldn’t put much stock into any of this.

[liam]

Your starting point guard shouldn't be on this list unless he's a rookie.

The Rare High-Turnover Ball Handlers
Player                   Team   PPP            FG%   %TO
Cade Cunningham   Pistons   0.738   41.50%   23.10%
Killian Hayes           Pistons    0.73           41.50%   22.50%
Jalen Green           Rockets   0.702   31.50%   16.50%
Keldon Johnson           Spurs   0.679   34.10%   13.20%
Josh Giddey           Thunder   0.645   39%           24.60%
Eric Bledsoe           Clippers   0.644   39.40%   26.10%
Facundo Campazzo   Nuggets   0.638   29.70%   27.60%
Marcus Smart           Celtics   0.634   36%           22.90%
Nah'Shon Hyland   Nuggets   0.632   27.70%   17%
Jalen Suggs           Magic   0.576   27.50%   22%

Where are these numbers coming from?  Every player I’ve checked has been several percentage points off for both FG% and turnover rate, and I can eyeball and see that PPP (assuming that means points per possession) isn’t going to be anywhere close to accurate.

I found this in an article on the Ringer. It's about Jalen Suggs. I would be happy if that was bad info.

https://www.theringer.com/nba/2022/2/17/22938280/nba-rookies-cade-cunningham-jalen-suggs

Got it.  It’s for ball handlers in pick-and-roll plays only.   It’s not his strength, but something he does fewer than 3 times per game.

It just caught me off guard to see Smart's name on this list. A list of young guys and Bledsoe. Sorry I didn't put that link in the first place.

Yeah, Smart is fourth on the team in P&R per game.  Schröder ran them a lot and was good at them, but White also ran them frequently with even more success in San Antonio, so imagine Marcus will continue not to be someone who utilizes that play often.  Which is good, since he’s been bad at it.

That said, when you only do something 2.6 times per game, there are lot of small sample size issues.  Smart’s numbers each of the prior two years would be best on the team this year, so I wouldn’t put much stock into any of this.

Well, that's good to hear! I do wish we ran more pick and roll...