Author Topic: Patriots 2020 Season  (Read 104653 times)

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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #390 on: December 11, 2020, 06:42:03 PM »

Offline Donoghus

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And maybe Bill's already decided that Stidham's not the man for the job, which is fine, but in that case, he still should've let Stidham play—to make sure that Stidham's not the man for the job, and because Cam was never more than a one-year experiment to begin with.
If Belichick has already decided that Stidham is not the long term solution at QB, the only reason to play him is to prove to fans that he, Belichick, is correct. Belichick certainly doesn't have to prove it to himself that he is right in not playing Stidham.

He sees the kid in practice day to day.   They have a pretty good idea what they have there in Stidham which, apparently, might not be much.


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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #391 on: December 11, 2020, 06:46:23 PM »

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And maybe Bill's already decided that Stidham's not the man for the job, which is fine, but in that case, he still should've let Stidham play—to make sure that Stidham's not the man for the job, and because Cam was never more than a one-year experiment to begin with.
If Belichick has already decided that Stidham is not the long term solution at QB, the only reason to play him is to prove to fans that he, Belichick, is correct. Belichick certainly doesn't have to prove it to himself that he is right in not playing Stidham.

Well the buzz on Stidham sure isn't anything like the buzz on a 2nd year QB 20 years ago.  From the start of training camp, everyone was talking about Brady's progress in Year 2. In retrospect I think BB might have been chomping at the bit to find a way to get Brady in there.  Unfortunately Bledsoe had to sustain a dangerous injury for Brady to get his shot. Of course there is no way BB could have expected/predicted what Brady would become, but he knew Brady had something.   Doesn't feel anything like that now.   

Cam has given Belichick plenty opportunity to make a switch and BB resists.  Doesn't leave me thinking he has much belief in Stidham  - at least not yet.

Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #392 on: December 11, 2020, 07:45:32 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Cam’s shoulder issues seem to have totally cooked his ability to throw. I know we don’t have a tonne of weapons, but he never looked like this before. Stidham not being able to push him out is a poor reflection on him and where the coaches think he’s at. 

I think we should either try and draft one of the 1st round QBs (Trey Lance would be awesome) or poach Matthew Stafford and use our 1st round pick on one of the many WR weapons, like Waddle or Moore. Just not Cam again.

Despite all the doom and gloom there have been bright spots. Harris would have been a 1000 yard rusher if he played 16 games this season, without running behind Develin & Gronk. Onwenu has established himself already as a premiere lineman. JC Jackson is approaching a double digit INT season. Dugger & Cowart are young defensive fixtures. Wino improved too. With guys like Uche & Jennings coming along as well.

There’s some good and some bad. Not a completely wasted season
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #393 on: December 12, 2020, 03:54:04 AM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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And maybe Bill's already decided that Stidham's not the man for the job, which is fine, but in that case, he still should've let Stidham play—to make sure that Stidham's not the man for the job, and because Cam was never more than a one-year experiment to begin with.

If Belichick has already decided that Stidham is not the long term solution at QB, the only reason to play him is to prove to fans that he, Belichick, is correct. Belichick certainly doesn't have to prove it to himself that he is right in not playing Stidham.

Well the buzz on Stidham sure isn't anything like the buzz on a 2nd year QB 20 years ago.  From the start of training camp, everyone was talking about Brady's progress in Year 2. In retrospect I think BB might have been chomping at the bit to find a way to get Brady in there.  Unfortunately Bledsoe had to sustain a dangerous injury for Brady to get his shot. Of course there is no way BB could have expected/predicted what Brady would become, but he knew Brady had something.   Doesn't feel anything like that now.   

Cam has given Belichick plenty opportunity to make a switch and BB resists.  Doesn't leave me thinking he has much belief in Stidham  - at least not yet.

Everything you guys are saying is fine, but Bill would also have known—in addition to Stidham not being great—that the receiving corps is subpar, tight end is a black hole, and the defense can't stop the run. So why throw a Hail Mary on the slim chance that Newton would be his old self and maybe be able to drag a highly flawed, patchwork team to a first-round exit instead of just letting the kids play and develop while at the same time getting a high draft pick? Is Bill so desperate to prove that he was more important than Brady?
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #394 on: December 12, 2020, 12:27:57 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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And maybe Bill's already decided that Stidham's not the man for the job, which is fine, but in that case, he still should've let Stidham play—to make sure that Stidham's not the man for the job, and because Cam was never more than a one-year experiment to begin with.

If Belichick has already decided that Stidham is not the long term solution at QB, the only reason to play him is to prove to fans that he, Belichick, is correct. Belichick certainly doesn't have to prove it to himself that he is right in not playing Stidham.

Well the buzz on Stidham sure isn't anything like the buzz on a 2nd year QB 20 years ago.  From the start of training camp, everyone was talking about Brady's progress in Year 2. In retrospect I think BB might have been chomping at the bit to find a way to get Brady in there.  Unfortunately Bledsoe had to sustain a dangerous injury for Brady to get his shot. Of course there is no way BB could have expected/predicted what Brady would become, but he knew Brady had something.   Doesn't feel anything like that now.   

Cam has given Belichick plenty opportunity to make a switch and BB resists.  Doesn't leave me thinking he has much belief in Stidham  - at least not yet.

Everything you guys are saying is fine, but Bill would also have known—in addition to Stidham not being great—that the receiving corps is subpar, tight end is a black hole, and the defense can't stop the run. So why throw a Hail Mary on the slim chance that Newton would be his old self and maybe be able to drag a highly flawed, patchwork team to a first-round exit instead of just letting the kids play and develop while at the same time getting a high draft pick? Is Bill so desperate to prove that he was more important than Brady?
Couple things wrong here rick roll.

First, it never matters how bad your team is, you still need to throw the long ball 2-3 times a game. It keeps the opposing safeties honest from sneaking closer and closer to the line of scrimmage and helping stop the run and short passing game. 2nd it sets up.the play action pass tremendously.

Second, it's really, really, really hard to tank in football. You have 53 guys that want to win and be great because there are no guaranteed contracts. They are playing for their next contract, which might not even be in New England. Rosters turnover at a rate higher than 50% each year for a whole lot of teams, especially bad ones. The players couldn't give a crap about the draft and all the rookies that may come in and be great because those rookies may be taking their job.

Simply, tanking isn't a thing in football. Doing so could get people seriously hurt.

Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #395 on: December 12, 2020, 12:39:05 PM »

Offline RPGenerate

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And maybe Bill's already decided that Stidham's not the man for the job, which is fine, but in that case, he still should've let Stidham play—to make sure that Stidham's not the man for the job, and because Cam was never more than a one-year experiment to begin with.

If Belichick has already decided that Stidham is not the long term solution at QB, the only reason to play him is to prove to fans that he, Belichick, is correct. Belichick certainly doesn't have to prove it to himself that he is right in not playing Stidham.

Well the buzz on Stidham sure isn't anything like the buzz on a 2nd year QB 20 years ago.  From the start of training camp, everyone was talking about Brady's progress in Year 2. In retrospect I think BB might have been chomping at the bit to find a way to get Brady in there.  Unfortunately Bledsoe had to sustain a dangerous injury for Brady to get his shot. Of course there is no way BB could have expected/predicted what Brady would become, but he knew Brady had something.   Doesn't feel anything like that now.   

Cam has given Belichick plenty opportunity to make a switch and BB resists.  Doesn't leave me thinking he has much belief in Stidham  - at least not yet.

Everything you guys are saying is fine, but Bill would also have known—in addition to Stidham not being great—that the receiving corps is subpar, tight end is a black hole, and the defense can't stop the run. So why throw a Hail Mary on the slim chance that Newton would be his old self and maybe be able to drag a highly flawed, patchwork team to a first-round exit instead of just letting the kids play and develop while at the same time getting a high draft pick? Is Bill so desperate to prove that he was more important than Brady?
Couple things wrong here rick roll.

First, it never matters how bad your team is, you still need to throw the long ball 2-3 times a game. It keeps the opposing safeties honest from sneaking closer and closer to the line of scrimmage and helping stop the run and short passing game. 2nd it sets up.the play action pass tremendously.

Second, it's really, really, really hard to tank in football. You have 53 guys that want to win and be great because there are no guaranteed contracts. They are playing for their next contract, which might not even be in New England. Rosters turnover at a rate higher than 50% each year for a whole lot of teams, especially bad ones. The players couldn't give a crap about the draft and all the rookies that may come in and be great because those rookies may be taking their job.

Simply, tanking isn't a thing in football. Doing so could get people seriously hurt.
Tanking is definitely a thing in football. The way to go about it is just different, and you need to be smarter about it. Trade older veterans for draft capital, let the young guys get a chance to shine, and offload expensive players that aren't game changers. Draft well, and go into free agency and get good players on easy to digest contracts to plug the holes. The Dolphins this year are living proof that this type of tanking can work.
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #396 on: December 13, 2020, 04:30:51 AM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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And maybe Bill's already decided that Stidham's not the man for the job, which is fine, but in that case, he still should've let Stidham play—to make sure that Stidham's not the man for the job, and because Cam was never more than a one-year experiment to begin with.

If Belichick has already decided that Stidham is not the long term solution at QB, the only reason to play him is to prove to fans that he, Belichick, is correct. Belichick certainly doesn't have to prove it to himself that he is right in not playing Stidham.

Well the buzz on Stidham sure isn't anything like the buzz on a 2nd year QB 20 years ago.  From the start of training camp, everyone was talking about Brady's progress in Year 2. In retrospect I think BB might have been chomping at the bit to find a way to get Brady in there.  Unfortunately Bledsoe had to sustain a dangerous injury for Brady to get his shot. Of course there is no way BB could have expected/predicted what Brady would become, but he knew Brady had something.   Doesn't feel anything like that now.   

Cam has given Belichick plenty opportunity to make a switch and BB resists.  Doesn't leave me thinking he has much belief in Stidham  - at least not yet.

Everything you guys are saying is fine, but Bill would also have known—in addition to Stidham not being great—that the receiving corps is subpar, tight end is a black hole, and the defense can't stop the run. So why throw a Hail Mary on the slim chance that Newton would be his old self and maybe be able to drag a highly flawed, patchwork team to a first-round exit instead of just letting the kids play and develop while at the same time getting a high draft pick? Is Bill so desperate to prove that he was more important than Brady?
Couple things wrong here rick roll.

First, it never matters how bad your team is, you still need to throw the long ball 2-3 times a game. It keeps the opposing safeties honest from sneaking closer and closer to the line of scrimmage and helping stop the run and short passing game. 2nd it sets up.the play action pass tremendously.

Second, it's really, really, really hard to tank in football. You have 53 guys that want to win and be great because there are no guaranteed contracts. They are playing for their next contract, which might not even be in New England. Rosters turnover at a rate higher than 50% each year for a whole lot of teams, especially bad ones. The players couldn't give a crap about the draft and all the rookies that may come in and be great because those rookies may be taking their job.

Simply, tanking isn't a thing in football. Doing so could get people seriously hurt.
Tanking is definitely a thing in football. The way to go about it is just different, and you need to be smarter about it. Trade older veterans for draft capital, let the young guys get a chance to shine, and offload expensive players that aren't game changers. Draft well, and go into free agency and get good players on easy to digest contracts to plug the holes. The Dolphins this year are living proof that this type of tanking can work.

RPG, This is basically what I was thinking of.

Nick, I think you and I are thinking different things in regard to the definition of tanking. I understand that everyone wants to win—for their team and for their next contract—and thus plays hard pretty much all the time, but it's quite possible to play hard and try to win but just not have the talent to win much, like this year's Jets or Bengals. I don't think New England would've been that bad without Newton, but they probably would've been worse at this point than 6-7, and thus in line for a better draft pick.

This season is, in some ways, a lost season, and I just don't see the point of barely crawling into the playoffs and then likely losing right away, or missing the playoffs but getting too many wins for a high pick, when you could have let all of the young guys play and develop and at the same time pretty much ensure that you'll get at least a fairly high draft pick, especially when you have glaring needs at multiple skill positions (QB, WR, TE).
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #397 on: December 14, 2020, 12:11:16 AM »

Offline SparzWizard

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For the first time in 11 years, the New England Patriots will not be AFC East Division Champs, after the big W by Buffalo Bills against the Steelers.


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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #398 on: December 14, 2020, 12:23:14 AM »

Offline CelticsElite

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For the first time in 11 years, the New England Patriots will not be AFC East Division Champs, after the big W by Buffalo Bills against the Steelers.
crazy. 11 years ago doesn’t sound too long ago, until you remember where you were 11 years ago

Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #399 on: December 14, 2020, 01:56:46 AM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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Sad season, made worse by Bill's insistence on trying to make something big of this season instead of just taking a sucky record and the high draft pick it would've gotten them.
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, 'Thy will be done,' and those to whom God says, 'All right, then, have it your way.'

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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #400 on: December 14, 2020, 10:39:48 AM »

Offline Billz401

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I think Newton's arm is hurt or permanently damaged.  His motion is slow and awkward.  I don't remember well enough to know if it was always like this but something doesn't look right to me.  And the results certainly would support this.  People aren't getting open either so it is not all his fault but I think there is an issue with his arm.



Yeah, this is the lost season.

Yes -- the motion is so slow.  He stands in the pocket, seems to have little feel for where pressure is coming, reacts slowly, winds-up to throw, and then is frequently inaccurate.   It almost always feels as though he's going to lose the ball, throw an interception or get sacked. 

BUT -- O-line is not bad at all and Harris is a really good runner -- quick and has some power.  I even like the receivers as 3rd or 4th receivers.

A good tight end, a couple of high end receivers and a quarterback.  Obviously a tall order but I think BB can make good progress this off-season.   If Pats lose their final 3 games (not likely) they have a shot at 10th in the draft.
This might be one of the worst O lines in the history of the new england patriots. Especially the LT Eleumenor who's constantly gets beat or just doesnt try at all. I'm assuming everyone saw cam get sacked relentlessly and then get benched just for stidham to get sacked and pressured relentlessly.

Is Cam the qb of the future? No. But everyone acts like Cam is the only problem. The receivers have a hard time getting off the line nevermind getting separation. And the o line is just terrible for some reason.

I'm really surprised no1 is calling out McDaniels for his garbage playcalling like I have for the past 3 years. I figured we would see the offensive mastermind show up now that he didnt need to design the offense around TB12. Instead he throws Cam in there and runs the same exact plays as last year.. rarely ever do you see a play action bootleg that cam has made a steady part of his offense for years. He just doesnt play to any of Cam's strong qualities. Just really predictable and as Zo stated thursday a High School quality offensive gameplan..
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #401 on: December 14, 2020, 01:10:24 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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I'm not expecting the Patriots to tank, but I would like to see them try to build a system and a gameplan that has a chance of working in the future.

Trying to jury-rig a system around a QB who is basically a TE-sized RB with limited passing is a fun idea for one season, but only really makes sense if you have a great roster.  The Patriots don't have a great roster or anything close to it.

I have no interest in watching another season of this.  You need to have a potent passing attack to get anywhere in the modern NFL.  Even if the Pats aren't able to add the future franchise QB in the draft or FA this off-season, I'd like them to focus on building the infrastructure for that eventual franchise QB.  Let's not spend another year trying to squeak by with a gimmick offense.


I'd rather see the Pats find a placeholder QB who is more of a traditional passer.  That way they can get younger players elsewhere in the offense used to playing a style that has a chance of leading to success in the future once they find a QB who is good enough to secure the position long term.
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #402 on: December 20, 2020, 02:18:39 PM »

Offline SparzWizard

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Stephen Gilmore with a non-contact injury, looked pretty bad. Might've blew out his ACL...


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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #403 on: December 20, 2020, 03:59:40 PM »

Offline ozgod

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Fitting that our playofff hopes end with a Cam sack.
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Re: Patriots 2020 Season
« Reply #404 on: December 20, 2020, 04:14:44 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Team needs will be at QB, TE, WR and DL. Not sure whether they address them in the draft or in free agency. They will have gobs of cash to spend on free agents and their picks won't be at the end of rounds, so should be interesting to see how they address this rebuild. But one thing is for sure, they can't whiff on their top two picks like they have so often over the last 8 years or so. Round so has cost this team tons of quality depth.