Author Topic: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today  (Read 6086 times)

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Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #210 on: May 16, 2019, 11:03:17 AM »

Offline Roy H.

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The more he struggled on offense the more up and down his defense became. This is natural. It is what happens to most players.

I donít think thatís right. If it does, itís the sign of a psychologically weak player.

Rozier played the same offense this year that he has for the rest of his career, minus the final 16 games and playoffs in 2018.

His defense fell well below his prior standard.


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Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #211 on: May 16, 2019, 11:07:59 AM »

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Rozier didn't quit. He tried his heart out. He just failed.

It is not the same thing.

I think a lot of observers disagree. His defense and hustle this past season seemed to regress sharply.  Thatís a reflection of effort.

Rozier's defense went as his offense went. The more he struggled on offense the more up and down his defense became. This is natural. It is what happens to most players. Especially young players.

In fact, it happened to the team as the whole throughout the year. When they struggled on offense, their defense dropped off.

Rozier was trying. He was just failing.

Failure is not quitting.

I don't think that's true. A lot of players, when their shot isn't falling, will try to affect the game in other ways like trying even harder on defense.

I don't think it's fair to say Rozier "quit" but before he ever made these comments there was a pretty strong consensus that Rozier's effort was severely lacking and these comments cast that characterization in an even worse light.

They should do that. It is what they are meant to do. and some do but most don't.

The ones that do have terrific mentality. Strong not easily rattled. Warrior like players. 

That is why some GMs say you learn more about players from their bad games than when they are playing well. That is when you see their character.

As for the C's, Tatum does the same. So does Kyrie. When their shot isn't falling, their engagement on defense drops off.

Then when you look at Rozier - the situation is different. It is more extreme. It was just one or two bad games. It was not a bad streak of games. It was a season-long funk. And when you are spiraling like Rozier was this year where it is one bad game after another ... how can that not mess with you?

What we learned about Rozier is that he doesn't have ironclad mental strength. He struggled. Over and over and over again and it affected him. Like it would with pretty much everyone. Especially when in the media spotlight and millions of people are judging what you are doing.

Rozier was trying and he was fighting but each time he failed there was a little less fight in him.

He was pressing and trying so hard. We all saw it. Looking to make things right. Make home run plays. On offense and on defense. The repeated failures performance were screwing with his head and that effect was growing throughout the year.

Not smart basketball. But definitely not quitting either.

The guy was trying. Just failing.

I am all-in on the criticism of Rozier performances. Not on the stuff about him being a quitter, bad egg or locker room cancer. I think that is sensationalist stuff. Blown out of all proportion.

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #212 on: May 16, 2019, 11:16:16 AM »

Offline indeedproceed

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Rozier didn't quit. He tried his heart out. He just failed.

It is not the same thing.

I think a lot of observers disagree. His defense and hustle this past season seemed to regress sharply.  Thatís a reflection of effort.

Rozier's defense went as his offense went. The more he struggled on offense the more up and down his defense became. This is natural. It is what happens to most players. Especially young players.

In fact, it happened to the team as the whole throughout the year. When they struggled on offense, their defense dropped off.

Rozier was trying. He was just failing.

Failure is not quitting.

I don't think that's true. A lot of players, when their shot isn't falling, will try to affect the game in other ways like trying even harder on defense.

I don't think it's fair to say Rozier "quit" but before he ever made these comments there was a pretty strong consensus that Rozier's effort was severely lacking and these comments cast that characterization in an even worse light.

They should do that. It is what they are meant to do. and some do but most don't.

The ones that do have terrific mentality. Strong not easily rattled. Warrior like players. 

That is why some GMs say you learn more about players from their bad games than when they are playing well. That is when you see their character.

As for the C's, Tatum does the same. So does Kyrie. When their shot isn't falling, their engagement on defense drops off.

Then when you look at Rozier - the situation is different. It is more extreme. It was just one or two bad games. It was not a bad streak of games. It was a season-long funk. And when you are spiraling like Rozier was this year where it is one bad game after another ... how can that not mess with you?

What we learned about Rozier is that he doesn't have ironclad mental strength. He struggled. Over and over and over again and it affected him. Like it would with pretty much everyone. Especially when in the media spotlight and millions of people are judging what you are doing.

Rozier was trying and he was fighting but each time he failed there was a little less fight in him.

He was pressing and trying so hard. We all saw it. Looking to make things right. Make home run plays. On offense and on defense. The repeated failures performance were screwing with his head and that effect was growing throughout the year.

Not smart basketball. But definitely not quitting either.

The guy was trying. Just failing.

I am all-in on the criticism of Rozier performances. Not on the stuff about him being a quitter, bad egg or locker room cancer. I think that is sensationalist stuff. Blown out of all proportion.

What a great post. TP.

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Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #213 on: May 16, 2019, 11:29:09 AM »

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The more he struggled on offense the more up and down his defense became. This is natural. It is what happens to most players.

I donít think thatís right. If it does, itís the sign of a psychologically weak player.

Rozier played the same offense this year that he has for the rest of his career, minus the final 16 games and playoffs in 2018.

His defense fell well below his prior standard.

It is. It is also a sign of youth. Of immaturity. Young players are more prone to letting offensive struggles effect their defense than experienced players.

They have to learn to deal with failure. To deal with that pressure / scrutiny that comes with failure.

Some guys learn early. Some guys learn as they go. Others never learn.

This was only Rozier's 3rd year as a regular in the team and his 1st year with having real expectations placed on him. Both from the public (fans, media) and perhaps more importantly himself (breakout campaign, starter, future All-Star?).

And when things went wrong, he handled it badly.

He tried hard to fix things but he never could.

It could be a sign of things to come from him for the rest of his career or it could be something he learns from and helps improve him moving forward. Makes him mentally stronger (or not).

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #214 on: May 16, 2019, 11:36:00 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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Oh, I completely disagree that Rozier's lack of energy and poor performance was due to his disappointment and frustration from trying so hard but not producing that it affected his play.

Rozier stated that even before the season started he was affected by seeing he wouldn't have the same role as last playoffs. He stated he had a problem with the ball being in others hands. Clearly, this proves he was frustrated and angry before even entering games, due not to failure but because of his role.

He let that affect his game, playing in a manner that was designed to get as many counting stats as possible in as little time as possible to prove his worth for a future contract. He admitted players were doing this. Probably because he knew he was.

It's at this point that failure started to affect him but it's because he was coming in misguided about what he was entitled to, refusing to play a role he was given, playing outside the team concept and trying to just get his.

This is not a case of a player coming in with a good attitude that played his ass off within the team system and was just slumping bad which then led to frustration which affected him and led to his failure.

This is a case of a player being mentally compromised before he ever set foot on the court and let his poor mental state affect his play in a detrimental manner from day one, minute one of the season.

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #215 on: May 16, 2019, 11:38:18 AM »

Offline RJ87

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The more he struggled on offense the more up and down his defense became. This is natural. It is what happens to most players.

I don’t think that’s right. If it does, it’s the sign of a psychologically weak player.

Rozier played the same offense this year that he has for the rest of his career, minus the final 16 games and playoffs in 2018.

His defense fell well below his prior standard.

Agreed Roy. Rozier has always been inefficient. This year was not outside the norm for him in terms of shots not falling.

I said earlier in the season in one of the game threads that what changes for Terry in terms of coming off the bench vs. starting is that he simply seems to care more. We've seen him come off the bench and have an impact (the game against Toronto comes to mind where he picked up full court defensively), so he's shown he's capable of engaging. But more often than not, his effort level and shot selection are wholly inconsistent.
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Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #216 on: May 16, 2019, 11:40:24 AM »

Offline RJ87

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Oh, I completely disagree that Rozier's lack of energy and poor performance was due to his disappointment and frustration from trying so hard but not producing that it affected his play.

Rozier stated that even before the season started he was affected by seeing he wouldn't have the same role as last playoffs. He stated he had a problem with the ball being in others hands. Clearly, this proves he was frustrated and angry before even entering games, due not to failure but because of his role.

He let that affect his game, playing in a manner that was designed to get as many counting stats as possible in as little time as possible to prove his worth for a future contract. He admitted players were doing this. Probably because he knew he was.

It's at this point that failure started to affect him but it's because he was coming in misguided about what he was entitled to, refusing to play a role he was given, playing outside the team concept and trying to just get his.

This is not a case of a player coming in with a good attitude that played his ass off within the team system and was just slumping bad which then led to frustration which affected him and led to his failure.

This is a case of a player being mentally compromised before he ever set foot on the court and let his poor mental state affect his play in a detrimental manner from day one, minute one of the season.

Exactly. Perfectly stated. TP.
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SG: V.Oladipo, C.Joseph, S.Hicks, D. Reed
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PF: T. Young, T. Leaf, K. O'Quinn
C: M. Turner, D. Sabonis
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Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #217 on: May 16, 2019, 11:50:04 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Rozier was unhappy about his,role from the get go , and this just help feed the lockerroom drama of other guys feeling the same about Hayward and Irving.

Rozier Im still convinced he was pushing his agenda and thoughts in the locker room ...  is a very very selfish person.

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #218 on: May 16, 2019, 12:05:16 PM »

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I agree with the overall sentiment that Terry should not be on TV making excuses and blaming others - it doesn't serve any purpose except to protect his ego.

But anyone who's ever played on a team that was badly mismanaged - and that's what the Celtics were this year  - will tell you it effects everything.

I give Ainge and Brad an F- for this season.  Literally no adjustments were made by either of them.  The same problems that they had at the beginning of the year were the problems that ended the season. 

Scapegoating Rozier probably feels good to some fans, but the entire Hayward disaster, and Kyrie's combination of isolation offense and resting on defense are the problems that Ainge and Stevens actually need to address if this team isn't going to take another step backwards.

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #219 on: May 16, 2019, 12:11:20 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I give Ainge and Brad an F- for this season.  Literally no adjustments were made by either of them.

Brad made no adjustments this year?  Like moving Hayward and Brown to the bench?


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Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #220 on: May 16, 2019, 12:15:14 PM »

Offline bopna

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He has Been n really trying hard to sell himself... Lol

He is a terrible basketball player...on a bad team he will Ave 10 ppg.

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #221 on: May 16, 2019, 12:30:47 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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I give Ainge and Brad an F- for this season.  Literally no adjustments were made by either of them.

Brad made no adjustments this year?  Like moving Hayward and Brown to the bench?
And how about installing a real pick n roll/pick n pop game with Kyrie and Horford mid season and playing it more and more as the season wore on. It was their best offense by year's end.

He also went back to Baynes in the starting lineup towards the end of the year until Baynes got banged up against Milwaukee. It had a positive effect as well. He made adjustments. He failed in other ways though.

But, it sounds and looks like Stevens may have lost control of the locker room. He didn't have the experience or the know how/ability to handle the psychological part of managing this team. Stevens had trouble getting them to buy in to his system, drown out the outside influences, get them to focus on team first individual second and motivate them.

That's the part of the blame that Stevens gets for what happened this year.

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #222 on: May 16, 2019, 12:34:42 PM »

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hey terry

don't let the door hit u in the ass on the way out punk
LET'S GO CELTICS!

Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #223 on: May 17, 2019, 10:49:36 AM »

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If you haven't watched the interviews you really should.   

https://youtu.be/EBRYxN4MLPk

The quotes, taken out of context, were much worse than the actual message.  It was a wide-ranging interview full of perspective and honesty (which is extremely rare in this day and age). 

I can see why people like Ainge bought into Terry in the first place. 


Re: Rozier On Get Up! & First Take Today
« Reply #224 on: May 17, 2019, 10:53:52 AM »

Offline Big333223

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Rozier didn't quit. He tried his heart out. He just failed.

It is not the same thing.

I think a lot of observers disagree. His defense and hustle this past season seemed to regress sharply.  Thatís a reflection of effort.

Rozier's defense went as his offense went. The more he struggled on offense the more up and down his defense became. This is natural. It is what happens to most players. Especially young players.

In fact, it happened to the team as the whole throughout the year. When they struggled on offense, their defense dropped off.

Rozier was trying. He was just failing.

Failure is not quitting.

I don't think that's true. A lot of players, when their shot isn't falling, will try to affect the game in other ways like trying even harder on defense.

I don't think it's fair to say Rozier "quit" but before he ever made these comments there was a pretty strong consensus that Rozier's effort was severely lacking and these comments cast that characterization in an even worse light.

They should do that. It is what they are meant to do. and some do but most don't.

The ones that do have terrific mentality. Strong not easily rattled. Warrior like players. 

That is why some GMs say you learn more about players from their bad games than when they are playing well. That is when you see their character.

As for the C's, Tatum does the same. So does Kyrie. When their shot isn't falling, their engagement on defense drops off.

Then when you look at Rozier - the situation is different. It is more extreme. It was just one or two bad games. It was not a bad streak of games. It was a season-long funk. And when you are spiraling like Rozier was this year where it is one bad game after another ... how can that not mess with you?

What we learned about Rozier is that he doesn't have ironclad mental strength. He struggled. Over and over and over again and it affected him. Like it would with pretty much everyone. Especially when in the media spotlight and millions of people are judging what you are doing.

Rozier was trying and he was fighting but each time he failed there was a little less fight in him.

He was pressing and trying so hard. We all saw it. Looking to make things right. Make home run plays. On offense and on defense. The repeated failures performance were screwing with his head and that effect was growing throughout the year.

Not smart basketball. But definitely not quitting either.

The guy was trying. Just failing.

I am all-in on the criticism of Rozier performances. Not on the stuff about him being a quitter, bad egg or locker room cancer. I think that is sensationalist stuff. Blown out of all proportion.

Ask Jaylen Brown. Brown sacrificed more than Rozier this season and fought through it, improving himself along the way.

It sounds like you're both dismissing Rozier's lack of effort as being "natural" while also saying it makes him mentally weak. Unless you think most basketball players are mentally weak, that doesn't really square, to me.
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