Author Topic: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?  (Read 4141 times)

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Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« on: April 11, 2020, 12:02:42 AM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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It's a broken record around draft time, the Celtics need to draft a big man.  There are a lot of intriguing prospects at Center that should be available at 17 and possibly 26 as well.   However, a lot of drafts seem to have has going for a guard at 17:
RJ Hampton - PG/SG - https://www.nbadraft.net/nba-mock-drafts/
Tre Jones - PG - https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/2020-nba-mock-draft-knicks-move-up-in-trade-with-golden-state-to-select-lamelo-ball-at-no-1/
Theo Maledon - PG - http://www.nbadraftroom.com/p/2020-nba-mock-draft.html
Aleksej Pokuševski - PF - http://www.tankathon.com/mock_draft
While Aleksej Pokuševski  is 7', I'm not sure he has actually declared for the draft yet. 

Lets focus on 5 Bigs that I've seen associated with the Celtics from various places around the web:

ISAIAH STEWART   VERNON CAREY JR.   JALEN SMITH   ZEKE NNAJI   XAVIER TILLMAN

I think that all 5 could be good players in the NBA but at the same time they could not pan out.  There are things to like about them and some questions for them to overcome. 

I have liked Carey since the season started but his lateral movement and ability to step out and guard on the permitar is an issue.  I tried to like Nnaji but he just seems too skinny to make it as a center in the NBA.  I know Theis is undersized (which is why i want to draft a more Physical Big man) but he did surprise me with his ability to bang in the post this year.  Still I'm not sold on Nnaji.  Smith is also on the skinny side but he looks more like the type of big who can stretch the floor like Stevens likes.  Smith could be a natural fit for the Celtics.  I really like the physicalness of Stewart and his foul shooting.  He actually reminds me of Rob Williams, who we already have so do we nee another of the same player?  Williams is looking like he may be an injury concern as he seems to always be injured, so maybe a healthy version of him is what we need.  Tillman was a guy I wasn't thinking about until read a fan post on this blog, making him look like a really attractive prospect. 

Tankathon has a feature that lets you compare players side by side.  So I put in all five bigs and came up with a nice statistical comparison. Here is a link to that Player Comparison:
http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=vernon-carey-jr--zeke-nnaji--jalen-smith--isaiah-stewart--xavier-tillman

I think we can probably get any one of them at 17 and probably some of them at 26.  Maybe 1 or 2 of them last to 30 but that's more of a gamble.  So who do you take?  Do you go with a back up PG at 17 or do you go big? Do you Go big at 17 and 26 picking two of these guys then go PG at 30?  Do you go PG at 17 then Big at 26? Do you not like any of these five guys and go with a different big. 

I liked how Wanamaker played and I think Waters has potential.  So I'm inclined  to go big at both 17 and 26 then look for a guard or wing at 30.  I would take Smith at 17 because he seems less likely to be there at 26 because of his ability to stretch the floor.   Then I'd look at Stewart and Tillman at 26.  I think Tillman may be the better player right now but he's a junior and Stewart is only a freshman and apparently has worked really hard to improve some weaknesses he had coming in to collage, like his foul shooting.  I'd probably take Stewart if they were both available but if I was left with Tillman at 26 I'd b ok with that.   

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2020, 06:35:24 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Kid I like, though admittedly I haven't seen enough of him, just YouTube highlights and no games, is Theo Maledon. Tall, long PG/combo guard. He is kinda one of these guys that isn't necessarily great at anything but isn't necessarily bad at anything either.

Okay athleticism, good shot form, didn't see him doing much off hand, defense looked okay to good. Passing is decent but not great. He looks like he might be able to create his own shot, though how good that shot is questionable as his BBIQ is only meh.

High end rotation guy with a ceiling as a real good starter. I think Brad could work this kid into a very good defender, though he would be weak against smaller PGs with elite speed or elite moves.

That's my choice at 17.

Carey has eat himself out of the league potential that is very real.

The other players haven't been on my radar so haven't seen much of them to comment.

Nnaji is not 1 at round talent, even in a draft devoid of talent.

I have heard bad stuff about Stewart and he is an undersized center with poor length and limited hops that doesn't mind banging. Stay away from him.

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2020, 07:36:46 AM »

Offline CFAN38

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Tillman is the safe pick out of that group, they all have potential but Tillman’s passing and over all IQ make him a nice fit for Cs big rotation. I would also add Achiuwa to your list as I think he is a high upside option who the Cs will look at and play as a big.

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Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2020, 11:37:08 AM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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Kid I like, though admittedly I haven't seen enough of him, just YouTube highlights and no games, is Theo Maledon. Tall, long PG/combo guard. He is kinda one of these guys that isn't necessarily great at anything but isn't necessarily bad at anything either.

Okay athleticism, good shot form, didn't see him doing much off hand, defense looked okay to good. Passing is decent but not great. He looks like he might be able to create his own shot, though how good that shot is questionable as his BBIQ is only meh.

High end rotation guy with a ceiling as a real good starter. I think Brad could work this kid into a very good defender, though he would be weak against smaller PGs with elite speed or elite moves.

That's my choice at 17.

Carey has eat himself out of the league potential that is very real.

The other players haven't been on my radar so haven't seen much of them to comment.

Nnaji is not 1 at round talent, even in a draft devoid of talent.

I have heard bad stuff about Stewart and he is an undersized center with poor length and limited hops that doesn't mind banging. Stay away from him.

nbadraft.net says otherwise
6’9 athletic big man … Great length with a 7’4 wingspan and 9’0.5 standing reach … Good mobility, speed, and athleticism, especially at his size at 244 pounds. Gets off the ground quick and finishes plays above the rim. Measured a 29 inch standing vertical and 35 inch max vertical at the La Lumiere Combine in September 2018. Very light on his feet for his size. Swift footwork and maneuvers well to the basket. Impressive combination of power and finesse …
https://www.nbadraft.net/players/isaiah-stewart/

Stewart could be really good or he could be another athletic guy who doesn't make the transition to the NBA.  That is why he is a late 1st round prospect.  I really think at least one of these 5 players is going to be really good, the question is which one.   

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2020, 11:42:55 AM »

Online Csfan1984

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I am hoping for Nesmith at 17.

Stewart or Smith at Pick 26. If both are gone I trade out.

Pick 30 reach and grab Reggie Perry.

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2020, 12:16:23 PM »

Online Tr1boy

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Tillman is the safe pick out of that group, they all have potential but Tillman’s passing and over all IQ make him a nice fit for Cs big rotation. I would also add Achiuwa to your list as I think he is a high upside option who the Cs will look at and play as a big.

I'm starting to warmup to Achiuwa

Excellent motor

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2020, 01:09:48 PM »

Offline konkmv

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Carey and smith..

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2020, 01:18:04 PM »

Offline konkmv

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You will not find a perfect player at 17 26 30... smith Carey have some good offensive moves and can't be worse defenders than kanter...

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2020, 01:21:41 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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Tillman is the safe pick out of that group, they all have potential but Tillman’s passing and over all IQ make him a nice fit for Cs big rotation. I would also add Achiuwa to your list as I think he is a high upside option who the Cs will look at and play as a big.

I'm starting to warmup to Achiuwa

Excellent motor

Precious Achiuwa's weaknesses seem to do more with BBIQ then skill set.  It look like he could have suspect decision making. 

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/precious-achiuwa/

lacks technique when his path gets cut off. Needs work when he can’t dunk it over the defense and finishing contested layups, especially with his left hand. Doesn’t create much in the half court, generally just straight-line slashes to the basket

Hunts for his shots and predetermines when he’s going to come down and shoot, rather than feel out the situation. Will take a defensive rebound to the other end to force up an ill-advised shot without making a pass. Settles for contested shots.

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2020, 02:55:49 PM »

Online Tr1boy

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Tillman is the safe pick out of that group, they all have potential but Tillman’s passing and over all IQ make him a nice fit for Cs big rotation. I would also add Achiuwa to your list as I think he is a high upside option who the Cs will look at and play as a big.

I'm starting to warmup to Achiuwa

Excellent motor

Precious Achiuwa's weaknesses seem to do more with BBIQ then skill set.  It look like he could have suspect decision making. 

https://www.nbadraft.net/players/precious-achiuwa/

lacks technique when his path gets cut off. Needs work when he can’t dunk it over the defense and finishing contested layups, especially with his left hand. Doesn’t create much in the half court, generally just straight-line slashes to the basket

Hunts for his shots and predetermines when he’s going to come down and shoot, rather than feel out the situation. Will take a defensive rebound to the other end to force up an ill-advised shot without making a pass. Settles for contested shots.

Not that I'm saying Achiuwa is going to turnout to be the next Ibaka

but Ibaka early in his career had BBIQ issues

I mean he still has hiccups here and there

In the beginning you simplify Achiuwa game.  He basically turns into a garbage man, energy man off the bench.  Shoot when open

Then when he starts to become efficient at this, try to see if you can expand his game


Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2020, 05:13:32 PM »

Offline tstorey_97

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This is the time of year to complain about low grade highlight reels and limited draft analysis. I think everyone gets overwhelmed by two things...

Too many guys that are about the same. This bunch of bigs doesn't seem any different. You watch these guys and then think of what a solid player Daniel Theis is. Both ends of the court, he is money.

No defensive analysis. Whomever this guy is going to be? If he wants to play he'll have to show a lot of defense. I've been watching highlights for weeks now and it's just one layup after another.

Wah...wah....wah

Anyway, this guy will be taking minutes from Semi. Makes you wonder don't it? Defense or play in Maine.

Another point is stats. Belichick picks SEC lineman because it's as close to the pros as college is going to get.

Tillman has the worst stats of the group. I've watched him play in actual games. He's 21 so, yes, he'll outplay some of the 18's and 19's he's playing against, but, there's more to it than that.

Tillman's movements on the floor with and without the ball show more than any of the 5 or 6 other bigs in the Celtic's range. The Serbian kid at 18 years looks like he might have a shot one day,but, I'm not qualified to assess him or anyone else for that matter.

I'll trade out of the #30 and take Tillman at #33 or #34.

Can't Danny just swindle some team above him and get Saddiq Bey? That kid can play, shoots threes, plays bigger than he is....etc.

Wouldn't it be cool if Robert Williams could play? I wish he could so I wouldn't have watch these "bigs" in this year's draft.

As far as wings and guards? Romeo is better than any of them...way better.







« Last Edit: April 11, 2020, 05:25:33 PM by tstorey_97 »

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2020, 05:57:30 PM »

Offline Monkhouse

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My list goes Xavier Tillman and Patrick Williams. Saddiq Bey is also one of my choices, but I have to think Ainge may trade or try to move up with his picks.
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Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2020, 07:00:36 PM »

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I like Vernon Carey, which means he’s almost surely going to be a bust.
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Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2020, 07:15:07 PM »

Offline Emmette Bryant

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The Celtics worked out Kaleb Wesson last year and told him to work on his conditioning.

He lost weight and had a nice season.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if they used 30 or 46 on him.

Re: Which Big to draft and when 17,26, or 30?
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2020, 07:48:52 PM »

Offline OldSchoolDude

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I am rapidly coming around on Xavier Tillman and it's Tom Izzo's fault. 

I have a lot of respect for Tom Izzo as a coach.  When Draymond Green came out of college I was hoping we could get him but when Sully started to fall I hopped for him and my dreams of Draymond Green went by the waist side.  Maybe if Sully had gone early Danny would have picked Draymond, maybe not.  I was telling friends before the draft that I knew Draymond would be good because Tom Izzo spoke so highly of him.  Well Tom Izzo speaks very highly of Xavier Tillman as well. 

https://www.mlive.com/spartans/2020/02/xavier-tillman-adds-a-suffix-then-plays-shutdown-defense-to-lead-michigan-state.html

While the box score shows a quiet offensive game for Tillman, with six points and six rebounds, Spartans coach Tom Izzo raved about him as the most important player in Michigan State’s win.

“There is no question that he was my five star,” Izzo said.

“He has defended so well all year long. He has defended guards, today he started out he was on (Connor) McCaffery,” Izzo said. “He is the smartest, smart, smart, smart player, he has got some Draymond Green in him.

https://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/college/michigan-state-university/2020/03/03/xavier-tillman-doing-all-resurgent-michigan-state-spartans/4938546002/

“Xavier has been terrific,” Izzo said early this week. “I keep saying this for a week or two just because I saw it, but if he isn't the best defensive player in this league, I don't know who is. But offensively, he's been very good, too. He’s made some big-time plays.”