Ime has got to go!

[nickagneta]

This has been an unbelievable turnaround for a team.  I am happy to say that I was part of the minority that didn't fall in to the trap of despair with the slow start.  But I certainly did not expect this much of a turnaround.  It is crazy.

Beyond the "Ime has to go" take, there were some others that have not aged well:

"Tatum and Brown can't play together"

"Marcus Smart needs to be traded because he can't play PG"

and of course the most common one, "we need more shooters".

The last one, every team would like to have better shooting, it was kind of a silly take in the first place, but it turns out we had plenty of shooters, we just needed to execute the offense better and get better looks.

Yup yup yup; patience.

Fans kneejerk like crazy. It's almost as if they have never seen a movie where "character arc" was a thing.

Ever seen a movie where a person or a team is losing and losing and losing until suddenly it clicks and they start winning?

That's how that works.

You need adversity to grow. If everything comes easy, you're not going to grow as hard.

The reason the '08 squad was so insanely good, was because these guys had been failing for dang near 15 years.

And developing winning habits? Well that doesn't happen overnight.

Fans also tend to only care about a single statistic. W/L. Which, if you're being fair, isn't all there is to it. You can improve in other areas before that column changes. And if you're too much of a homer, you're going to miss all the individual improvements because all you can do is seethe at the L's.

In fact, if you only care about W/L, you start saying dumb things like "THIS ONE PLAY COST US THE GAME". No it didn't. You lost the game because you put yourself in a position to lose it. If you'd hit literally 1 more shot, you'd be absolutely fine. If you'd gotten 1 extra steal, you'd be fine. If you'd had a hand up on that one shot, you'd be fine. Stop being kneejerky. 1 bad play doesn't mean a player needs to be ran outta town. Especially if they were flawless 90% of the game.

Building a team is about a lot of things. It's about learning more and more about your individuals, it's about discerning their strengths and their weaknesses. It's about finding out how to best help them compensate for those weaknesses, and how to best utilise their strengths. All of that takes time.

P A T I E N C E .

This extends to Theis who's going to still have some bad games. And Derrick White who quite clearly needs to overcome the lid that's on the basket. And Nessie who's trying to stay healthy just like Timelord was at the start of the season.

And heck, even if we don't win it this year, that's just more adversity we can overcome. Lessons to be learned by everyone. Rookie coach included.

Sorry; end of rant :]

The funny part about this post is the part highlighted. Why? Because the team wasn't losing and losing and losing. They were .500 over a season and a half.

Then everything clicked.

I think that gets lost in translation sometime. The team wasn't actually playing bad, but they weren't playing good either. They were mediocre.

[mr. dee]

I have to admit I was wrong about Udoka. But to be fair, I also said to myself to give him and the team at least until All-Star break to figure it out. So I was half-right about it.

And I have to say, he's already doing a much better job than Brad ever did. For one, the difference in offensive philosophy is showing already. In Brad's offense, everyone is chucking 3s as long as it is an "open" shot. Ime, in contrast have put much more discipline in Celtic's offense. They are not settling for any "open" shots, but they are looking for the most efficient ones.

I'm pretty confident that there's no longer guys like Morris, Rozier, Kemba and Kyrie shooting us out of the game because our guys are more tru****l to their teammates and much more willing passer than those guys mentioned.

I have to disagree with the 3 point stuff.

I think the difference is just that we're making them now.

Everyone have the license to shoot with Brad. That's why Smart developed a bad habit of gunning 3s even if its ill-advised. Now that he's settled to the facilitating role, he's more played to his strength on creating openings for his teammates rather than be an erratic chucker.

Shooting well have something to do with offensive schemes and shot selection.

Tatum and Brown look more decisive under Ime, attacking early instead of dribbling the air out of the ball and settling for tough contested jumpers

[Hoopvortex]

This has been an unbelievable turnaround for a team.  I am happy to say that I was part of the minority that didn't fall in to the trap of despair with the slow start.  But I certainly did not expect this much of a turnaround.  It is crazy.

Beyond the "Ime has to go" take, there were some others that have not aged well:

"Tatum and Brown can't play together"

"Marcus Smart needs to be traded because he can't play PG"

and of course the most common one, "we need more shooters".

The last one, every team would like to have better shooting, it was kind of a silly take in the first place, but it turns out we had plenty of shooters, we just needed to execute the offense better and get better looks.

Yup yup yup; patience.

Fans kneejerk like crazy. It's almost as if they have never seen a movie where "character arc" was a thing.

Ever seen a movie where a person or a team is losing and losing and losing until suddenly it clicks and they start winning?

That's how that works.

You need adversity to grow. If everything comes easy, you're not going to grow as hard.

The reason the '08 squad was so insanely good, was because these guys had been failing for dang near 15 years.

And developing winning habits? Well that doesn't happen overnight.

Fans also tend to only care about a single statistic. W/L. Which, if you're being fair, isn't all there is to it. You can improve in other areas before that column changes. And if you're too much of a homer, you're going to miss all the individual improvements because all you can do is seethe at the L's.

In fact, if you only care about W/L, you start saying dumb things like "THIS ONE PLAY COST US THE GAME". No it didn't. You lost the game because you put yourself in a position to lose it. If you'd hit literally 1 more shot, you'd be absolutely fine. If you'd gotten 1 extra steal, you'd be fine. If you'd had a hand up on that one shot, you'd be fine. Stop being kneejerky. 1 bad play doesn't mean a player needs to be ran outta town. Especially if they were flawless 90% of the game.

Building a team is about a lot of things. It's about learning more and more about your individuals, it's about discerning their strengths and their weaknesses. It's about finding out how to best help them compensate for those weaknesses, and how to best utilise their strengths. All of that takes time.

P A T I E N C E .

This extends to Theis who's going to still have some bad games. And Derrick White who quite clearly needs to overcome the lid that's on the basket. And Nessie who's trying to stay healthy just like Timelord was at the start of the season.

And heck, even if we don't win it this year, that's just more adversity we can overcome. Lessons to be learned by everyone. Rookie coach included.

Sorry; end of rant :]

The funny part about this post is the part highlighted. Why? Because the team wasn't losing and losing and losing. They were .500 over a season and a half.

Then everything clicked.

I think that gets lost in translation sometime. The team wasn't actually playing bad, but they weren't playing good either. They were mediocre.

All the factors that go into winning don't lend themselves easily to bottom-line explanations.

But for last season and the first months of this one, it can't be stressed enough how much health affected the team's performance. Picking one data point among many: post-covid last year, Tatum was playing but needed an inhaler on the sidelines. More than anything, it impacted his defense.

On the whole I think it's fair to call the 2020-21 Celtics "snakebit", but this season was pretty rocky in terms of health as well, in particular Jaylen Brown being out for an extended period.

[Big333223]

COY is almost certainly going to Monty Williams but I'm betting Ime winds up top 3 in voting.

[Donoghus]

I don't think he's getting fired, guys.

[Goldstar88]

Like the team, Ime has been much better in the second half of the season. If he can get the C’s to the conference finals, I will be sold on him.

[Vermont Green]

Like the team, Ime has been much better in the second half of the season. If he can get the C’s to the conference finals, I will be sold on him.

Really?  And if we don't make it to the ECF, then what?  He isn't a good coach so move on?  We likely have to play BKN and then MIL to get to the ECF.  So if we don't win both those series, Ime won't have proven himself to you?

[Goldstar88]

Like the team, Ime has been much better in the second half of the season. If he can get the C’s to the conference finals, I will be sold on him.

Really?  And if we don't make it to the ECF, then what?  He isn't a good coach so move on?  We likely have to play BKN and then MIL to get to the ECF.  So if we don't win both those series, Ime won't have proven himself to you?

TBD. I like what I’ve seen from him during the second half of the season and I’m interested to see how he does in the playoffs. Not sure why that’s unreasonable, considering it’s his first year coaching. 

[nickagneta]

COY is almost certainly going to Monty Williams but I'm betting Ime winds up top 3 in voting.

The NBA coaches gave their vote to Williams for their COY. Strangely, several other coaches were mentioned as getting votes but Udoka wasn't one of the coaches mentioned. From ESPN:

Phoenix Suns coach Monty Williams -- architect of the NBA's best regular-season team -- has been voted the National Basketball Coaches Association Coach of the Year for a second consecutive time.

The award, named in honor of late NBCA executive director Michael H. Goldberg, is based on a vote of the league's 30 head coaches.

The league will announce the NBA's Coach of the Year winner later in the playoffs -- an award based upon media voting.

The Suns set a franchise record with a 64-18 regular-season record and will be the No. 1 seed in the NBA playoffs. Under Williams, Phoenix became the first team to exceed its victory total by at least 11 games in three successive years.

Among other coaches who received votes: New Orleans' Willie Green, Memphis' Taylor Jenkins, the Clippers' Ty Lue, San Antonio's Gregg Popovich and Miami's Erik Spoelstra, sources said.

[ozgod]

Like the team, Ime has been much better in the second half of the season. If he can get the C’s to the conference finals, I will be sold on him.

Really?  And if we don't make it to the ECF, then what?  He isn't a good coach so move on?  We likely have to play BKN and then MIL to get to the ECF.  So if we don't win both those series, Ime won't have proven himself to you?

I'm sold on him being a good coach. I think he connects well with our players and it's clear watching the team play that they are enjoying executing his blueprint. He's created a system where there are interchangeable parts so if one player gets injured another can be slotted in to perform the same function (obviously Tatum and Brown are special players, but I think he's created adequate cover for the others).

I think the next step I'm looking for for him is sustainability and to deliver continual success while developing a pipeline of players that can play in his system. We want stability in the HC position and I want Ime to continue to grow and develop, just as the players continue to develop. The hardest gains to make are the incremental ones, the ones that we need to push us past the other contenders.

The playoffs will be a good test for him. As Moranis said he has been playing a playoff style rotation for most of this year (2022) which certainly contributed to our successes, we will now be playing other top teams doing the same thing, who will be able to game plan for us over a 7 game series. It will be interesting to see how he responds. But if we don't make the ECF I don't think it makes him a bad coach.

[Kiorrik]

People act like the playoffs are a different sport.

It's really not.

[Kernewek]

People act like the playoffs are a different sport.

It's really not.

Politely beg to differ it’s well known that the 2 pointers count for 2.35 and the three pointers count for 2.75, which is why the game grinds in the a half court.

[Kiorrik]

People act like the playoffs are a different sport.

It's really not.

Politely beg to differ it’s well known that the 2 pointers count for 2.35 and the three pointers count for 2.75, which is why the game grinds in the a half court.

Game just gets 5% slower. That's pretty much all there is to it.

If you'd said a 7 game series means coaching adjustments / game plans make a huge difference, I'd have given you that much.

But teams will still play the same defensive schemes. Still run the same plays ran in the season. Take the same shots. Have the same ATO playsbook.

Heck, from what I've read, even the reffing is much the same, even though we'd like to think not.

[ozgod]

People act like the playoffs are a different sport.

It's really not.

Politely beg to differ it’s well known that the 2 pointers count for 2.35 and the three pointers count for 2.75, which is why the game grinds in the a half court.

Game just gets 5% slower. That's pretty much all there is to it.

If you'd said a 7 game series means coaching adjustments / game plans make a huge difference, I'd have given you that much.

But teams will still play the same defensive schemes. Still run the same plays ran in the season. Take the same shots. Have the same ATO playsbook.

Heck, from what I've read, even the reffing is much the same, even though we'd like to think not.

Sometimes teams hold things back in the regular season though, so as not to show their full hand to a possible playoff opponent. Brad used a different defensive scheme vs Milwaukee to neutralize Giannis in Game 1 in 2018-19 (Cryrie's last year) to how they had defended him in the regular season. Of course, that might not have been intentional - he may have just come up with it prior to that game. It's hard to hold things back when you're trying to make the playoffs in the first place and you need to win regular season games. It's certainly more common in other sports - Belichick used to hold things back for playoff games all the time. Of course the NFL only has single playoff games so the impact of that is much higher than in a 7 game series.

Another thing that 7 game playoff series are different from a player perspective is the pressure. To the vets they probably don't perform any different, but for players in which it's their first time and the gravity of the games hit them it could affect them. Same goes for rookie coaches. But Ime's been around the block as an assistant in playoffs many times.

[Kiorrik]

People act like the playoffs are a different sport.

It's really not.

Politely beg to differ it’s well known that the 2 pointers count for 2.35 and the three pointers count for 2.75, which is why the game grinds in the a half court.

Game just gets 5% slower. That's pretty much all there is to it.

If you'd said a 7 game series means coaching adjustments / game plans make a huge difference, I'd have given you that much.

But teams will still play the same defensive schemes. Still run the same plays ran in the season. Take the same shots. Have the same ATO playsbook.

Heck, from what I've read, even the reffing is much the same, even though we'd like to think not.

Sometimes teams hold things back in the regular season though, so as not to show their full hand to a possible playoff opponent. Brad used a different defensive scheme vs Milwaukee to neutralize Giannis in Game 1 in 2018-19 (Cryrie's last year) to how they had defended him in the regular season. Of course, that might not have been intentional - he may have just come up with it prior to that game. It's hard to hold things back when you're trying to make the playoffs in the first place and you need to win regular season games. It's certainly more common in other sports - Belichick used to hold things back for playoff games all the time. Of course the NFL only has single playoff games so the impact of that is much higher than in a 7 game series.

Another thing that 7 game playoff series are different from a player perspective is the pressure. To the vets they probably don't perform any different, but for players in which it's their first time and the gravity of the games hit them it could affect them. Same goes for rookie coaches. But Ime's been around the block as an assistant in playoffs many times.

Couldn't find stats to back up the pressure thing, but I agree some things will get held back. It's that gameplan thing.

Wonder if teams test the "defense vs the nets" vs a worse but similar team. You know, to test if it works in principle, and then see if they can execute it in the playoffs vs that particular team.