Given How Things Looked When Horford Left, What A Job Ainge Has Done Since

[Phantom255x]

Seriously, I forgot the exact date but it was some time around the 3rd week of June, we heard Horford opted-out. It was expected as he was looking for probably another long-term deal. We had hoped he would re-sign here, maybe on a lucrative 3-year deal.

But then we heard that not only was Kyrie, Morris and others projected to leave, but also Horford. That was definitely a shock to most of us, and suddenly things started to really look bleak as Anthony Davis was not an option either at that point. It felt like we were heading for another sort of rebuild, or at least a few years of mediocrity.

Since then though? What Ainge has done given the circumstances has been nothing short of phenomenal.

Ainge said he took some blame for last year's struggles on The Jump interview recently, and I think he learned that it was best to get rid of the "egos" and also getting rid of guys like Rozier and Morris to open up more opportunities for Jaylen, Brown and Hayward. People felt we were letting go of too many guys and we lacked depth, but I'd argue that this has allowed Jaylen, Tatum and even Timelord to grow a ton this season. Even Hayward looked like his All-Star self, and hopefully will continue to look like it when he returns. No more Rozier and Morris jacking up shots and playing hero-ball trying to secure big contracts but then screwing the team.

Kemba coming here was probably the most shocking to me. I hadn't even thought of him, and felt he'd either stay in CHA, or go to a team like the Knicks, Mavericks or Lakers. Then we saw the tweets:

Marc Stein
@TheSteinLine
The Celtics, I'm told, are emerging as a stealth suitor for Charlotte Hornets free agent Kemba Walker

Adrian Wojnarowski
@wojespn
The Boston Celtics have emerged as the frontrunner to sign Charlotte All-Star guard Kemba Walker once free agency opens Sunday at 6 PM ET, league sources tell ESPN.

And we got him. Surprised Kemba came here, but I'm glad he did. It seems he loves playing here too, which is nice. He's looked like the leader we needed and wanted. Taken off a stretcher 5 days ago, and then 5 days later he's playing and putting up 39. Meanwhile, Kyrie doesn't even show up to the arena with a shoulder injury to support his team.

There's obviously still work to do, but we're still a legit contender thanks to Ainge, and also Kemba being willing to come here and the team working it out. The growth of our young players is also super encouraging, as after last season I think we had some doubts about their potential, but it's looking like that was an outlier because of guys like Kyrie and Rozier being locker-room cancers and such.

Thank you Ainge. This is one of many things I'm thankful for. That Ainge navigated past what looked like a brutal period for us, and got us to this point despite all that. Not many GMs would be able to IMO.

I think in the East, we're just as good as everyone else so long as we're healthy and can take them in a playoff series. I think this team still does have the potential to reach the Finals. Would love to make another addition at the deadline though (even if it's a buyout one)

[GreenCoffeeBean]

It’s a good reminder that teams are built three years before hand

[Fierce1]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

[Phantom255x]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

I still would have loved Horford on this team. In fact, Horford on this current team + Sixers NOT having Horford might have made us true favorites in the East.

With that said, 4/109M was just too much at this age for him. I mean, when we acquired Horford over 4 years ago, it was for basically that same contract. Now he's about 4 years older than that.

It was a good move for PHI, but I'm not blaming Ainge or anyone for letting him go at that price.

It also means we are under the luxury tax and can re-set it.

I kind of wish we had Baynes though. A true bruiser like him who can defend against the better bigs too. Would it be possible to re-acquire him via trade lol?

[ederson]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

[Fierce1]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

I still would have loved Horford on this team. In fact, Horford on this current team + Sixers NOT having Horford might have made us true favorites in the East.

With that said, 4/109M was just too much at this age for him. I mean, when we acquired Horford over 4 years ago, it was for basically that same contract. Now he's about 4 years older than that.

It was a good move for PHI, but I'm not blaming Ainge or anyone for letting him go at that price.

It also means we are under the luxury tax and can re-set it.

I kind of wish we had Baynes though. A true bruiser like him who can defend against the better bigs too. Would it be possible to re-acquire him via trade lol?

I agree about Baynes.

Celts would not be needing a defensive Center right now if they still had Baynes.

Here's the thing about Horford, he hurts the Sixers more than it helps them.
Having both Horford and Embiid on the court at the same time slows down the Sixers.
The Sixers were more dangerous when they had Jimmy Butler and Redick.
Last season's Sixers team was better than this current Sixers.

[Fierce1]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

[Moranis]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

[Phantom255x]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

Yep. I'm just happy we're no longer in that "era" where our frontcourt was Sully/Zeller/Mickey/Olynyk, etc. Those guys could barely rebound either, and frankly the bigs we've had the last few years and even this season are so much more physical.

[Scottiej23]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

Yep. I'm just happy we're no longer in that "era" where our frontcourt was Sully/Zeller/Mickey/Olynyk, etc. Those guys could barely rebound either, and frankly the bigs we've had the last few years and even this season are so much more physical.

Sullinger was actually a pretty good rebounder.

[celticsclay]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

Horford I believe is shooting a career low from field and close to a career low from 3 (32%). Some of that is probably from their poor team construction, but probably also some aging in there. I think they actually got to play him about 4 minutes less a game and he would be more effective

[Fierce1]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

That's why the Hawks never got close to reaching the east finals with Horford.

With Boston, rebounding was always a problem in the 3 seasons he played for the Celts.

The question is, would Ainge still have gone through giving Horford 28m per year if KD informed them ahead of time that he will be signing with Boston back in the summer of 2016?

One of the reasons why the Celts got Horford was to entice KD to come to Boston back in the summer of 2016.

Look at the Sixers now.
Horford is supposed to be an upgrade for them.
But it's looking like the Sixers were better last season than this season.

[Moranis]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

That's why the Hawks never got close to reaching the east finals with Horford.

With Boston, rebounding was always a problem in the 3 seasons he played for the Celts.

The question is, would Ainge still have gone through giving Horford 28m per year if KD informed them ahead of time that he will be signing with Boston back in the summer of 2016?

One of the reasons why the Celts got Horford was to entice KD to come to Boston back in the summer of 2016.

Look at the Sixers now.
Horford is supposed to be an upgrade for them.
But it's looking like the Sixers were better last season than this season.

Sixers are on pace to win 3.67 more games this year than they won last year. 

[Fierce1]

What guys like Theis, Kanter, and RWill does that Horford can't, get rebounds.

Horford was just averaging around 6-7 rebounds per game in his last 2 seasons with the Celts.

That's pathetic for a big man who was getting 28m per year.

Al Horford just got old.

he definitely is a poor rebounder but you ignore everything else he brings to the floor and all three of the players you mentioned don't.

I am not bothered that DA didn't offer more than the sixers but as Phantom255x says with AH this team is a real contender

So far the Celts are on pace to win 60 games.

If we're talking about a 30-year old Horford then I would agree about being a real contender.

But the Horford of right now just can't do what Theis, RWill, and Kanter can do.

It was only hours ago that the Celts got 19 offensive rebounds against the Nets.

Celts could never get that many offensive rebounds with Horford the last 2 seasons.

Horford was never a great rebounder.  In fact the 2 years before Boston he averaged 7.2, 7.3 rebounds.  In Boston he had 6.8, 7.4, 6.7 or right in the same mix as his last 2 years in Atlanta.  In other words, Boston didn't sign Al because he was a beast on the boards as he never was.  Boston signed Al to play elite defense, space the floor, and pass the ball.  Al did all of that and he did all of that very well.  And he is still doing that Philly.

That's why the Hawks never got close to reaching the east finals with Horford.

With Boston, rebounding was always a problem in the 3 seasons he played for the Celts.

The question is, would Ainge still have gone through giving Horford 28m per year if KD informed them ahead of time that he will be signing with Boston back in the summer of 2016?

One of the reasons why the Celts got Horford was to entice KD to come to Boston back in the summer of 2016.

Look at the Sixers now.
Horford is supposed to be an upgrade for them.
But it's looking like the Sixers were better last season than this season.

Sixers are on pace to win 3.67 more games this year than they won last year.

If the Sixers continue to lose 6 games per month, they won't have a better record this season.

From now to April, that's still 5 months to go.

Anything can still happen because the Sixers can still make a trade.

But the point is, before the season started, the analysts from ESPN said Sixers will be #1 in the east and will most likely face the Lakers in the Finals in 2020.

Right now the Sixers couldn't even beat a Toronto team without Kawhi.

[vjcsmoke]

For the Celtics to be 13-4 at this point in the season, they are WAY ahead of what I expected.

The recruitment of Kemba Walker to replace Kyrie Irving and the departures of former players such as Horford, Rozier, Baynes, and Morris forced other players to step up and grow.

The duo of Jayson and Jaylen and the pure goodness that is Kemba Walker as the leader of the lockerroom has led to a big turnaround in a good way.

I'm just enjoying this run because the needle is pointing upwards for our youngsters.  And the resigning of Smart looks like a bargain right now because he has been playing such a key role to the Celtics winning ways.