2-way players.

[Jvalin]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

[td450]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

Not really. Last year, we had Tatum, Smart and Walker (probably in that order) initiating the offense like a point. Walker being gone will mean a different distribution, but Smart's not going to absorb all of that responsibility.

Shooting 3's off the dribble is more about skillset than position.

We will have a different coach. If Smart is still here, how Udoka handles this is going to tell us a lot about how good a coach he is.

[Goldstar88]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

Heard there was a new coach in town. He doesn’t seem like the kind of guy that’s going to let players do whatever they want. Brad was a pushover.

[Moranis]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

He didn't have to shoot though.  He could have driven to the hole.  The simple truth is that is 6 shot attempts that are objectively bad shots basically every single time because Smart is a bad shooter.  He didn't have to shoot, yet he did, constantly.  It doesn't matter what position he plays, it doesn't matter who is on the floor with him, Smart just can't help himself.

[Jvalin]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

Not really. Last year, we had Tatum, Smart and Walker (probably in that order) initiating the offense like a point. Walker being gone will mean a different distribution, but Smart's not going to absorb all of that responsibility.

We will have a different coach. If Smart is still here, how Udoka handles this is going to tell us a lot about how good a coach he is.

Agree to disagree. Kemba was on the ball way more than Smart. Tatum and Kemba were our primary ball handlers in the half court. Smart was mostly playing at SG. Per cleaning the glass, he played 70% of his minutes at SG, 27% at PG and 3% at SF. Kemba played 100% of his minutes at PG.

[Celtics4ever]

We had one maybe two .

Jaylen Brown is the certain one and maybe Rob Williams but his offense has a way to go.  Tatum has the talent to do it.  Most of the other guys are severely lacking in either offense or defense.

Tacko being mentioned is farcical.  Waters is a post up waiting to happen.

[Jvalin]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

He didn't have to shoot though.  He could have driven to the hole.  The simple truth is that is 6 shot attempts that are objectively bad shots basically every single time because Smart is a bad shooter.  He didn't have to shoot, yet he did, constantly.  It doesn't matter what position he plays, it doesn't matter who is on the floor with him, Smart just can't help himself.

Of course it matters what position he plays. It ain't his fault that we were using him out of position. Smart is a willing passer and a reliable PnR ball handler. To put it another way, he's a PG. He's not a slasher. Why would you want him to attack the basket? Again, I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s.

Btw, he's not a bad shooter. 

3P%
2018/19: 36.4 (in 4.3 attempts per game)
2019/20: 34.7 (in 6.6 attempts per game)
2020/21: 33.0 (in 5.9 attempts per game)

FT%
2018/19: 80.6
2019/20: 83.6
2020/21: 79.0

These are about average shooting percentages in my book. Definitely not bad.

[Jvalin]

We had one maybe two .

Jaylen Brown is the certain one and maybe Rob Williams but his offense has a way to go.  Tatum has the talent to do it.  Most of the other guys are severely lacking in either offense or defense.

Tacko being mentioned is farcical.  Waters is a post up waiting to happen.

The OP is about 2-way contracts, not 2-way players. I got confused as well for a bit.

[Moranis]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

He didn't have to shoot though.  He could have driven to the hole.  The simple truth is that is 6 shot attempts that are objectively bad shots basically every single time because Smart is a bad shooter.  He didn't have to shoot, yet he did, constantly.  It doesn't matter what position he plays, it doesn't matter who is on the floor with him, Smart just can't help himself.

Of course it matters what position he plays. It ain't his fault that we were using him out of position. Smart is a willing passer and a reliable PnR ball handler. To put it another way, he's a PG. He's not a slasher. Why would you want him to attack the basket? Again, I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s.

Btw, he's not a bad shooter. 

3P%
2018/19: 36.4 (in 4.3 attempts per game)
2019/20: 34.7 (in 6.6 attempts per game)
2020/21: 33.0 (in 5.9 attempts per game)

FT%
2018/19: 80.6
2019/20: 83.6
2020/21: 79.0

These are about average shooting percentages in my book. Definitely not bad.

The foul shooting is fine (which is why he should drive more), but the 3 point numbers are bad.  Like very bad given the volume.  Last year, Boston, without Smart, shot 37.9% from 3 (they were 37.4% with him).  So every time he launched a shot, it was a 4% worse shot than just the team average.  Fournier shot 46.3%, Brown was 39.5%, and Taum was 38.6%.  Even mostly injured Walker was at 36.0%.  Those guys should have been taking the shots Smart was taking.  I get the idea of taking a couple of shots to keep defenses honest, but Smart should not be shooting more than a couple 3's a game.  Him just taking 4 long range shots away increases his value significantly, but yet he just can't do it. 

And last year, Smart played around 45% of his time at PG given all of the injuries on the team.  He just isn't capable of shooting less or he would have done it in his 7 years in the league. 

[Goldstar88]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

We've been using him out of position as an off-ball shooter. He's mostly attempting catch-and-shoot 3s. I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s. Here's a stat regarding Smart's 3pt attempts this season.

Zero dribbles prior to a 3pt shot: 4.3 attempts per game
1 dribble: 0.8 attempts per game
2 dribbles: 0.3 attempts per game
3-6 dribbles: 0.5 attempts per game
7+ dribbles: 0.1 attempts per game

He didn't have to shoot though.  He could have driven to the hole.  The simple truth is that is 6 shot attempts that are objectively bad shots basically every single time because Smart is a bad shooter.  He didn't have to shoot, yet he did, constantly.  It doesn't matter what position he plays, it doesn't matter who is on the floor with him, Smart just can't help himself.

Of course it matters what position he plays. It ain't his fault that we were using him out of position. Smart is a willing passer and a reliable PnR ball handler. To put it another way, he's a PG. He's not a slasher. Why would you want him to attack the basket? Again, I bet CBS wanted him to be taking most of these 3s.

Btw, he's not a bad shooter. 

3P%
2018/19: 36.4 (in 4.3 attempts per game)
2019/20: 34.7 (in 6.6 attempts per game)
2020/21: 33.0 (in 5.9 attempts per game)

FT%
2018/19: 80.6
2019/20: 83.6
2020/21: 79.0

These are about average shooting percentages in my book. Definitely not bad.

The foul shooting is fine (which is why he should drive more), but the 3 point numbers are bad.  Like very bad given the volume.  Last year, Boston, without Smart, shot 37.9% from 3 (they were 37.4% with him).  So every time he launched a shot, it was a 4% worse shot than just the team average.  Fournier shot 46.3%, Brown was 39.5%, and Taum was 38.6%.  Even mostly injured Walker was at 36.0%.  Those guys should have been taking the shots Smart was taking.  I get the idea of taking a couple of shots to keep defenses honest, but Smart should not be shooting more than a couple 3's a game.  Him just taking 4 long range shots away increases his value significantly, but yet he just can't do it. 

And last year, Smart played around 45% of his time at PG given all of the injuries on the team.  He just isn't capable of shooting less or he would have done it in his 7 years in the league.

Brad Stevens repeatedly said that if Marcus is open he wants him to shoot. This is the coaches job, to instruct the players as to what they can and cannot do. That was on Brad. Really glad that Udoka is Now the coach

[Roy H.]

Sounds like Waters is looking to move on:

Tremont Waters, who is on a two-way deal, has been working out away from the organization back home in Connecticut and is looking for more of an opportunity to break into a rotation elsewhere in the NBA this upcoming season, per sources. Waters has played in 357 minutes in 37 games over his first two seasons in Boston and is a restricted free agent. Both Waters and Fall are eligible to sign another two-way deal with the Celtics for one more season before hitting the maximum three years allotted by the CBA.

Of course, that's probably true of literally every player playing on a two-way contract.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Sounds like Waters is looking to move on:

Tremont Waters, who is on a two-way deal, has been working out away from the organization back home in Connecticut and is looking for more of an opportunity to break into a rotation elsewhere in the NBA this upcoming season, per sources. Waters has played in 357 minutes in 37 games over his first two seasons in Boston and is a restricted free agent. Both Waters and Fall are eligible to sign another two-way deal with the Celtics for one more season before hitting the maximum three years allotted by the CBA.

Of course, that's probably true of literally every player playing on a two-way contract.

Yep, and if he can't get an opportunity on a team with low PG depth... good luck.

[Vermont Green]

I feel it is time to end the Tacko experiment.  We have enough centers now with Moses Brown added.  Tacko was fun but I do not believe that he will ever be a NBA player.  China may be better for him.

Waters was a useful player.  He is just so small.  I don't think you are going to do much better than him for a 2-way but I suspect he will find a spot somewhere and get to play more.

This is all very low on the priorities though.

[gouki88]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

He did in 18-19, which was also his most efficient year by a mile.

[Moranis]

Waters has actually shown a pretty nice shooting touch.  39.5% from 3 on 1.5 attempts a game.  94.1% from the line.  He seems like the exact type of player you'd want on a 2-way contract i.e. situationally he has a high value because he has an elite skill.

Given our current situation at point guard, I'm not so certain he wouldn't be better than Smart as a starter. It would be worth a try early in the year to see. He's can shoot and can beat guys off the dribble, but more importantly, he provides better pace and movement. He's also somehow able to be a plus defender out there, which is pretty amazing.

He may never be able to get over the top and be a real starter or even a rotation player, but we don't have a great solution in Smart. I'd want to try out both Pritchard and Waters before giving up anyone.

Waters started several games this season and he did not look very good. I think Smart will be a good fit as the starting PG now that Kemba is gone. Would  at least give him until the trade deadline to see how he does with a new role and coach. The only consistent problem that I had with Smart was his 3pt shooting. If he can limit his total  shot attempts to 6-8 per game and focus on passing, I feel like he will be solid.

Smart can't shoot only 6 to 8 times a game or he would have done so already.

He did in 18-19, which was also his most efficient year by a mile.

That is true.  I had forgotten that (he also did it his rookie year).  He still took way too many 3's though.  I mean his 3PAr that year was 61%.  That is crazy.