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Author Topic: IT will be free (Should we sign him)  (Read 5577 times)

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Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #60 on: February 10, 2020, 01:00:27 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I think we need to wait a few more days to get better feel for the market.
Obviously T Thomas would be more help as would Kyle O.
 I can’t see Danny cutting two guys lose so if we add I think it will be one player.
I think it far from obvious Kyle O'Quinn would help in any way. He has performed at a career worst level while getting little PT.

I think O'Quinn would be fine to back up Theis and Kanter, but what's the point?  Robert Williams is scheduled to come back this month, and developing him is probably more worthwhile than giving O'Quinn third string minutes.

Plus, there's only one K.O. as far as I'm concerned.  We need to find a way to bring back the Klynk!
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Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #61 on: February 10, 2020, 08:40:52 PM »

Offline philr13

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #62 on: February 21, 2020, 03:12:42 AM »

Online ozgod

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IT was interviewed by HoopsHype the other day. One of the questions was if he would be willing to come back to Boston.

Quote
You were a fan favorite in Boston, so I’ve seen some Celtics fans on Twitter hoping the team signs you. After everything that went down, would you be open to playing for the Celtics again?

IT: For sure, if the opportunity presented itself. I hold no grudges, and they know that. I have genuine love for the city of Boston. If that were to happen, I’d love to be part of what they have going on. You never know. I’m always open for any opportunity to be in the NBA and play the game that I love at the highest level. If that opportunity presents itself, for sure. Time has passed.

He was also asked his thoughts on Boston trading him after his sister's death, his health, his relationship with Kobe and where he sees the future for him. Fascinating interview, it can be read at https://hoopshype.com/2020/02/20/nba-rumors-isaiah-thomas-free-agency-celtics-wizards-kobe-bryant-interview-waived-chyna-ainge/
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #63 on: February 21, 2020, 06:19:39 AM »

Offline gouki88

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.
This is kind of where I'm at right now too. His offensive efficiency has hit rock bottom since he left us. In the 84 (that's right... 84) games he's played since we traded him he's shot 39% from the field, 35% from three and 84% from the free throw line. These are between 3-5 percentage points lower than his career averages, and way down from 2016-2017.

Add to that the fact that his defence is worse than ever, and he's not really worth a roster spot on this team. He was playing alright for the Wiz, but still.
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Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #64 on: February 21, 2020, 06:20:54 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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Sentimental drivel as I see it, Ainge could care less about a reunion.   Teams just bully IT in the playoffs.

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #65 on: February 21, 2020, 07:06:15 AM »

Offline Birdman

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Rather have Thomas than Langford, Green, Carsen, Semi if he is healthy during the playoffs
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Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #66 on: February 21, 2020, 07:53:11 AM »

Offline saltlover

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.
This is kind of where I'm at right now too. His offensive efficiency has hit rock bottom since he left us. In the 84 (that's right... 84) games he's played since we traded him he's shot 39% from the field, 35% from three and 84% from the free throw line. These are between 3-5 percentage points lower than his career averages, and way down from 2016-2017.

Add to that the fact that his defence is worse than ever, and he's not really worth a roster spot on this team. He was playing alright for the Wiz, but still.

While this is true, he was obviously significantly hurt during the first year-plus after we traded him — that’s why he was traded.  He’ll never get back to where he was, but he shot 41% from 3 this season on nearly 5 attempts a game.

I don’t think he’d be in the rotation, but I think it’s a lot more likely he could be occasionally useful in the playoffs than Javonte Green will be (who’s roster spot he’d take) or Carsen Edwards (who’s role he’d fill).  Imagine the Celtics are struggling in a home game.  IT comes in and hits two threes, and the energy of the building would skyrocket, shifting momentum and potentially propelling the team to victory.  Javonte Green could hit those same threes, and they’d count the same in points, but it wouldn’t completely change the fan energy the way IT would.

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #67 on: February 21, 2020, 08:06:36 AM »

Offline gouki88

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.
This is kind of where I'm at right now too. His offensive efficiency has hit rock bottom since he left us. In the 84 (that's right... 84) games he's played since we traded him he's shot 39% from the field, 35% from three and 84% from the free throw line. These are between 3-5 percentage points lower than his career averages, and way down from 2016-2017.

Add to that the fact that his defence is worse than ever, and he's not really worth a roster spot on this team. He was playing alright for the Wiz, but still.

While this is true, he was obviously significantly hurt during the first year-plus after we traded him — that’s why he was traded.  He’ll never get back to where he was, but he shot 41% from 3 this season on nearly 5 attempts a game.

I don’t think he’d be in the rotation, but I think it’s a lot more likely he could be occasionally useful in the playoffs than Javonte Green will be (who’s roster spot he’d take) or Carsen Edwards (who’s role he’d fill).  Imagine the Celtics are struggling in a home game.  IT comes in and hits two threes, and the energy of the building would skyrocket, shifting momentum and potentially propelling the team to victory.  Javonte Green could hit those same threes, and they’d count the same in points, but it wouldn’t completely change the fan energy the way IT would.
That's all very true - he has definitely been improved on the Wizards. His FG% still leaves a lot to be desired, and his defence is what it is, but he's miles ahead of his Cleveland/LAL/Denver stints.

He's definitely better on offence than Edwards is now, because Edwards simply can't seem to find his rhythm in short stints yet (makes sense considering his role at college). I kinda like Javonte, but he's not a good shooter. He is a fantastic athlete though, and I feel as if his dunks are definitely big energisers. My real qualm with the prospect of bringing IT back is whether or not he could buy into being the 10MPG guy that Carsen Edwards is.

Wanamaker probably doesn't lose many minutes to IT unless either IT is hot, Wanamaker is injured or the matchup is weirdly beneficial to IT. IF he could fall into that role comfortably (and stay healthy down the track) I'd welcome him back with open arms. Couple of big ifs though, for me, and this teams chemistry and morale is not something I want to mess with.
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Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #68 on: February 21, 2020, 08:39:56 AM »

Offline tonydelk

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.
This is kind of where I'm at right now too. His offensive efficiency has hit rock bottom since he left us. In the 84 (that's right... 84) games he's played since we traded him he's shot 39% from the field, 35% from three and 84% from the free throw line. These are between 3-5 percentage points lower than his career averages, and way down from 2016-2017.

Add to that the fact that his defence is worse than ever, and he's not really worth a roster spot on this team. He was playing alright for the Wiz, but still.

While this is true, he was obviously significantly hurt during the first year-plus after we traded him — that’s why he was traded.  He’ll never get back to where he was, but he shot 41% from 3 this season on nearly 5 attempts a game.

I don’t think he’d be in the rotation, but I think it’s a lot more likely he could be occasionally useful in the playoffs than Javonte Green will be (who’s roster spot he’d take) or Carsen Edwards (who’s role he’d fill).  Imagine the Celtics are struggling in a home game.  IT comes in and hits two threes, and the energy of the building would skyrocket, shifting momentum and potentially propelling the team to victory.  Javonte Green could hit those same threes, and they’d count the same in points, but it wouldn’t completely change the fan energy the way IT would.
That's all very true - he has definitely been improved on the Wizards. His FG% still leaves a lot to be desired, and his defence is what it is, but he's miles ahead of his Cleveland/LAL/Denver stints.

He's definitely better on offence than Edwards is now, because Edwards simply can't seem to find his rhythm in short stints yet (makes sense considering his role at college). I kinda like Javonte, but he's not a good shooter. He is a fantastic athlete though, and I feel as if his dunks are definitely big energisers. My real qualm with the prospect of bringing IT back is whether or not he could buy into being the 10MPG guy that Carsen Edwards is.

Wanamaker probably doesn't lose many minutes to IT unless either IT is hot, Wanamaker is injured or the matchup is weirdly beneficial to IT. IF he could fall into that role comfortably (and stay healthy down the track) I'd welcome him back with open arms. Couple of big ifs though, for me, and this teams chemistry and morale is not something I want to mess with.

For me IT would be the last option on a buyout.  There will be a few more that could possibly be better fits then IT.  I love IT.  It would be amazing to see him back on the C's but the problem is PT.  He'd get situational PT.  If Kemba is out he could actually start.  If Kemba is healthy he'd only play when the C's are struggling on Offense and we need a shooter.  There would be some games he'd get 20 minutes and others he would not sniff the court.  It would be matchup based only.  I just don't know if he'd be ok with that but if no one else is knocking on the door then he'd have no choice.  I'm sure he'd rather go somewhere that he'd get 25mpg to showcase what he can do for a team next year.  I will always have a soft spot for IT.  Those were some of the most fun years of basketball with the underdog team but this year's team is fun and has a chance to win it all.  The C's can't bring IT back because of nostalgia.  If a better fit comes available and they sign IT then there will be regrets and if they have to release IT fans will be upset.  I'm all for signing IT only if NO ONE else better is available that can help this team. 

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #69 on: February 21, 2020, 08:44:27 AM »

Online ozgod

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.
This is kind of where I'm at right now too. His offensive efficiency has hit rock bottom since he left us. In the 84 (that's right... 84) games he's played since we traded him he's shot 39% from the field, 35% from three and 84% from the free throw line. These are between 3-5 percentage points lower than his career averages, and way down from 2016-2017.

Add to that the fact that his defence is worse than ever, and he's not really worth a roster spot on this team. He was playing alright for the Wiz, but still.

While this is true, he was obviously significantly hurt during the first year-plus after we traded him — that’s why he was traded.  He’ll never get back to where he was, but he shot 41% from 3 this season on nearly 5 attempts a game.

I don’t think he’d be in the rotation, but I think it’s a lot more likely he could be occasionally useful in the playoffs than Javonte Green will be (who’s roster spot he’d take) or Carsen Edwards (who’s role he’d fill).  Imagine the Celtics are struggling in a home game.  IT comes in and hits two threes, and the energy of the building would skyrocket, shifting momentum and potentially propelling the team to victory.  Javonte Green could hit those same threes, and they’d count the same in points, but it wouldn’t completely change the fan energy the way IT would.
That's all very true - he has definitely been improved on the Wizards. His FG% still leaves a lot to be desired, and his defence is what it is, but he's miles ahead of his Cleveland/LAL/Denver stints.

He's definitely better on offence than Edwards is now, because Edwards simply can't seem to find his rhythm in short stints yet (makes sense considering his role at college). I kinda like Javonte, but he's not a good shooter. He is a fantastic athlete though, and I feel as if his dunks are definitely big energisers. My real qualm with the prospect of bringing IT back is whether or not he could buy into being the 10MPG guy that Carsen Edwards is.

Wanamaker probably doesn't lose many minutes to IT unless either IT is hot, Wanamaker is injured or the matchup is weirdly beneficial to IT. IF he could fall into that role comfortably (and stay healthy down the track) I'd welcome him back with open arms. Couple of big ifs though, for me, and this teams chemistry and morale is not something I want to mess with.

For someone like IT to become as successful as he has been, a 5-9 guy in a sport of giants, it needs a special type of mentality and belief. That belief and resolve, having something to prove and feeling like he was the best player on the court, that drove him to become an All Star, to make All-NBA teams and to be the centerpiece of a rebuilding team that ended up making the ECF, is the same type of mentality that I think will make it hard for him to fit in playing a lesser role with the Celtics.

Often we look at the physical attributes and characteristics or the stat lines without looking at the mental side of things. Will he be happy going back to being a 10 min a game player? What influence will he have on the locker room, given that some players (Brown and Smart) are still there when he was the alpha here but both have now clearly surpassed him? Certainly don't think he will destabilize the locker room overtly but it could happen through no intent of his own, even though the last couple of years have probably baked some humility and realism into him.

I feel like IT's best spot, his best fit, will be for a rebuilding, up and coming team which takes a chance on him to try and shine again, the way the Celtics did back then, where he can impart some knowledge and experience. Not a team trying to go for a championship. Because his impact on such a team will be minimal at best.

One thing's for sure...he's a case study on how an athlete can try to do the right thing by the team and the fans and end up doing the wrong thing for himself. Anytime we criticize an athlete for wanting to sit games out to make himself healthier, or to play through pain, or criticize them for trying to look after the best deal for themselves financially, or for leaving a team and being disloyal, he's basically the flip side of that argument. Busted his guts for the team, the fans, jeopardized his health and his reward was not the Brinks trunk but instead to get shipped out before he became a liability to the team he busted his guts for, derailing his career in the process . But it's business. We just have to remember it goes both ways - for teams and players. Business.

« Last Edit: February 21, 2020, 08:49:49 AM by ozgod »
Any odd typos are because I suck at typing on an iPhone :D

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #70 on: February 21, 2020, 09:23:11 AM »

Offline action781

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I don't think any of the guys on this year's team deserve to lose their jobs to make room for Thomas.

I wish him well, but too much of his game has left him at this point.
This is kind of where I'm at right now too. His offensive efficiency has hit rock bottom since he left us. In the 84 (that's right... 84) games he's played since we traded him he's shot 39% from the field, 35% from three and 84% from the free throw line. These are between 3-5 percentage points lower than his career averages, and way down from 2016-2017.

Add to that the fact that his defence is worse than ever, and he's not really worth a roster spot on this team. He was playing alright for the Wiz, but still.

While this is true, he was obviously significantly hurt during the first year-plus after we traded him — that’s why he was traded.  He’ll never get back to where he was, but he shot 41% from 3 this season on nearly 5 attempts a game.

I don’t think he’d be in the rotation, but I think it’s a lot more likely he could be occasionally useful in the playoffs than Javonte Green will be (who’s roster spot he’d take) or Carsen Edwards (who’s role he’d fill).  Imagine the Celtics are struggling in a home game.  IT comes in and hits two threes, and the energy of the building would skyrocket, shifting momentum and potentially propelling the team to victory.  Javonte Green could hit those same threes, and they’d count the same in points, but it wouldn’t completely change the fan energy the way IT would.

That's kind of true until you take into account how many more points IT is likely to give up on the other end than Javonte.  Maybe IT's 3s and energy lifts up our team defense?  Possible.

All things considered, I'd take IT over Carsen.  I could see IT being more valuable than Carsen if Kemba were to miss a stretch (like a round) of playoff games.

Only reservation really is messing with locker room chemistry which is just so good right now.
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Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #71 on: February 21, 2020, 09:46:23 AM »

Offline Fafnir

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Carsen Edwards is a young player signed to a 4 year cheap contract whose best basketball is ahead of him. He is not getting cut to bring in IT4.

Neither should be on the floor in any sort of game that matters. The team would be better playing Green/Semih and just playing Hayward at PG.

Re: IT will be free (Should we sign him)
« Reply #72 on: February 21, 2020, 12:32:51 PM »

Offline CF033

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I love IT, the King of the 4th season was easily one of the Celts' most entertaining regular seasons (IMO). He was a great teammate as far as I knew.

That said, other than story line I don't really see a reason to bring him back in at this point.

Don't get me wrong, I'd cheer like a maniac if he did wind up here again and hit some huge shot in a playoff game.

Can't see it happening though.