Gasper: Beal for Brown trade proposal. Yes or No? (poll)

[RJ87]

Straight up? I'd do Brown for Beal and not lose any sleep over it.

[Moranis]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

He isn't a #1.  He isn't a top 10 player and I don't even think he is a top 15 player and he is in the heart of his prime.  He isn't going to go up a level at this point.  And unless the #1 he is with is someone like Jokic or KG i.e. not a ball dominant scorer, then his value as a sidekick is lessened a great deal because he is a poor defender, doesn't rebound well, is good but not great passer, and isn't even an elite shooter.  He is an excellent scorer, but that is about it.  He is in his 9th year and hasn't ever made an All NBA Team.  Just a 3-time all star (including this year).  Beal is a very good player, but he absolutely is not elite. 

Now don't get me wrong, I don't think Brown will ever be an elite player, but I do think Brown could top out in the top 15 and his skill set is much better suited in a complimentary role because he is an elite defender that is incredibly versatile on that end of the floor.  And Brown is actually a far more consistent shooter and as his volume has increased his percentage hasn't gone off a cliff like Beal's has.  Even things like FT generation, Brown is ahead of where Beal was at year 5. 

Brown will top out as a better player than Beal.  He is a good deal younger.  And is much better suited in a complimentary role to Tatum.  There is no way I'd trade Brown for Beal.  None at all.  I wouldn't mind Beal if the trade was Walker and draft picks, as I think that has merit, but not trading Brown.  Terrible trade and a terrible idea.

[Moranis]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

To be fair Tatum, Beal and Brown all look like they're going to 'top out as #2s' right now in an ideal situation. It doesn't mean that they can't be #1s on viable title contenders, they would just need more help than truly great players.

Tatum absolutely has #1, MVP level potential.  May not get there of course, but Tatum imo is a future franchise player.  His progression has been fantastic and he has all of the tools.  I'd actually be surprised if Tatum doesn't have at least 1 top 5 season (i.e. top 5 MVP voting finish) in his career. 

[Goldstar88]

I would not make that deal. Beal is going to be 28 in a few months, Brown is 24. Brown is a 6’6” wing and can guard multiple positions. Beal is 6’3”. I wouldn’t want to trade for a guy that only has 1 more year on his contract and have to give up JB who is also an all star and  is signed to a reasonable long term deal.

[Goldstar88]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

To be fair Tatum, Beal and Brown all look like they're going to 'top out as #2s' right now in an ideal situation. It doesn't mean that they can't be #1s on viable title contenders, they would just need more help than truly great players.

Tatum absolutely has #1, MVP level potential.  May not get there of course, but Tatum imo is a future franchise player.  His progression has been fantastic and he has all of the tools.  I'd actually be surprised if Tatum doesn't have at least 1 top 5 season (i.e. top 5 MVP voting finish) in his career.

He hates Tatum. Don’t go there lol. It’s not worth it.

[ScoobyDoo]

The following is on point from "Slamtheking:

"tough call but for me, the point of acquiring Beal is to ADD him to the J's, not replace one of them.  adding Beal would add a more reliable offensive player (but not by a lot -- JB can put up a lot of points as well) but a less versatile defender.  Not to mention Beal has 3 less years of prime time left and a much more expensive contract.

the whole point of acquiring another all-star is to add to the 2 young ones we already have".

We need to add another star to Jayson and Jaylen. Actually this should be the single most important thing Ainge focuses on. It's also part of the reason I'm personally royally aggravated with Ainge. For the last 3-4 years, by nearly every NBA pundit's perspective the Celtics have easily had the single largest war chest in the league (between talented young players, draft capital and solid veterans) and yet, Ainge has failed on the #1 priority, getting that third star - it's truly pathetic. Horford, Hayward and Irving all walk for zero - brutal. Ok, end of rant - I'll give Danny the game plan, he can follow it and take credit and again, following the comments from s"lamtheking":

Beal isn't going to win anything in Washington. He and Tatum, by all accounts, are truly great friends.

1. Use your TPE to sign a meaningful player whose contract ends when Kemba's ends (Love or Horford,or similar contract)

2. Have Tatum talk wtih Beal to see if he's committed to coming to Boston in free agency.

3. When Kemba and Horford come off, you sign Beal at 28 or 29 years old and add him to Tatum and Brown.

4. Your line up is:

Time Lord / Theis / Free Agent
Tatum / Free agent PF (with legit PF size) / Grant Williams
Brown / Langford       
Beal / Nesmith
Smart / Pritchard

You fill in the rest of the pieces... That's one option to build a championship team. Ainge can call me if he wants more clues...

[Ogaju]

Chris Gasper from 98.5 suggested before that it would be a tough pill to swallow...  but he would trade Brown for Beal. 

If the Wizards end up looking to trade Beal.  Would you make this difficult trade?

What would provide the Celts a higher chance to reach the finals.  Tatum and Brown core or Tatum and Beal core?

Why would it be difficult. You make that deal without hesitation.

[Ogaju]

People are acting like Brown isn't a great player in his own right , there's no chance in hell that I would let a wing who's bordering All-NBA calibre go when he's on a bargain contract for a combo guard who's considerably older and not much better.

And yes raw on/off does not relegate Brown to being a C list star.

Considerably older...you guys should just stop about this age thing. It is pure speculation how players will age.

[colincb]

No.

Brown's younger, cheaper, has a better overall Real +/-, and has 4+ years experience here. He's a smart kid whose work ethic is known to be elite.

Beal's defensive Real +/- is seventh-worst per ESPN. Last season he was third-worst behind only a toasted IT and Trae Young.

2021 Overall RPM +/-
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm

2021 Defensive Real +/-
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/page/12/sort/DRPM

2020 Defensive Real +/-
http://www.espn.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/year/2020/page/13/sort/DRPM

[gouki88]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

Beal has only ever been a #2 on teams that have been good though, just like Brown. Beal has never shown to be able to be a #1 guy on a good team, and would be much more expensive than JB as well as being older.

[Tr1boy]

Straight up? I'd do Brown for Beal and not lose any sleep over it.

Well that would be cool

But dont think it would be straight up

Beal is scoring 7 more points per game than Brown

But Brown is young and locked up to a longer contract

Beal is the better scorer and more clutch

In the playoffs counterpunches are crucial.... and one or two missed responses could cost you the game

Game 1 vs the Heat for example. Celtics were imposing their will on the Heat and carried a 15 point like lead into the half.  Then the Heat imposed their will in the 2nd half.   Game 6. Same tragic ending.

2018 vs Cavs. Game 7. Celts ran out of gas in the 4th.  Nobody could buy a bucket

The point of these situations are... I would be confident with Beal,   the counter punches will be there

[Tr1boy]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

Beal has only ever been a #2 on teams that have been good though, just like Brown. Beal has never shown to be able to be a #1 guy on a good team, and would be much more expensive than JB as well as being older.

These past two years he has shown to be a #1.  This season, he is leading the league in PPG

Leading the league in PPG but #2 type player?

[gouki88]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

Beal has only ever been a #2 on teams that have been good though, just like Brown. Beal has never shown to be able to be a #1 guy on a good team, and would be much more expensive than JB as well as being older.

These past two years he has shown to be a #1.  This season, he is leading the league in PPG

Leading the league in PPG but #2 type player?

Yeah, but he's doing it on a terrible team. I doubt Beal gets 24 shots on any halfway decent team, and he's only ever been a #2 guy on good teams

[Tr1boy]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

Beal has only ever been a #2 on teams that have been good though, just like Brown. Beal has never shown to be able to be a #1 guy on a good team, and would be much more expensive than JB as well as being older.

These past two years he has shown to be a #1.  This season, he is leading the league in PPG

Leading the league in PPG but #2 type player?

Yeah, but he's doing it on a terrible team. I doubt Beal gets 24 shots on any halfway decent team, and he's only ever been a #2 guy on good teams

They are 7-3 in their last 10 games

Much better than the Celts

If Bonga hits one open three we lose tonight. 

Beal has to do the heavy lifting but is also clutch

[Somebody]

Nope.  no reason to shrink the window for a player that tops out as a #2 who has a similar ceiling to Brown.

Are you serious?

Beal is elite

To be fair Tatum, Beal and Brown all look like they're going to 'top out as #2s' right now in an ideal situation. It doesn't mean that they can't be #1s on viable title contenders, they would just need more help than truly great players.

Tatum absolutely has #1, MVP level potential.  May not get there of course, but Tatum imo is a future franchise player.  His progression has been fantastic and he has all of the tools. I'd actually be surprised if Tatum doesn't have at least 1 top 5 season (i.e. top 5 MVP voting finish) in his career.

By that logic every half decent draft prospect has All-Star potential , my point was that it's unlikely that he'll get to that level.

And I sound like a broken record at this point, but accolades absolutely suck at evaluating how good a player is. It's very much possible Tatum can get a top 5 MVP finish this year if we go on a run just from our guys coming back and most people on this forum would say that it's undeserved. Heck, Anthony Davis has never had a top 5 MVP voting finish and a good amount of people would say that he's one of the best players in the league, if not the best.