One Title in 18 Years and You Think Stevens is The One Who Should Go?

[boscel33]

I'd say Dann has done a really good job.  We have two legit young All-Stars to build around.  He then added GH and KI to the team and it looked like we were on our way.  GH blows his ankle in game one then leaves because he doesn't want to play third wheel, KI becomes a head case and leaves and suddenly, we're trying to pick up pieces in a league where it's difficult to do.

[Celtics4ever]

Ainge deserves a lot of the blame but overall I still think he is a solid GM.   He gambled on some draft picks and signings and got burnt.   High risk, High reward but a lot of time in our case it has been low reward lately.

[Redz]

One championship in 18 years is more than 24 out of 32 teams.  If it was easy everyone would be getting them.  I know we have different expectations because of the legacy and all of the banners, but a lot has to go right to win a title.  Unless you're the Lakers...

[Roy H.]

One championship in 18 years is more than 24 out of 32 teams.  If it was easy everyone would be getting them.  I know we have different expectations because of the legacy and all of the banners, but a lot has to go right to win a title.  Unless you're the Lakers...

Yeah, my random guess is that the Celtics are in the top quarter of teams in winning percentage and playoff wins since Danny took over.  Anybody want to check?

[Jiri Welsch]

One championship in 18 years is more than 24 out of 32 teams.  If it was easy everyone would be getting them.  I know we have different expectations because of the legacy and all of the banners, but a lot has to go right to win a title.  Unless you're the Lakers...

Yeah, my random guess is that the Celtics are in the top quarter of teams in winning percentage and playoff wins since Danny took over.  Anybody want to check?

My initial "I agree" was less that Danny "needs to go" and more that our current roster construction is the reason for our troubles this year.

In a perfect world neither would go. But I think Danny needs to recognize this isn't working and try to begin tweaking with the future in mind.

P.S. Roy...as of August 2019:

Top NBA Teams by record over the last 20 years:

1. Spurs: 1,135-489 (.699 winning percentage)
2. Mavs: 958-656 (.596)
3. Rockets: 928-696 (.571)
4. Heat: 898-726 (.553)
5. Lakers: 893-731 (.550)
6. Thunder/Sonics: 887-737 (.546)
7. Celtics: 886-737 (.546)
8. Jazz: 884-740 (.544)

[Redz]

One championship in 18 years is more than 24 out of 32 teams.  If it was easy everyone would be getting them.  I know we have different expectations because of the legacy and all of the banners, but a lot has to go right to win a title.  Unless you're the Lakers...

Yeah, my random guess is that the Celtics are in the top quarter of teams in winning percentage and playoff wins since Danny took over.  Anybody want to check?

My initial "I agree" was less that Danny "needs to go" and more that our current roster construction is the reason for our troubles this year.

In a perfect world neither would go. But I think Danny needs to recognize this isn't working and try to begin tweaking with the future in mind.

P.S. Roy...as of August 2019:

Top NBA Teams by record over the last 20 years:

1. Spurs: 1,135-489 (.699 winning percentage)
2. Mavs: 958-656 (.596)
3. Rockets: 928-696 (.571)
4. Heat: 898-726 (.553)
5. Lakers: 893-731 (.550)
6. Thunder/Sonics: 887-737 (.546)
7. Celtics: 886-737 (.546)
8. Jazz: 884-740 (.544)

and that's with several god awful seasons thrown in.

[Moranis]

One championship in 18 years is more than 24 out of 32 teams.  If it was easy everyone would be getting them.  I know we have different expectations because of the legacy and all of the banners, but a lot has to go right to win a title.  Unless you're the Lakers...

Yeah, my random guess is that the Celtics are in the top quarter of teams in winning percentage and playoff wins since Danny took over.  Anybody want to check?

My initial "I agree" was less that Danny "needs to go" and more that our current roster construction is the reason for our troubles this year.

In a perfect world neither would go. But I think Danny needs to recognize this isn't working and try to begin tweaking with the future in mind.

P.S. Roy...as of August 2019:

Top NBA Teams by record over the last 20 years:

1. Spurs: 1,135-489 (.699 winning percentage)
2. Mavs: 958-656 (.596)
3. Rockets: 928-696 (.571)
4. Heat: 898-726 (.553)
5. Lakers: 893-731 (.550)
6. Thunder/Sonics: 887-737 (.546)
7. Celtics: 886-737 (.546)
8. Jazz: 884-740 (.544)

and that's with several god awful seasons thrown in.

basically everyone but the Spurs has that (Mavs to a lesser extent), which is why the Spurs are so much ahead of everyone else.  20 years is a long time.

[GreenlyGreeny]

A guy who’s close to being eligible for Medicare who has not won a title in 13 years (when he was still 49, not 62)? Yes, it’s time to move on. You do not guarantee GM jobs for one-and-done records.

This is Title Town, not “oh, we’re happy as long as we have a respectable record and advance past the first round”

[Kernewek]

Title town was the exception, not the rule. Anyone who remembers the history of Boston sports before 2002 can tell you that.

[PAOBoston]

Title town was the exception, not the rule. Anyone who remembers the history of Boston sports before 2002 can tell you that.

Sometimes I wonder if Cs fans remember the 90s and early 00s. It’s been a pretty good ride the last decade. It can literally be a lot worse.

[PhoSita]

I don't think titles are a reasonable metric, for a lot of reasons.  Mainly the fact that the Celtics are at a large disadvantage compared to some of their competitors given the dynamics in the NBA.

I also don't think Brad Stevens is anywhere close to perfect.  I like him, and I agree that he shouldn't shoulder anything close to the majority of the responsibility for the results lately.  But he's got his flaws and there are definitely coaches in the NBA who I think are equivalent or better, and not just the older guys who have won titles.

That said, I definitely agree that Danny has not done a very good job in the last few years.  I've come to the conclusion that Danny had a big, grand plan --- Anthony Davis.  That was supposed to be KG 2.0.  Ever since that fell through, it feels like Danny has been reacting to circumstances instead of creating them.

[Donoghus]

Title town was the exception, not the rule. Anyone who remembers the history of Boston sports before 2002 can tell you that.

True but the 80s were pretty darn good to the city.  That was an exciting time. 

[Surferdad]

I don't think titles are a reasonable metric, for a lot of reasons.  Mainly the fact that the Celtics are at a large disadvantage compared to some of their competitors given the dynamics in the NBA.

I also don't think Brad Stevens is anywhere close to perfect.  I like him, and I agree that he shouldn't shoulder anything close to the majority of the responsibility for the results lately.  But he's got his flaws and there are definitely coaches in the NBA who I think are equivalent or better, and not just the older guys who have won titles.

That said, I definitely agree that Danny has not done a very good job in the last few years.  I've come to the conclusion that Danny had a big, grand plan --- Anthony Davis.  That was supposed to be KG 2.0.  Ever since that fell through, it feels like Danny has been reacting to circumstances instead of creating them.

Spot on!  He's taken a bunch of shots at bringing in All-Stars (Horford, Irving, Hayward) but none of those guys were going to be as impactful as AD.

[Kernewek]

Title town was the exception, not the rule. Anyone who remembers the history of Boston sports before 2002 can tell you that.

True but the 80s were pretty darn good to the city.  That was an exciting time.

Fair point! Three championships in five seasons is nothing to scoff at. And, of course, there is the spectre of Len Bias (and a little later Reggie Lewis) hanging over the latter half of those years as well.

It may have been 18 years since our last ring but I'll take those 18 years in a heartbeat over the 22 between '86 and '08. We had:
The Last Ride of the Big 3 (1 Finals appearance, solid playoff runs)
The Emergence of Wunderkind Brad Stevens
The Rise of Isaiah Thomas
The "exciting times" of Kyrie Irving, Gordon Hayward, and Big Al
The Emergence of the best in-house Celtics talent in a decade

Compare that to
The parts I can't remember
Rick Pitino's Greatest Hits, including  Larry Bird's Not Walking Through That Door
Let's Tank for Tim Duncan
There Ain't No Fours
The Stabbing
&c.

[nyceltsfan]

Title town was the exception, not the rule. Anyone who remembers the history of Boston sports before 2002 can tell you that.

True but the 80s were pretty darn good to the city.  That was an exciting time.

Fair point! Three championships in five seasons is nothing to scoff at. And, of course, there is the spectre of Len Bias (and a little later Reggie Lewis) hanging over the latter half of those years as well.

It may have been 18 years since our last ring but I'll take those 18 years in a heartbeat over the 22 between '86 and '08. We had:
The Last Ride of the Big 3 (1 Finals appearance, solid playoff runs)
The Emergence of Wunderkind Brad Stevens
The Rise of Isaiah Thomas
The "exciting times" of Kyrie Irving, Gordon Hayward, and Big Al
The Emergence of the best in-house Celtics talent in a decade

Compare that to
The parts I can't remember
Rick Pitino's Greatest Hits, including  Larry Bird's Not Walking Through That Door
Let's Tank for Tim Duncan
There Ain't No Fours
The Stabbing
&c.

Don't forget the deaths of Len Bias and Reggie Lewis (one of the worst days of my childhood).
The drafting of Acie Earl
The drafting of Eric Montross
The signing of Travis Knight
The trading of Chauncey Billups
The trading of Joe Johnson