Author Topic: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?  (Read 1227 times)

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Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #15 on: October 26, 2020, 09:24:37 AM »

Offline td450

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Kemba is a deteriorating asset. Great human being and a proven NBA scorer. But he's not a creator, he's a defensive liability and his game is built on those explosive stop start moves. Chronic knee issues could make him a diminished player going forward. What he was the last few years doesn't matter any more. What is he next May? Probably even less than he was in the recent playoffs.

He also showed us a lack of poise under pressure. Regardless of how healthy he was, he didn't give the team the ball movement it needed in crunch time.

I would be happy with any trade that moved him on. If he stays, I hope he assumes a Lou Williams type role on this team.

Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #16 on: October 26, 2020, 12:06:44 PM »

Offline Spicoli

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This guy gets blocked at the rim way too much for my liking. IT was a tiny guard but he was a much better finisher who didn't get blocked as much as Kemba does. If Kemba's shot isn't falling he's useless.

Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #17 on: October 26, 2020, 12:32:27 PM »

Offline footey

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Kemba is a deteriorating asset. Great human being and a proven NBA scorer. But he's not a creator, he's a defensive liability and his game is built on those explosive stop start moves. Chronic knee issues could make him a diminished player going forward. What he was the last few years doesn't matter any more. What is he next May? Probably even less than he was in the recent playoffs.

He also showed us a lack of poise under pressure. Regardless of how healthy he was, he didn't give the team the ball movement it needed in crunch time.

I would be happy with any trade that moved him on. If he stays, I hope he assumes a Lou Williams type role on this team.

Max contract for Lou Williams role. Ouch.

Danny may have screwed up with this signing.

Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #18 on: October 26, 2020, 01:01:15 PM »

Offline dannyboy35

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  Why is there no news on Kemba’s  knee? Theis has his knee cleared out. Not hearing Kemba’s knee status being questioned really. At least not enough. Has anyone heard a direct question asked to the Celts about this knee health since we were eliminated? It has to have been asked but I don’t know about it.

Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #19 on: October 26, 2020, 01:16:50 PM »

Offline td450

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Kemba is a deteriorating asset. Great human being and a proven NBA scorer. But he's not a creator, he's a defensive liability and his game is built on those explosive stop start moves. Chronic knee issues could make him a diminished player going forward. What he was the last few years doesn't matter any more. What is he next May? Probably even less than he was in the recent playoffs.

He also showed us a lack of poise under pressure. Regardless of how healthy he was, he didn't give the team the ball movement it needed in crunch time.

I would be happy with any trade that moved him on. If he stays, I hope he assumes a Lou Williams type role on this team.

Max contract for Lou Williams role. Ouch.

Danny may have screwed up with this signing.

Yes he did.

In his defense, he may have not seen the knee issues as being this significant. He may also have not anticipated Tatum and Brown being ready to take over the team this quickly, and he may have thought it important to remain a competitive team to ensure signing Tatum and Hayward.

Ainge probably felt he had to spend the money while he was able to. If you look at the free agent list from 2019, the only clearly obvious smarter choice out of the players that actually could have been signed was Brogdon.

But now he's in a bit of a bind. The team needs to shift 6+ more shots per game to Tatum and Brown next year, and they will be the center of the offense. He's found out that Walker and Hayward are very good when they are healthy, but don't play so well when dinged up, and aren't fearless or particularly clever when it counts, which is the main reason for wanting such kinds of players.


We will get to see this team again pretty soon. It will be very interesting to see if Ainge makes any deals and if they are still here, if Stevens can get Kemba and Marcus to make the changes they need to make. I think Hayward is more likely to fit into a complimentary role if he can resign for a reasonable number. But Kemba is a costly mistake right now.

Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #20 on: October 26, 2020, 01:20:37 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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Kemba is a deteriorating asset. Great human being and a proven NBA scorer. But he's not a creator, he's a defensive liability and his game is built on those explosive stop start moves. Chronic knee issues could make him a diminished player going forward. What he was the last few years doesn't matter any more. What is he next May? Probably even less than he was in the recent playoffs.

He also showed us a lack of poise under pressure. Regardless of how healthy he was, he didn't give the team the ball movement it needed in crunch time.

I would be happy with any trade that moved him on. If he stays, I hope he assumes a Lou Williams type role on this team.

Max contract for Lou Williams role. Ouch.

Danny may have screwed up with this signing.


Kemba's 30.  He was available 56/72 games.  Played 31 mpg.

20 pts, 4.8 ast, 3.9 reb, 0.9 steals, 4.3 FTA

57.5% True Shooting, 24% AST%, 10.5% TOV%.



Compare that to his previous season, where he played all 82 games and scored 25 per game but was a bit less efficient as the #1 scoring option.


Overall he was very good considering he was the 2nd or 3rd scoring option for the team all year.  He's a bit of a liability on defense, but that's true of most scoring oriented guards.  He does not compare at all to Lou Williams in that regard -- Sweet Lou is a sieve. 

If Kemba was above average for his position on defense he'd be fantastic, and probably would not have been available for the Celts to sign.


He wasn't quite at the same level in the playoffs, but you expect that for a smaller guard.  Yet overall his scoring efficiency in the playoffs remained about the same (57.3% TS) and he was available for all 17 games while playing 37 mpg.



Kemba wasn't signed to carry the franchise.  Yes he's making a  lot of money.  But that's the price of a perennial All-Star in his prime.  He's got two years left and it's probably reasonable to expect his production to decline slightly even as his salary rises.  Again, that's what you're going to get when you sign a guy in UFA.


It's simply not true that Kemba is inefficient, that he's not a passer, or that he's a bad value on his contract.  It is true that his contract isn't anything close to a steal.  It's market value.

Kemba's deal would bother me if he was signed to be the best player on the team.  He's obviously not up to that.  Thankfully he's not required to be the best guy, and his age-related decline should coincide with the rest of the team getting better and more mature.


More than anything Kemba provided stability and positive leadership in the wake of the disaster of the 2019 season which resulted in Kyrie and Horford departing.  The Celts would have faced a much more drastic overhaul of their roster and system if they hadn't been able to plug in a relatively similar player to Kyrie's spot.  I expect they would have struggled this season without a lead guard with Kemba's scoring profile, especially early on.
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Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #21 on: October 26, 2020, 01:34:37 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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A very simple metric that I look at is total points per shot.  Kemba averaged over 20 pts on just 16 shots per game last season.  That is pretty good.  He is a very good player.  4-Time all star.  I think people are weighting his most recent play over the broader sample size.  He was not good in the playoffs, that is a fact.

I don't know what the issue is with his knee.  If that is damaged, then of course, that changes things but he has been a durable player for his career.  I am not opposed to trading him if we can get a good deal though.  I think he has value to other teams (as well as to us).  For example, would he be better for the Knicks than Chris Paul?  And I think he would be great for Philly, just the kind of player they need to play off or play to Embiid, Harris, etc.

I understand why Ainge signed/traded for him.  It kind of allowed him to preserve some over the cap limit space.  Now he has him as a tradeable asset that could prove valuable either by allowing us to take salary back or by getting a trade exemption.  If we didn't do anything or just signed Terry Rozier, that salary cap would be lost.

Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #22 on: October 26, 2020, 02:20:23 PM »

Offline td450

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Kemba is a deteriorating asset. Great human being and a proven NBA scorer. But he's not a creator, he's a defensive liability and his game is built on those explosive stop start moves. Chronic knee issues could make him a diminished player going forward. What he was the last few years doesn't matter any more. What is he next May? Probably even less than he was in the recent playoffs.

He also showed us a lack of poise under pressure. Regardless of how healthy he was, he didn't give the team the ball movement it needed in crunch time.

I would be happy with any trade that moved him on. If he stays, I hope he assumes a Lou Williams type role on this team.

Max contract for Lou Williams role. Ouch.

Danny may have screwed up with this signing.


Kemba's 30.  He was available 56/72 games.  Played 31 mpg.

20 pts, 4.8 ast, 3.9 reb, 0.9 steals, 4.3 FTA

57.5% True Shooting, 24% AST%, 10.5% TOV%.



Compare that to his previous season, where he played all 82 games and scored 25 per game but was a bit less efficient as the #1 scoring option.


Overall he was very good considering he was the 2nd or 3rd scoring option for the team all year.  He's a bit of a liability on defense, but that's true of most scoring oriented guards.  He does not compare at all to Lou Williams in that regard -- Sweet Lou is a sieve. 

If Kemba was above average for his position on defense he'd be fantastic, and probably would not have been available for the Celts to sign.


He wasn't quite at the same level in the playoffs, but you expect that for a smaller guard.  Yet overall his scoring efficiency in the playoffs remained about the same (57.3% TS) and he was available for all 17 games while playing 37 mpg.



Kemba wasn't signed to carry the franchise.  Yes he's making a  lot of money.  But that's the price of a perennial All-Star in his prime.  He's got two years left and it's probably reasonable to expect his production to decline slightly even as his salary rises.  Again, that's what you're going to get when you sign a guy in UFA.


It's simply not true that Kemba is inefficient, that he's not a passer, or that he's a bad value on his contract.  It is true that his contract isn't anything close to a steal.  It's market value.

Kemba's deal would bother me if he was signed to be the best player on the team.  He's obviously not up to that.  Thankfully he's not required to be the best guy, and his age-related decline should coincide with the rest of the team getting better and more mature.


More than anything Kemba provided stability and positive leadership in the wake of the disaster of the 2019 season which resulted in Kyrie and Horford departing.  The Celts would have faced a much more drastic overhaul of their roster and system if they hadn't been able to plug in a relatively similar player to Kyrie's spot.  I expect they would have struggled this season without a lead guard with Kemba's scoring profile, especially early on.

What you wrote is all true, except the passing part. He is not incompetent as a passer, but he's not a reliable creator either. He is only above average as a scorer.

His knee situation deteriorated towards the end of year. He caught a lucky break where he was given ample time to rest and rehab, and it didn't work. That is scary.

There is a regular season and the playoffs. We mostly care about the playoffs. I agree his defense was OK during the regular season.

In the playoffs, he got killed. He also just didn't give us what we really needed from him. He didn't provide end of game poise. He didn't get the offense into any actions. He didn't make consistently good decisions.



Re: Is kemba a bad shooter/Scorer?
« Reply #23 on: October 26, 2020, 07:55:14 PM »

Offline RodyTur10

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PhoSita is right that he's just paid market value. There are like 40 All Star caliber players each year and there are 30 teams in the league, so yes sure Walker would've gotten a max contract somewhere else.

The question is whether you want to be the team that has Kemba Walker of that top 40 group. With these reports coming in that the cap might drop, that Walker contract is looking more like a burden.

We have Walker (max), we have Tatum (upcoming max), we have Brown (near max), we still got Hayward (max), we have Smart. The roster is becoming very expensive very quickly. Unless the owners are prepared to pay a historically high amount of taxes this current roster isn't sustanaible. Something's gotta give.

When you ask we which players you're most inclined to keep from that group (Walker/Smart/Brown/Hayward/Tatum), my order is as follows: 1. Tatum 2. Brown 3. Smart 4. Hayward 5. Walker.

So I want to keep building around Tatum, Brown and (to a lesser extent) Smart and then it's the question if we can resign Hayward on a reasonable deal. I just don't know about a good trade for Walker, though the Knicks with #8 pick seems like a possible destination. Maybe Orlando?
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