Sabonis Idea -- GSW <> IND <> BOS

[todd_days_41]

Cs trade: Smart, Fernando, Hernangomez, Nesmith, 2 1sts
Cs receive: Sabonis, Craig, Wannamaker

GSW trade: Moody, Kuminga, Looney
GSW receive: Smart, Fernando

IND trade: Sabonis, Craig, Wannamaker
IND receives: Nesmith, Kuminga, Moody, Hernangomez, Looney, 2 1sts from Boston

.......

IND cuts (or trades) Lamb and Martin to complete the deal. They have no use for Craig anymore, so they send him to Boston to open up more flexibility this summer. GSW finally gets Smart, while also taking Fernando to replace Looney.

[Csfan1984]

Smart is not worth half that. And that's way too much to Pacers.

[todd_days_41]

Smart is not worth half that. And that's way too much to Pacers.

Jrue Holliday was traded for Eric Bledsoe, George Hill, three future first-round picks, and two additional Draft pick swaps before last season. He, like Sabonis, is an end of rotation All-Star.

You don't think IND could get three mid-tier prospects and two picks for Sabonis? I disagree.

[RodyTur10]

Smart is not worth half that. And that's way too much to Pacers.

Jrue Holliday was traded for Eric Bledsoe, George Hill, three future first-round picks, and two additional Draft pick swaps before last season. He, like Sabonis, is an end of rotation All-Star.

You don't think IND could get three mid-tier prospects and two picks for Sabonis? I disagree.

It's hard to tell what the market value of Sabonis is. You're correct in identifying his value as a player.
But that type of player isn't a singular building block which teams would trade their whole future for.

Holiday was a special case, since it was also about keeping and extending Antetokounmpo and they (rightfully) thought Holiday was the last vital piece to win a championship.

Maybe Golden State would view Sabonis in a similar way. In that case I don't think the Celtics would make a competitive offer. However when we just look at a player like Sabonis in a vacuum then you're talking about a guy who would be second fiddle on a contender and not worthy of an all-in move.

[todd_days_41]

Smart is not worth half that. And that's way too much to Pacers.

Jrue Holliday was traded for Eric Bledsoe, George Hill, three future first-round picks, and two additional Draft pick swaps before last season. He, like Sabonis, is an end of rotation All-Star.

You don't think IND could get three mid-tier prospects and two picks for Sabonis? I disagree.

It's hard to tell what the market value of Sabonis is. You're correct in identifying his value as a player.
But that type of player isn't a singular building block which teams would trade their whole future for.

Holiday was a special case, since it was also about keeping and extending Antetokounmpo and they (rightfully) thought Holiday was the last vital piece to win a championship.

Maybe Golden State would view Sabonis in a similar way. In that case I don't think the Celtics would make a competitive offer. However when we just look at a player like Sabonis in a vacuum then you're talking about a guy who would be second fiddle on a contender and not worthy of an all-in move.

I hear what you’re sayin’, but I’m not suggesting an all in move — far from it.

[RodyTur10]

Smart is not worth half that. And that's way too much to Pacers.

Jrue Holliday was traded for Eric Bledsoe, George Hill, three future first-round picks, and two additional Draft pick swaps before last season. He, like Sabonis, is an end of rotation All-Star.

You don't think IND could get three mid-tier prospects and two picks for Sabonis? I disagree.

It's hard to tell what the market value of Sabonis is. You're correct in identifying his value as a player.
But that type of player isn't a singular building block which teams would trade their whole future for.

Holiday was a special case, since it was also about keeping and extending Antetokounmpo and they (rightfully) thought Holiday was the last vital piece to win a championship.

Maybe Golden State would view Sabonis in a similar way. In that case I don't think the Celtics would make a competitive offer. However when we just look at a player like Sabonis in a vacuum then you're talking about a guy who would be second fiddle on a contender and not worthy of an all-in move.

I hear what you’re sayin’, but I’m not suggesting an all in move — far from it.

Three mid-tier projects + 2 picks is rather a lot. Although it depends on your definition of a mid-tier prospect.
I'd say Timelord is beyond that. But even three of Pritchard, Langford, Nesmith, G.Williams + 2 (unprotected) picks is quite a package (too much for me).

[Csfan1984]

I meant what I said. Smart could get you Moody and Looney but not Kuminga as well.

And Sabonis isn't a Jack of all trades best two way player at his position like Holiday is considered.

[todd_days_41]

Smart is not worth half that. And that's way too much to Pacers.

Jrue Holliday was traded for Eric Bledsoe, George Hill, three future first-round picks, and two additional Draft pick swaps before last season. He, like Sabonis, is an end of rotation All-Star.

You don't think IND could get three mid-tier prospects and two picks for Sabonis? I disagree.

It's hard to tell what the market value of Sabonis is. You're correct in identifying his value as a player.
But that type of player isn't a singular building block which teams would trade their whole future for.

Holiday was a special case, since it was also about keeping and extending Antetokounmpo and they (rightfully) thought Holiday was the last vital piece to win a championship.

Maybe Golden State would view Sabonis in a similar way. In that case I don't think the Celtics would make a competitive offer. However when we just look at a player like Sabonis in a vacuum then you're talking about a guy who would be second fiddle on a contender and not worthy of an all-in move.

I hear what you’re sayin’, but I’m not suggesting an all in move — far from it.

Three mid-tier projects + 2 picks is rather a lot. Although it depends on your definition of a mid-tier prospect.
I'd say Timelord is beyond that. But even three of Pritchard, Langford, Nesmith, G.Williams + 2 (unprotected) picks is quite a package (too much for me).

I don't really follow you -- Timelord, Pritchard, Langford and Williams are not part of this trade -- why are you rating their value?

Meanwhile, certainly you protect the picks. It's pretty rare to see unprotected picks traded in this day and age (after the Cs trade with Billy King).

[Vermont Green]

Interesting idea but if GSW are going to give up Moody, Kuminga, Looney, I think they would rather just deal directly with Indy and get Sabonis.  Wouldn't he be a good fit for them?  Better than Smart?

I like Sabonis but I think if you want him on the Celtics, you better plan on giving up Brown.  Sabonis is a two-time all star, albeit an "on the bubble" level of all star.

[todd_days_41]

I meant what I said. Smart could get you Moody and Looney but not Kuminga as well.

And Sabonis isn't a Jack of all trades best two way player at his position like Holiday is considered.

Not worth debating the Smart bit -- tomato, tomaato.

Disagree on your Holliday take. Sabonis is 5+ years younger than Jrue was when he was traded to MIL, is a 2 time All-Star before the age of 25, is averaging 19, 12 and 4 this season, and is cost controlled under market value ($18.5M this season) until the summer of 2024. Not to mention what he would do for the Cs offensive flow.

He's certainly not LESS valuable than Holliday. I assume he and Brogdon are the least likely to be traded by IND between now and next season. If they do move Sabonis, there will be demand for him and they'll fetch a premium.

[todd_days_41]

Interesting idea but if GSW are going to give up Moody, Kuminga, Looney, I think they would rather just deal directly with Indy and get Sabonis.  Wouldn't he be a good fit for them?  Better than Smart?

I like Sabonis but I think if you want him on the Celtics, you better plan on giving up Brown.  Sabonis is a two-time all star, albeit an "on the bubble" level of all star.

Could be, but:

1) Depends on whether GSW would give up Wiseman, and if IND wants Wiseman

2) Draymond and Sabonis are kind of a funky fit together (see #4 below)

3) Our picks are going to be better than GSW's in trade. If the Cs give up a 2022 first, its almost certain to be at least 12 picks higher (if not more). And they'd need to replace Nesmith and those picks in the trade. If IND doesn't want picks at the absolute bottom of the 1st round, will be dependent on Wiseman, Poole, etc.

4) Their team is rolling. Integrating Sabonis is a big change, and again they'd need to send more / better players out who are in their current rotation.

I see them being interested in Smart as a lighter swap -- a complimentary piece who comes in as a defensive menace / court enforcer for a championship run. Sabonis likely requires more change management to integrate. GSW has been raised as a good destination in "rumors". But will they make such a major move?

Lastly, IMO, if the Cs want to get a player of Sabonis' caliber without trading Brown -- they need to trade Smart to a contender who values his positives in the playoffs in the process. They'll still need to give up multiple other assets, but they need to cash out on Smart in a shrewd way in the offing to compile enough juice.

[CBS_Take a Report]

Interesting idea but if GSW are going to give up Moody, Kuminga, Looney, I think they would rather just deal directly with Indy and get Sabonis.  Wouldn't he be a good fit for them?  Better than Smart?

I like Sabonis but I think if you want him on the Celtics, you better plan on giving up Brown.  Sabonis is a two-time all star, albeit an "on the bubble" level of all star.

I would sign on a deal which includes Jaylen Brown. This teams needs a change in dynamic. We need to stop looking at stats in comparing value of players. Yes Brown averages more points but Sabonis would IMO contribute more to a winning combination. Especially with the emergence of Richardson in the wing role (and signed cheap through next year). Plus I’d like to see what we have in Nesmith and Romeo with more minutes.

Between Tatum-Horford-Sabonis-Williams we have our lower end of the court solved.

Off-season we target Bradley Beal and run with a roster of Smart-Beal-Tatum-Sabonis-Williams III

[SHAQATTACK]

I d let go Smart , Richardson, and Timelord for him , but not Jaylen.  I see Jaylen and Jason different from most I guess.  They are ganged up on , because they are basically the only scoring threat.   They need a third unique border line star or star that brings something more than them .  I think the right person would break up the too easily read and defended two prong attack that is so predictable.  Our team reminds me of the older Raptors from years ago  with two young stars and nobody else to help them  Sabonis might be that unique player to carry the Celtics to the next level.   

I see Sabonis as a Dave Cowens type player for this group.

[Birdman]

Warriors hang up the phone plus they got Klay & Wiseman coming back so they don’t need anyone

[CBS_Take a Report]

The Pacers might want cost controlled players on rookie scale or veteran contracts at a controlled cost rather than all star level talent if they are truly in a rebuild mindset.

So Jaylen might not be necessary. Would they bite at this package:

Smart + RWIII + Langford + Picks (a package of picks and swaps)

For

Sabonis + Holliday