Poll

Does Taco make the team

Yes. Taco time is here to stay.
92 (61.7%)
No. No room for Tacos
57 (38.3%)

Total Members Voted: 149

Author Topic: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year  (Read 25472 times)

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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #330 on: September 18, 2019, 12:41:34 PM »

Offline Greenback

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Why is he worth holding onto if he's a "massive project"?
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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #331 on: September 18, 2019, 01:28:58 PM »

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Why is he worth holding onto if he's a "massive project"?
Because sometimes massive projects pay off.

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #332 on: September 18, 2019, 01:54:10 PM »

Offline Greenback

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Are you saying then, that Tacko has a chance of "paying off"? 

If so, maybe we can apply Bayesian probability statistics to find out if this massive project is worth the potential pay off?

Everyone wants truth on his side, not everyone wants to be on the side of truth.

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #333 on: September 18, 2019, 02:14:06 PM »

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Are you saying then, that Tacko has a chance of "paying off"? 

If so, maybe we can apply Bayesian probability statistics to find out if this massive project is worth the potential pay off?
Is there a chance that Tacko pays off? Depends on one's definition of paying off. If by paying off you mean that sometime in the next four years that Tacko becomes a rotation worthy player, then sure, there is a chance?

Given the financial investment will be minimal and the only other things of value you may be sacrificing in trying to develop Tacko is a roster spot and time, it's probably worth it, so I don't think it will be necessary to break out the advanced mathematics.

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #334 on: September 18, 2019, 02:24:13 PM »

Offline Greenback

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Are you saying then, that Tacko has a chance of "paying off"? 

If so, maybe we can apply Bayesian probability statistics to find out if this massive project is worth the potential pay off?
Is there a chance that Tacko pays off? Depends on one's definition of paying off. If by paying off you mean that sometime in the next four years that Tacko becomes a rotation worthy player, then sure, there is a chance?

Given the financial investment will be minimal and the only other things of value you may be sacrificing in trying to develop Tacko is a roster spot and time, it's probably worth it, so I don't think it will be necessary to break out the advanced mathematics.

OK then, let's leave it that to Las Vegas and Hedge fund managers.

From a standpoint of watching basketball for its entertainment value, many people want to see what he can do - right now.   And, many people believe that you will not have to wait, and do not want to wait, to see if he makes the summer league four years from now - and that he can play, right now.   We will see what happens.
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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #335 on: September 18, 2019, 08:11:50 PM »

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Are you saying then, that Tacko has a chance of "paying off"? 

If so, maybe we can apply Bayesian probability statistics to find out if this massive project is worth the potential pay off?
Is there a chance that Tacko pays off? Depends on one's definition of paying off. If by paying off you mean that sometime in the next four years that Tacko becomes a rotation worthy player, then sure, there is a chance?

Given the financial investment will be minimal and the only other things of value you may be sacrificing in trying to develop Tacko is a roster spot and time, it's probably worth it, so I don't think it will be necessary to break out the advanced mathematics.

OK then, let's leave it that to Las Vegas and Hedge fund managers.

From a standpoint of watching basketball for its entertainment value, many people want to see what he can do - right now.   And, many people believe that you will not have to wait, and do not want to wait, to see if he makes the summer league four years from now - and that he can play, right now.   We will see what happens.
That's all said and good that from an entertainment point of view people want to see him, even right now. But the reality is Brad Stevens could care less that fans want to be entertained by an freakishly big player with very little strength or current skills to hang in the NBA. Stevens wants to win and throwing Tacko out there right away isn't conducive to winning basketball.

Tacko will need to develop...a lot. He will be very lucky to see much of any time in Boston this year

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #336 on: September 18, 2019, 09:01:03 PM »

Offline bellerephon

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Are you saying then, that Tacko has a chance of "paying off"? 

If so, maybe we can apply Bayesian probability statistics to find out if this massive project is worth the potential pay off?
Is there a chance that Tacko pays off? Depends on one's definition of paying off. If by paying off you mean that sometime in the next four years that Tacko becomes a rotation worthy player, then sure, there is a chance?

Given the financial investment will be minimal and the only other things of value you may be sacrificing in trying to develop Tacko is a roster spot and time, it's probably worth it, so I don't think it will be necessary to break out the advanced mathematics.

OK then, let's leave it that to Las Vegas and Hedge fund managers.

From a standpoint of watching basketball for its entertainment value, many people want to see what he can do - right now.   And, many people believe that you will not have to wait, and do not want to wait, to see if he makes the summer league four years from now - and that he can play, right now.   We will see what happens.
That's all said and good that from an entertainment point of view people want to see him, even right now. But the reality is Brad Stevens could care less that fans want to be entertained by an freakishly big player with very little strength or current skills to hang in the NBA. Stevens wants to win and throwing Tacko out there right away isn't conducive to winning basketball.

Tacko will need to develop...a lot. He will be very lucky to see much of any time in Boston this year
I totally agree with this. Even if Tacko wins that final roster spot, he will still likely be inactive and in Maine for most if not all of the season. There is no reason to think he is ready to contribute at the NBA level. He's a project.

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #337 on: September 18, 2019, 09:26:32 PM »

Offline Greenback

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It seems to me that Tacko's development should be a priority for Brad.  If Brad is worth his salt, he should be able to turn Tacko into a player in training camp and give him minutes, as he did for Tatum.  Brad doesn't have to try to teach height to Tacko as he tries to do with small ball lineups.  How many guards and small forwards do the Celtics need?  How much time is Brad going to spend holding their pants up?

Tacko has much better strength that you think.  And he has the height already.  He held the number 1 pick in the NBA draft to a draw.  Tacko's Central Florida's team was one foul away from beating DUKE, with coach K and all the million dollar kids and official's support.  Kyrie, also from Duke was a cancer last year.  How much did that cost?

I don't know why anyone would want to see this "gentle soul" fail.  Maybe part of the appeal of Tacko is that he is a humble individual, not an over hyped, over paid professional athlete,  that given a chance, could eat their lunches (as seen during the tournament).  Is rooting for the underdog more fun than rooting for the manufactured superstars in the league?  Is it wrong?

The Celtics are not going to win anything with the other centers they have and they are not going to win with small ball either.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2019, 09:32:09 PM by Greenback »
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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #338 on: September 18, 2019, 11:08:21 PM »

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It seems to me that Tacko's development should be a priority for Brad.  If Brad is worth his salt, he should be able to turn Tacko into a player in training camp and give him minutes, as he did for Tatum.  Brad doesn't have to try to teach height to Tacko as he tries to do with small ball lineups.  How many guards and small forwards do the Celtics need?  How much time is Brad going to spend holding their pants up?

Tacko has much better strength that you think.  And he has the height already.  He held the number 1 pick in the NBA draft to a draw.  Tacko's Central Florida's team was one foul away from beating DUKE, with coach K and all the million dollar kids and official's support.  Kyrie, also from Duke was a cancer last year.  How much did that cost?

I don't know why anyone would want to see this "gentle soul" fail.  Maybe part of the appeal of Tacko is that he is a humble individual, not an over hyped, over paid professional athlete,  that given a chance, could eat their lunches (as seen during the tournament).  Is rooting for the underdog more fun than rooting for the manufactured superstars in the league?  Is it wrong?

The Celtics are not going to win anything with the other centers they have and they are not going to win with small ball either.
So, you believe that Brad Stevens took Jayson Tatum, the #3 pick in his draft and maybe best player from that draft, and in one training camp turned him into an NBA player.

So therefore, he should be able to do the same with Tacko Fall, a very raw,  undrafted free agent prospect.

You see nothing wrong with this logic?

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #339 on: September 19, 2019, 12:15:19 AM »

Online Alleyoopster

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Don't have any idea what everyone is talking about when they sau Tacko needing time to develop.

Did you watch him during Summer League? He was basically dropping the ball in the basket - no jumping necessary. It was ridiculously easy. How much can you improve upon dropping a ball on a basket?

He did get burned some on defense, but he more than made up for it by distracting shooters and making cutters change direction when heading into the lane.

Then, there were his insane picks that left shooters wide open. Never saw anything like this before on my life.

Danny - sign Tacko!

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #340 on: September 19, 2019, 09:05:21 AM »

Offline Greenback

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Alleyoopster,  good summary.  As Groucho Marx said, "Are you going to believe me or your own eyes?"

Tatum got minutes, plenty of them.  That helped him develop.  Give Tacko the same minutes that Tatum got.

Logic?  Please.


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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #341 on: September 19, 2019, 10:10:25 AM »

Offline ederson

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Alleyoopster,  good summary.  As Groucho Marx said, "Are you going to believe me or your own eyes?"

Tatum got minutes, plenty of them.  That helped him develop.  Give Tacko the same minutes that Tatum got.

Logic?  Please.

Are seriously comparing a 19yo top3 pick to an undrafted 23yo??

Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #342 on: September 19, 2019, 10:16:34 AM »

Offline Greenback

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You may be right.  It may not be fair.  Tacko has more potential impact.
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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #343 on: September 19, 2019, 02:01:00 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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How can they not keep him? They had him making appearances all summer long.

I saw footage on TV & the Celtics site where he:

- Was at Canobie Lake Park with a foster kids at summer camp
- Opening ceremonies & playing with kids at a Celtics court
- At a Patriots game on the sidelines before a game, press pics snapping

Would be bad form to use him as the posterboy of your team for 3 months and then cut him
Good form or not, I doubt he makes the roster.  He doesn't have very good basketball skills and his motor is suspect.  After all this time, his best asset is still his height.  That can be game-planned against by matching him up with an outside shooting big to bring him out of the paint.

Just a small quibble:  It actually hasn't been much 'time'.   Tacko Fall didn't really start playing basketball until he came over to the US in the middle of high school, around age 17.   

Most kids getting a sniff at the NBA have been playing competitive basketball since they were in middle school.   And critically, it's those early years where most get schooled in a lot of basic fundamentals.   Tacko was sort of dropped into more competitive levels that simply assume you have all that already.  He got by through all this so far based on, as you note, his height.   But he's had to play a massive game of 'catch up' in regards to learning all the basics of basketball and wasn't really helped all that much by being in a NCAA program.    The Celtics have been putting him through intensive fundamentals training.   

In addition to his height, one advantage he has is that he's apparently extremely intelligent and the coaches all glow about how fast he picks things up.  But he's going to need at least a little time (repetition) to make all those basics become natural.

Currently, technically, Fall is on the roster (non-guaranteed contract).  I expect they won't cut him unless a compelling need for that roster spot arises.  If they need it to do a trade later in the year they could always just cut him at that point.   So I expect him to be on the roster when they open the season.  However, I also expect him to spend most or all of the season in Portland.

The cost of keeping him is simply so tiny and the upside potential long term is high enough that it's really kind of a no-brainer.    Just put him in Portland and see how he develops this year.  Re-assess next Summer.
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Re: Poll: Does Tacko make the 15 man roster this year
« Reply #344 on: September 19, 2019, 02:10:13 PM »

Offline mmmmm

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As much as Taco is a good person, and is certainly a freak of nature being 7 foot 7 and all, strength has a part in every sport. I was shocked to hear that Taco couldn't even bench press the bar in workouts. I understand that having arms that long presents a disadvantage. But still, how he'll move a Lebron and other more balanced bigs around in the paint in an NBA game is a mystery.

Where did you hear that?   That sounds dubious to me.   At the NBA Draft Combine, he managed 8 repetitions in the bench press test.   That's not elite like Grant-I-did-20-Williams, but it's fairly middle-of-the-road.  14 players all posted between 7 and 9 repetitions, including several other centers and PFs.
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