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Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #30 on: May 08, 2020, 10:58:09 AM »

Online Tr1boy

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Between Paul Reed or Patrick Williams- which 3 and D (potential) player do you guys like better?

Both have long wingspans but Reed is very long. His reach looks at the level of a center. 

I like Patrick Williams drive and pop capability.  Like some have said, it is Kahwi Leonardesque

Paul Reed ability to run around screens or get to an open spot for a 3 point shot (pulling the interior players out to the perimeter) is intriguing

Paul Reed could use some more meat in his body but works for rebounds and blocking shots.   Kind of reminds me of a longer Daniel Theis
« Last Edit: May 08, 2020, 11:16:35 AM by Tr1boy »

Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #31 on: May 08, 2020, 03:37:39 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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Between Paul Reed or Patrick Williams- which 3 and D (potential) player do you guys like better?

Both have long wingspans but Reed is very long. His reach looks at the level of a center. 

I like Patrick Williams drive and pop capability.  Like some have said, it is Kahwi Leonardesque

Paul Reed ability to run around screens or get to an open spot for a 3 point shot (pulling the interior players out to the perimeter) is intriguing

Paul Reed could use some more meat in his body but works for rebounds and blocking shots.   Kind of reminds me of a longer Daniel Theis

Reed kills me because I want to like him but in an era without tweeners he is still a tweener. If he was a little stronger and had better body control he could be a swing man in the Siakam mold. Watching him play I keep waiting to see him euro step past a defender and throw down a dunk in the lane and it never happens. Instead he is a mobile big man with below average strength who is forced to finish at weird angles around the rim.

Williams I could see being a nice fit for the Celtics. I see him developing into playing a similar role on D as Grant Williams. He is taller and longer then G Williams and a much better vertical athlete. I really think he could thrive as a small ball 5. On offense he shows flashes as a shooter and projects to be a decent NBA 3pt shooter. He also has enough perimeter skills that he could surprise people with his ceiling. He is a guy I would be absolutely fine with the Cs landing at #17     
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Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #32 on: May 08, 2020, 05:43:12 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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I doubt GSW take Ball unless it's for a trade

I see them taking Toppin one way or the other

I'm not sure I understand your thinking here. Toppin is not a great passer and a very questionable defender. That doesn't really fit the mold of their offense.

If you think they want a rim runner, they could get one off the scrap heap for a vet minimum.

Unless they think Toppin is clear and away the best prospect in the draft, I doubt they would take him.

1st this is not a very strong draft

2nd GSW have a hole upfront. Toppin ability to shoot the 3 is a bonus

3rd Warriors play team D . Toppin doesn't have to be exceptional. As long as he learns the system, utilizes his physical tools and puts in consistent effort. 

If Toppin can provide a similar role to what Harrison Barnes did several years ago (just a pf version), that would be a nice fit

You can let him loose on offense at times and give Curry, Klay time to breathe a little. Also if Toppin starts to catch fire/attention it opens up space for the rest

I agree Toppin has a lot of value on offense and that this draft has a weak  top 10. I'm just not sold that GS will want a big man who they have to actively work to hide on defense. Their 2015 dominance was often sparked by their small ball lineup with Green at the 5 and Barnes at the 4 Toppin is roughly the size of Barnes but with the perimeter mobility of a true center. This would likely force him to the bench in crutch time, I find it hard to see a team drafting a player top 3 who need to sit at the end of playoff games.

Really? He has good quickness/long strides and good hops

His footwork needs refinement (especially on D end)

If you play Toppin, Green, Wiggins, Thompson, Curry..... can't see why that can't be potential crunch time lineup

He is very explosive vertically but has high hips and I just donít ever see him ever becoming a mediocre defender. While that lineup couls be good in crunch time I donít think itís the championship level great lineup the GS will be striving for.

I doubt the Warriors are at all worried about finding a big man. During their championship run it the 5 has been their least priority position. They need to figure out how to replicate their previous Barnes/AI/Livingston production with Wiggins and ??. This might mean trading Wigging, trading their pick for a vet, taking a player like Ball, or the my favorite scenario they trade down for a role player who can fit their style.

I am not buying any of the projections that have the taking a PG or SG  #1 to sit on the bench all game while Clay and Curry play like the whole game. And Clay just signed a 5 year max so no SG is getting any real minutes their whole rookie deal.   I think they draft James Wiseman and he starts at Center day 1.

You say a big man wasn't a priority but really it wasn't an offensive priority, but they made sure they had defensive bigs for all their championship runs.   

2014-15
Andrew Bogut 7'0 defensive anchor in the paint.
Festus Ezeli 6'11 serviceable back up, could protect the rim and rebound for a good 10-15 minutes a game.
Marreese Speights 6'10 Not as good as Ezeli but was a big body that could be counted on for a few minutes in a pinch. 
Ognjen Kuzmić 7'1 a second year player that didn't pan out but still they clearly drafted him because of his size.
4 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 2 6'9 players in David Lee and James Michael McAdoo.  Lee sucked on D but McAdoo was booked as a defender coming out of college.

2015-16
Andrew Bogut 7'0, Festus Ezeli 6'11, Marreese Speights 6'10, all back for another season. 
Jason Thompson 6'11, Anderson Varej„o 6'10, two experienced veteran bigs the Wariors brought in to make another title run. 
I think the turning point in the championship was when Bogut got hurt.  that's when Cleveland started to score in the paint at will and were able to make a comeback and win the title. 
5 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had two 6'9 players in rookie Kevon Looney and James Michael McAdoo

2016-17
big changes to the the roster when adding Durant, needed to overhaul the supporting cast. 
Kevin Durant 6'10 didn't play center but still is 6'10 and created serious match up problems with his size.
Zaza Pachulia 6'11, JaVale McGee 7'0, Anderson Varej„o 6'10 center by committee all defensive oriented and all 6'10 or bigger.
Damian Jones 6'11 rookie, the warriors went with a big man with their first round pick.
5 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 3 players 6'9 in Kevon Looney, David West and James Michael McAdoo

2017-18
Kevin Durant 6'10, Zaza Pachulia 6'11, JaVale McGee 7'0, and Damian Jones 6'11 all came back for another run. 
4 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 4 players 6'9 in Kevon Looney, David West, Omri Casspi, and rookie Chris Boucher.  Note rookie Jordan Bell came up bigger than his 6'8 size.

2018-19
Kevin Durant 6'10 and Damian Jones 6'11 came back.
Andrew Bogut 7'0 came back for one last go around.
DeMarcus Cousins 6'10 was supposed to be a genius move and make them even more unbeatable.
They even added former celtic Jonas Jerebko 6'10.
5 players 6'10 or bigger
Kevon Looney was the only 6'9 guy on this roster but they still had Jordan Bell who played bigger than 6'8.

The Warriors rosters were all ways loaded with defensive bigs and really their guards and wings were big too. Clay is like 6'7 and Curry is the team midget at 6'3.  Small ball is misunderstood.  The GSW had really big teams for their "small ball" runs.  Really they just rotated Green to center for a brief stint while they ran up some quick points then rotate back to a 6'10 or bigger center.   Check the minutes GSW had someone 6'10 or bigger on the court most of the time during all their games during all their runs.  Kerr understands the need for size. Which is why they're going to pick Wiseman.  The only undersized player on those Bull's teams was Rodman.   Chicago was a really big team that played lock down defense.  Everyone remembers Jordan and Pippen but they constantly rotated defensive minded bigs 6'10 - 7'0 in to lock down the paint.  Heck Ron Harper was a 6'6 defensive minded PG.  A 6'6 PG is huge today and it was giant back then.  If you had a 6'1 PG and 6'3 SG you had a huge back court with both at 6'6 Jordan and Harper were giants who could defend.  Pippin was 6'9 when SFs were 6'5-6'7.  The Bull were a huge team and Kerr's Warriors were actually really big too.  Green was like his Rodman. 

Back to the Boston Celtics since this is Celtics blog.  This mock draft is great for us.  I really really like Jalen Smith and we need a full sized PF/C badly. Brad demands switch ability on D and the ability to stretch the floor on O, Big Al did that and Jalen Smith can as well.  We need size badly and at 17 Jalen Smith may really be the BPA. This draft has at lot of parody or at least perceived parody so we may as well take the best big man available and that's what this CBS mock seems to be doing at 17 and 26.    Oturu looks like a solid choice.  I like Tillman too as a defensive minded center but  Oturu is a little longer and seems to be still developing his game.    Oturu and Tillman both look to be solid back up centers but Oturu may have more potential.  Patrick Williams is a big strong wing who can defend so another good pick.  We have three players without a guaranteed contract so drafting three players is no big deal.  If we cut our french big man we can add 4 new players without making a trade.   Sure a trade would be nice but I like the potential for rotational players more in this draft than what I've seen from the guys we drafted last year.   G. Williams and Langford may be all that stick from that draft and they look to be good bench players on a championship team, glue guys. Smith and Oturu look like they could be starters  on a championship team.  they are full size very long players who bring what any team would love from the 4 and 5.  I can see them as part of a nice starting five for us in a year or two.

2021-2022 roster if this CBS draft is true and the players pan out and Hayward leaves after next season for a bigger role and we make no trades. So highly unlikely but it doesn't look half bad at all.  It looks like it can win a title. 

PG: Walker, Smart, 2020 2nd round pick maybe Payton Pritchard or Cassius Winston
SG: Brown, Langford, Edwards
SF: Tatum, P. Williams, 2021 1st round pick
PF: Smith, G. Williams, ring chasing vet min deal
C:  Oturu , R. Williams, Theis

Before you flame me for putting Theis 3rd string, in two years Williams needs to be a better player than Theis if he's going to stay on this team.  Also, since its all just guessing maybe in two years Oturu can be better than both of them, then we would have a beast at center.    Same goes for PF.  After 2 years Smith could be like a young Horford with the old Horford's 3 point shot.

Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #33 on: May 08, 2020, 07:02:46 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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I doubt GSW take Ball unless it's for a trade

I see them taking Toppin one way or the other

I'm not sure I understand your thinking here. Toppin is not a great passer and a very questionable defender. That doesn't really fit the mold of their offense.

If you think they want a rim runner, they could get one off the scrap heap for a vet minimum.

Unless they think Toppin is clear and away the best prospect in the draft, I doubt they would take him.

1st this is not a very strong draft

2nd GSW have a hole upfront. Toppin ability to shoot the 3 is a bonus

3rd Warriors play team D . Toppin doesn't have to be exceptional. As long as he learns the system, utilizes his physical tools and puts in consistent effort. 

If Toppin can provide a similar role to what Harrison Barnes did several years ago (just a pf version), that would be a nice fit

You can let him loose on offense at times and give Curry, Klay time to breathe a little. Also if Toppin starts to catch fire/attention it opens up space for the rest

I agree Toppin has a lot of value on offense and that this draft has a weak  top 10. I'm just not sold that GS will want a big man who they have to actively work to hide on defense. Their 2015 dominance was often sparked by their small ball lineup with Green at the 5 and Barnes at the 4 Toppin is roughly the size of Barnes but with the perimeter mobility of a true center. This would likely force him to the bench in crutch time, I find it hard to see a team drafting a player top 3 who need to sit at the end of playoff games.

Really? He has good quickness/long strides and good hops

His footwork needs refinement (especially on D end)

If you play Toppin, Green, Wiggins, Thompson, Curry..... can't see why that can't be potential crunch time lineup

He is very explosive vertically but has high hips and I just donít ever see him ever becoming a mediocre defender. While that lineup couls be good in crunch time I donít think itís the championship level great lineup the GS will be striving for.

I doubt the Warriors are at all worried about finding a big man. During their championship run it the 5 has been their least priority position. They need to figure out how to replicate their previous Barnes/AI/Livingston production with Wiggins and ??. This might mean trading Wigging, trading their pick for a vet, taking a player like Ball, or the my favorite scenario they trade down for a role player who can fit their style.

I am not buying any of the projections that have the taking a PG or SG  #1 to sit on the bench all game while Clay and Curry play like the whole game. And Clay just signed a 5 year max so no SG is getting any real minutes their whole rookie deal.   I think they draft James Wiseman and he starts at Center day 1.

You say a big man wasn't a priority but really it wasn't an offensive priority, but they made sure they had defensive bigs for all their championship runs.   

2014-15
Andrew Bogut 7'0 defensive anchor in the paint.
Festus Ezeli 6'11 serviceable back up, could protect the rim and rebound for a good 10-15 minutes a game.
Marreese Speights 6'10 Not as good as Ezeli but was a big body that could be counted on for a few minutes in a pinch. 
Ognjen Kuzmić 7'1 a second year player that didn't pan out but still they clearly drafted him because of his size.
4 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 2 6'9 players in David Lee and James Michael McAdoo.  Lee sucked on D but McAdoo was booked as a defender coming out of college.

2015-16
Andrew Bogut 7'0, Festus Ezeli 6'11, Marreese Speights 6'10, all back for another season. 
Jason Thompson 6'11, Anderson Varej„o 6'10, two experienced veteran bigs the Wariors brought in to make another title run. 
I think the turning point in the championship was when Bogut got hurt.  that's when Cleveland started to score in the paint at will and were able to make a comeback and win the title. 
5 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had two 6'9 players in rookie Kevon Looney and James Michael McAdoo

2016-17
big changes to the the roster when adding Durant, needed to overhaul the supporting cast. 
Kevin Durant 6'10 didn't play center but still is 6'10 and created serious match up problems with his size.
Zaza Pachulia 6'11, JaVale McGee 7'0, Anderson Varej„o 6'10 center by committee all defensive oriented and all 6'10 or bigger.
Damian Jones 6'11 rookie, the warriors went with a big man with their first round pick.
5 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 3 players 6'9 in Kevon Looney, David West and James Michael McAdoo

2017-18
Kevin Durant 6'10, Zaza Pachulia 6'11, JaVale McGee 7'0, and Damian Jones 6'11 all came back for another run. 
4 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 4 players 6'9 in Kevon Looney, David West, Omri Casspi, and rookie Chris Boucher.  Note rookie Jordan Bell came up bigger than his 6'8 size.

2018-19
Kevin Durant 6'10 and Damian Jones 6'11 came back.
Andrew Bogut 7'0 came back for one last go around.
DeMarcus Cousins 6'10 was supposed to be a genius move and make them even more unbeatable.
They even added former celtic Jonas Jerebko 6'10.
5 players 6'10 or bigger
Kevon Looney was the only 6'9 guy on this roster but they still had Jordan Bell who played bigger than 6'8.

The Warriors rosters were all ways loaded with defensive bigs and really their guards and wings were big too. Clay is like 6'7 and Curry is the team midget at 6'3.  Small ball is misunderstood.  The GSW had really big teams for their "small ball" runs.  Really they just rotated Green to center for a brief stint while they ran up some quick points then rotate back to a 6'10 or bigger center.   Check the minutes GSW had someone 6'10 or bigger on the court most of the time during all their games during all their runs.  Kerr understands the need for size. Which is why they're going to pick Wiseman.  The only undersized player on those Bull's teams was Rodman.   Chicago was a really big team that played lock down defense.  Everyone remembers Jordan and Pippen but they constantly rotated defensive minded bigs 6'10 - 7'0 in to lock down the paint.  Heck Ron Harper was a 6'6 defensive minded PG.  A 6'6 PG is huge today and it was giant back then.  If you had a 6'1 PG and 6'3 SG you had a huge back court with both at 6'6 Jordan and Harper were giants who could defend.  Pippin was 6'9 when SFs were 6'5-6'7.  The Bull were a huge team and Kerr's Warriors were actually really big too.  Green was like his Rodman. 

Back to the Boston Celtics since this is Celtics blog.  This mock draft is great for us.  I really really like Jalen Smith and we need a full sized PF/C badly. Brad demands switch ability on D and the ability to stretch the floor on O, Big Al did that and Jalen Smith can as well.  We need size badly and at 17 Jalen Smith may really be the BPA. This draft has at lot of parody or at least perceived parody so we may as well take the best big man available and that's what this CBS mock seems to be doing at 17 and 26.    Oturu looks like a solid choice.  I like Tillman too as a defensive minded center but  Oturu is a little longer and seems to be still developing his game.    Oturu and Tillman both look to be solid back up centers but Oturu may have more potential.  Patrick Williams is a big strong wing who can defend so another good pick.  We have three players without a guaranteed contract so drafting three players is no big deal.  If we cut our french big man we can add 4 new players without making a trade.   Sure a trade would be nice but I like the potential for rotational players more in this draft than what I've seen from the guys we drafted last year.   G. Williams and Langford may be all that stick from that draft and they look to be good bench players on a championship team, glue guys. Smith and Oturu look like they could be starters  on a championship team.  they are full size very long players who bring what any team would love from the 4 and 5.  I can see them as part of a nice starting five for us in a year or two.

2021-2022 roster if this CBS draft is true and the players pan out and Hayward leaves after next season for a bigger role and we make no trades. So highly unlikely but it doesn't look half bad at all.  It looks like it can win a title. 

PG: Walker, Smart, 2020 2nd round pick maybe Payton Pritchard or Cassius Winston
SG: Brown, Langford, Edwards
SF: Tatum, P. Williams, 2021 1st round pick
PF: Smith, G. Williams, ring chasing vet min deal
C:  Oturu , R. Williams, Theis

Before you flame me for putting Theis 3rd string, in two years Williams needs to be a better player than Theis if he's going to stay on this team.  Also, since its all just guessing maybe in two years Oturu can be better than both of them, then we would have a beast at center.    Same goes for PF.  After 2 years Smith could be like a young Horford with the old Horford's 3 point shot.

Iím not saying GS wonít have size, unlike the rockets I expect GS will have centers on their roster just they are more likely to sign ring chasing vets and use their draft capital on players with more positional value. In past years they had AI and Livingston playing important roles off the bench. They could very easily draft a young guard or wing and incorporate them into the rotation.

As for Cs picks Iím not against J Smith but he will be a center in todayís game and has very little in common with young or old Al Horford. Oturu will be lucky to crack a rotation let alone start on a playoff team in a year.
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Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #34 on: May 09, 2020, 12:17:55 AM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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I doubt GSW take Ball unless it's for a trade

I see them taking Toppin one way or the other

I'm not sure I understand your thinking here. Toppin is not a great passer and a very questionable defender. That doesn't really fit the mold of their offense.

If you think they want a rim runner, they could get one off the scrap heap for a vet minimum.

Unless they think Toppin is clear and away the best prospect in the draft, I doubt they would take him.

1st this is not a very strong draft

2nd GSW have a hole upfront. Toppin ability to shoot the 3 is a bonus

3rd Warriors play team D . Toppin doesn't have to be exceptional. As long as he learns the system, utilizes his physical tools and puts in consistent effort. 

If Toppin can provide a similar role to what Harrison Barnes did several years ago (just a pf version), that would be a nice fit

You can let him loose on offense at times and give Curry, Klay time to breathe a little. Also if Toppin starts to catch fire/attention it opens up space for the rest

I agree Toppin has a lot of value on offense and that this draft has a weak  top 10. I'm just not sold that GS will want a big man who they have to actively work to hide on defense. Their 2015 dominance was often sparked by their small ball lineup with Green at the 5 and Barnes at the 4 Toppin is roughly the size of Barnes but with the perimeter mobility of a true center. This would likely force him to the bench in crutch time, I find it hard to see a team drafting a player top 3 who need to sit at the end of playoff games.

Really? He has good quickness/long strides and good hops

His footwork needs refinement (especially on D end)

If you play Toppin, Green, Wiggins, Thompson, Curry..... can't see why that can't be potential crunch time lineup

He is very explosive vertically but has high hips and I just donít ever see him ever becoming a mediocre defender. While that lineup couls be good in crunch time I donít think itís the championship level great lineup the GS will be striving for.

I doubt the Warriors are at all worried about finding a big man. During their championship run it the 5 has been their least priority position. They need to figure out how to replicate their previous Barnes/AI/Livingston production with Wiggins and ??. This might mean trading Wigging, trading their pick for a vet, taking a player like Ball, or the my favorite scenario they trade down for a role player who can fit their style.

I am not buying any of the projections that have the taking a PG or SG  #1 to sit on the bench all game while Clay and Curry play like the whole game. And Clay just signed a 5 year max so no SG is getting any real minutes their whole rookie deal.   I think they draft James Wiseman and he starts at Center day 1.

You say a big man wasn't a priority but really it wasn't an offensive priority, but they made sure they had defensive bigs for all their championship runs.   

2014-15
Andrew Bogut 7'0 defensive anchor in the paint.
Festus Ezeli 6'11 serviceable back up, could protect the rim and rebound for a good 10-15 minutes a game.
Marreese Speights 6'10 Not as good as Ezeli but was a big body that could be counted on for a few minutes in a pinch. 
Ognjen Kuzmić 7'1 a second year player that didn't pan out but still they clearly drafted him because of his size.
4 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 2 6'9 players in David Lee and James Michael McAdoo.  Lee sucked on D but McAdoo was booked as a defender coming out of college.

2015-16
Andrew Bogut 7'0, Festus Ezeli 6'11, Marreese Speights 6'10, all back for another season. 
Jason Thompson 6'11, Anderson Varej„o 6'10, two experienced veteran bigs the Wariors brought in to make another title run. 
I think the turning point in the championship was when Bogut got hurt.  that's when Cleveland started to score in the paint at will and were able to make a comeback and win the title. 
5 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had two 6'9 players in rookie Kevon Looney and James Michael McAdoo

2016-17
big changes to the the roster when adding Durant, needed to overhaul the supporting cast. 
Kevin Durant 6'10 didn't play center but still is 6'10 and created serious match up problems with his size.
Zaza Pachulia 6'11, JaVale McGee 7'0, Anderson Varej„o 6'10 center by committee all defensive oriented and all 6'10 or bigger.
Damian Jones 6'11 rookie, the warriors went with a big man with their first round pick.
5 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 3 players 6'9 in Kevon Looney, David West and James Michael McAdoo

2017-18
Kevin Durant 6'10, Zaza Pachulia 6'11, JaVale McGee 7'0, and Damian Jones 6'11 all came back for another run. 
4 players 6'10 or bigger
They also had 4 players 6'9 in Kevon Looney, David West, Omri Casspi, and rookie Chris Boucher.  Note rookie Jordan Bell came up bigger than his 6'8 size.

2018-19
Kevin Durant 6'10 and Damian Jones 6'11 came back.
Andrew Bogut 7'0 came back for one last go around.
DeMarcus Cousins 6'10 was supposed to be a genius move and make them even more unbeatable.
They even added former celtic Jonas Jerebko 6'10.
5 players 6'10 or bigger
Kevon Looney was the only 6'9 guy on this roster but they still had Jordan Bell who played bigger than 6'8.

The Warriors rosters were all ways loaded with defensive bigs and really their guards and wings were big too. Clay is like 6'7 and Curry is the team midget at 6'3.  Small ball is misunderstood.  The GSW had really big teams for their "small ball" runs.  Really they just rotated Green to center for a brief stint while they ran up some quick points then rotate back to a 6'10 or bigger center.   Check the minutes GSW had someone 6'10 or bigger on the court most of the time during all their games during all their runs.  Kerr understands the need for size. Which is why they're going to pick Wiseman.  The only undersized player on those Bull's teams was Rodman.   Chicago was a really big team that played lock down defense.  Everyone remembers Jordan and Pippen but they constantly rotated defensive minded bigs 6'10 - 7'0 in to lock down the paint.  Heck Ron Harper was a 6'6 defensive minded PG.  A 6'6 PG is huge today and it was giant back then.  If you had a 6'1 PG and 6'3 SG you had a huge back court with both at 6'6 Jordan and Harper were giants who could defend.  Pippin was 6'9 when SFs were 6'5-6'7.  The Bull were a huge team and Kerr's Warriors were actually really big too.  Green was like his Rodman. 

Back to the Boston Celtics since this is Celtics blog.  This mock draft is great for us.  I really really like Jalen Smith and we need a full sized PF/C badly. Brad demands switch ability on D and the ability to stretch the floor on O, Big Al did that and Jalen Smith can as well.  We need size badly and at 17 Jalen Smith may really be the BPA. This draft has at lot of parody or at least perceived parody so we may as well take the best big man available and that's what this CBS mock seems to be doing at 17 and 26.    Oturu looks like a solid choice.  I like Tillman too as a defensive minded center but  Oturu is a little longer and seems to be still developing his game.    Oturu and Tillman both look to be solid back up centers but Oturu may have more potential.  Patrick Williams is a big strong wing who can defend so another good pick.  We have three players without a guaranteed contract so drafting three players is no big deal.  If we cut our french big man we can add 4 new players without making a trade.   Sure a trade would be nice but I like the potential for rotational players more in this draft than what I've seen from the guys we drafted last year.   G. Williams and Langford may be all that stick from that draft and they look to be good bench players on a championship team, glue guys. Smith and Oturu look like they could be starters  on a championship team.  they are full size very long players who bring what any team would love from the 4 and 5.  I can see them as part of a nice starting five for us in a year or two.

2021-2022 roster if this CBS draft is true and the players pan out and Hayward leaves after next season for a bigger role and we make no trades. So highly unlikely but it doesn't look half bad at all.  It looks like it can win a title. 

PG: Walker, Smart, 2020 2nd round pick maybe Payton Pritchard or Cassius Winston
SG: Brown, Langford, Edwards
SF: Tatum, P. Williams, 2021 1st round pick
PF: Smith, G. Williams, ring chasing vet min deal
C:  Oturu , R. Williams, Theis

Before you flame me for putting Theis 3rd string, in two years Williams needs to be a better player than Theis if he's going to stay on this team.  Also, since its all just guessing maybe in two years Oturu can be better than both of them, then we would have a beast at center.    Same goes for PF.  After 2 years Smith could be like a young Horford with the old Horford's 3 point shot.

Iím not saying GS wonít have size, unlike the rockets I expect GS will have centers on their roster just they are more likely to sign ring chasing vets and use their draft capital on players with more positional value. In past years they had AI and Livingston playing important roles off the bench. They could very easily draft a young guard or wing and incorporate them into the rotation.

As for Cs picks Iím not against J Smith but he will be a center in todayís game and has very little in common with young or old Al Horford. Oturu will be lucky to crack a rotation let alone start on a playoff team in a year.

I think that NBA success is more about the mental side of a player ad less about the physical ability.  I think every player drafted has the physical skills to make it in the NBA but very few live up to their physical potential.  Players are drafted based on what they may become and it's a guessing game.  Some people like Aleksej Pokusevski based on potential others fear he'll never gain the weight needed to play against physical 4s and 5s. Its up to Aleksej Pokusevski's wok ethic and genetics. 

I like the two selections of Smith and Oturu a lot.  SMith needs to gain weight but he was 198 as a freshman, new he need to get stronger and now weighs 225.   Look at pictures of the kid he has really good mse definition in his arms.   If I had to bet on which of the two Aleksej Pokusevski or Jalen Smith would end up being a muscular 250 lbs  I take Smith all day, hes already gained half the muscle in one year.   Oturu was a guy I wasn't too keen on.  I didn't see all tat much special, but then I watched this video
(The Rise of Daniel Oturu) and I was very impressed with what the kid had to say. He talked about watching and learning from other players but he didn't throw out the obvious names fo a big man like HOF Hakeem Olajuwon or cuent stars like Anthony Davis or Joel Embiid.  He talked about other fellow players in his conference and his same year no less, that were doing some things really well and how that helped their teams win and how he knew he needed to learn to do what they were doing.  New players alway talk about being a sponge and learning from the vets but most really never do.  Oturu showed from his freshman to sophomore year that he could study and learn from the players he was playing against. 

Jimmy Butler was picked #30 because he couldn't shoot, but he worked on his game and became an all-star.  Isaiah Thomas was picked #60 because he's 5'9 and his shot wasn't as consistent as it was when he got to Boston.  He willed himself to succeed and worked hard to become the all-star he became.  James Young was full of talent but was lazy.  Fab Melo couldn't adjust mentally to the speed of the NBA game.  Jared Sullinger ate himself out f the league, he had no discipline with his diet and training.   He lacked the stamina to stay in games even though when he was on the court he was a legit NBA talent.  Listening to Oturu talk and seeing how he backed it up already, I believe that he has what it takes mentality to make it in the NBA.  He already has the size at 6'10 240 lbs, give him two years in a good system and he can be a quality starter.  Maybe even a Bam Adebayo type, no one saw Bam being that good.  Sure he can bust, anyone can, there is a long list of top 5 picks who didn't make it and  because the just couldn't put it together mentally, even though the physical talent was there.  The draft is a gamble but I'd bet on a player who has already shown the mental discipline to succeed.

As for GSW I think that Wiseman gives them what they hoped to get from Demarcus Cousins.  If they were picking in the bottom of the lottery or just out of it then maybe they go for a guy like Devin Vassell or Saddiq Bey.  I just think that picking a guard over Wiseman because he didn't play much (he dominated the games he played) is like drafting Dante Exum over Joel Embiid.  There are guards like Exum that look great every year and that don't make the leap as expected.   There are very few bigs that come out of college with the package that Wiseman has.  A guy like Anthony Edwards is really not that special.  We see  Anthony Edwards  types every year.  Cleveland will probably draft him and they went back to back looking for their special guard (Kyrie replacement ) with Collin Sexton and Darius Garland.  Both good players in their own right but not the elite killer that Irving was.  There no super special PG like Ben Simmons in this draft and no wings like Tatum.   Picking #1 take the most uniquely special player and that really is Wiseman. 

Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #35 on: May 29, 2020, 11:32:26 AM »

Offline GreenShooter

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New mock from cbs sports.
This one has us picking:

17: Precious Achiuwa (He's actually a good fit. A little bigger than Theis and (will be) just as good (likely better) on D. His "O" game needs work)

26: Patrick Williams (Don't think he'll be there but another good fit. Would replace someone like Semi. Can guard right now)

30: Malachi Flynn (Best player on one the best teams in the country. Not sure he is a fit. Needs to use the high pick to get some of his shots off but can really shoot it. Not very athletic. Back up at best)

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-mock-draft-james-wiseman-makes-big-jump-to-no-1-overall-pick-by-warriors/
« Last Edit: May 29, 2020, 11:41:42 AM by GreenShooter »

Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2020, 05:04:47 PM »

Offline tstorey_97

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TP to CFAN 38 - Basketball post, thank you.

Interesting dynamic in CBS Mock.

1. Warriors - Ball PG
3. Pistons - Hayes PG
5. Cavs - Anthony PG
7. Bulls - Haliburton PG

If it goes that way? Bulls are spending #7 on the "4th PG selected."

I think Jalen Smith looks like a fit. Not sure if he'd be there and Ainge would take him, but, he's got power forward talents that look above average. His outside shooting, FT shooting and ball handling are solid for a big 20 year old. He's a blocking machine as the hops are there. Have Smith with Timelord on the court at the same time blocking shots and we might have sumpin'.

Issue with Celtics is youth. Smart - Brown - Tatum - Langford are going to get the minutes there for many years, thus, causing me to lose interest in wingahs.

What do I know?

Ainge knows everything, he picks Edwards who is really a shooting guard at....5'11"...who needs minutes to heat up and...there aren't any....ever.

He picks Grant who is a power forward at 6'6" who missed his first 28 three point attempts. I love the guy, he's perfect, we need him, but, he is giving length to every big he will ever play against.

He picks Waters at 5'10" 175 lbs, he makes Edwards look a little big. 
I honestly think he might be a good backup point guard, but, he got 80 minutes in the NBA this season and how would that change with Brad "I don't play rookies" Stevens?

So, pick a big and one that has an outside shot? Sounds good, but, he will be playing on the floor with three or four of the top shooters in the league.

"Um, pass that thing to Kemba Freakin' Walker and if he's covered? Pass it to Gordon Hayward and if he says no? Pass it to Jason Tatum, he scores 40 once in awhile. Take your pick, a virtual buffet of shooters that are better than you, rookie."



Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #37 on: May 29, 2020, 06:42:28 PM »

Online RodyTur10

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TP to CFAN 38 - Basketball post, thank you.

Interesting dynamic in CBS Mock.

1. Warriors - Ball PG
3. Pistons - Hayes PG
5. Cavs - Anthony PG
7. Bulls - Haliburton PG

If it goes that way? Bulls are spending #7 on the "4th PG selected."

I think Jalen Smith looks like a fit. Not sure if he'd be there and Ainge would take him, but, he's got power forward talents that look above average. His outside shooting, FT shooting and ball handling are solid for a big 20 year old. He's a blocking machine as the hops are there. Have Smith with Timelord on the court at the same time blocking shots and we might have sumpin'.

Issue with Celtics is youth. Smart - Brown - Tatum - Langford are going to get the minutes there for many years, thus, causing me to lose interest in wingahs.

What do I know?

Ainge knows everything, he picks Edwards who is really a shooting guard at....5'11"...who needs minutes to heat up and...there aren't any....ever.

He picks Grant who is a power forward at 6'6" who missed his first 28 three point attempts. I love the guy, he's perfect, we need him, but, he is giving length to every big he will ever play against.

He picks Waters at 5'10" 175 lbs, he makes Edwards look a little big. 
I honestly think he might be a good backup point guard, but, he got 80 minutes in the NBA this season and how would that change with Brad "I don't play rookies" Stevens?

So, pick a big and one that has an outside shot? Sounds good, but, he will be playing on the floor with three or four of the top shooters in the league.

"Um, pass that thing to Kemba Freakin' Walker and if he's covered? Pass it to Gordon Hayward and if he says no? Pass it to Jason Tatum, he scores 40 once in awhile. Take your pick, a virtual buffet of shooters that are better than you, rookie."

I'm not entirely sure what you're suggesting here, but I do agree that minutes to develop youngsters/rookies are scarce.
And that's because the Celtics are at a stage that they need to make that last step to be a real contender. With a core of Walker, Brown, Tatum and Hayward combined with a few good role players in Smart and Theis you're very close.

We just need to add depth and that's unlikely to come from draft picks out of the lottery. It's actually not unlikely that when you make your picks at 17, 26 and 30 that noone of them will ever become as good as Theis, so why invest a couple of years developing them when your stars are ready now?

We need to consolidate. For continuity you can have 2/3 younger players in your rotation (tighten that during playoffs) to slowly replace guys that get old or want big contracts, but you don't want a bunch of rookies or sophomores that need real minutes to become NBA-players.

For next season the Celtics could have (I know it won't happen) Waters, Edwards, Langford, G.Williams, R.Williams, Fall + 3 rookies (#17, #26, #30) on the roster. That's outrageous. We need to find re-building teams that want to take some of them for the longterm and provide us with some veterans for the shortterm.
Rationalism over beliefs

Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #38 on: May 29, 2020, 09:19:59 PM »

Offline CFAN38

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New mock from cbs sports.
This one has us picking:

17: Precious Achiuwa (He's actually a good fit. A little bigger than Theis and (will be) just as good (likely better) on D. His "O" game needs work)

26: Patrick Williams (Don't think he'll be there but another good fit. Would replace someone like Semi. Can guard right now)

30: Malachi Flynn (Best player on one the best teams in the country. Not sure he is a fit. Needs to use the high pick to get some of his shots off but can really shoot it. Not very athletic. Back up at best)

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-mock-draft-james-wiseman-makes-big-jump-to-no-1-overall-pick-by-warriors/

Landing Achiuwa and P Williams would be very j retesting for the Cs. With the roster construction they would then probably have to use the 30th pick to get off of Porier and hopefully add a future 2nd. Adding both those players who give the Cs two high end athletes at high value positions. Best case scenario P Williams in a starting 4 who can switch everything, player some small ball 5, and spread the floor. Achiuwa is an athletic freak with a high motor who has some b-ball IQ issues but these may have been compounded by his high usage rate at Memphis. If he is given a clear role as primarily a rim running 5 he could be a steal. Athletically he is truly elite with decent size and great length.
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Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #39 on: June 03, 2020, 04:18:00 PM »

Online Tr1boy

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My mock as of today

17.  Tyrese Maxey - Tough as nails guard with lightning quick reflexes . 6'2 with 6'6 wingspan.  Not a true pg.  Has ability to make tough shots near the basket.  One of the top defenders of the draft

26. Paul Reed - good candidate to replace Theis in a year or two.  Has tools to be an effective small ball center.   50/50 chance he will still be available at 26

30.  Ty-Shon Alexander - 3 and D guard in the mold of Brogdon.  Celebral player. Shot 39 percent from 3 point line

46. Killian Tillie -  A KO type big man.  Faster twitch than KO.  Injury concerns.  Shot 40 percent from 3 point line.



Re: CBS latest mock draft
« Reply #40 on: June 19, 2020, 10:03:00 PM »

Offline Javar

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Terry is an interesting fit for us IMO. I think he could work really well with Brown/Tatum down the line. Right now neither of those guys are great at playmaking for others. So PGs with on ball skills work well with them. As those two grow, you figure playmaking will improve and that will put the ball in their hands a higher percentage of the time via amplifiermontreal com. That will in turn put a premium on off ball skills which Terry projects to be excellent at.

I could see a scenario where Terry plays alongside Smart/Romeo on the second unit. As Brown/Tatum take on more you eventually move to Terry playing a lot at PG alongside them and Kemba playing more with the second unit. Maybe not even to a point where Kemba actually comes off the bench but you line your rotations up for more of him playing with them. Terry's off ball shooting plays really well alongside on ball players and Kemba's ability to get his own shot compensates for weaker scorers off the bench.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2020, 01:28:12 PM by Javar »