The Celtics are 15-5 with a healthy starting lineup

[Bobshot]

A couple of caveats on this impressive starters' record. The first is they are winning a lot of games against weak teams by very close scores. And often at home, like the other night against Philly. A contender blows out those teams, like the old winning Celtics teams used to do. The Celtics aren't blowing out anybody--mainly because they're getting beaten up front--they can't rebound. They don't get, and they give up, too many 2nd shots. I wonder if there are stats to show that. They get outrebounded every game--offense and defense.

The 2nd caveat is the thinness of their depth. If either Horford or IT go down, they become a .500 team. They have about 6 core guys who have to stay healthy for them to win. Last year, they had more depth with Turner and Sully. Horford has more than taken Sully's place, but Turner hasn't been replaced. Hence, their depth has diminished. Brown and Rozier have shown some promise, but they haven't played enough to be an important part of their depth.

Red Auerbach used to say a team needs 8 solid guys to win a championship. They had that with Red's old dynasty teams, and with the '07 team as well. They aren't there yet with this team.

[Endless Paradise]

So the only teams who have been able to beat us when healthy are CLE, SA, HOU, OKC, and Detroit?

Is anybody really bummed out by that?

Yea, I'm bummed out about HOU, OKC, and Pistons.  We shouldn't lose to those teams.

... the Celtics shouldn't lose to Houston? The team with the best record in the league since Thanksgiving? They have a 29-9 record on the year, which is better than the healthy Celtics' win percentage (.763 vs. .750).

OKC and Boston are pretty much on the same level: playoff teams that will regularly beat up on the dregs of the league, but not do anything significant in the postseason.

[SHAQATTACK]

If Zeller does not clobber Horford .....we would be ahead of Raptors at this point , right behind the Cavs by a couple games.

Zeller .....killed us.

[SHAQATTACK]

A couple of caveats on this impressive starters' record. The first is they are winning a lot of games against weak teams by very close scores. And often at home, like the other night against Philly. A contender blows out those teams, like the old winning Celtics teams used to do. The Celtics aren't blowing out anybody--mainly because they're getting beaten up front--they can't rebound. They don't get, and they give up, too many 2nd shots. I wonder if there are stats to show that. They get outrebounded every game--offense and defense.

The 2nd caveat is the thinness of their depth. If either Horford or IT go down, they become a .500 team. They have about 6 core guys who have to stay healthy for them to win. Last year, they had more depth with Turner and Sully. Horford has more than taken Sully's place, but Turner hasn't been replaced. Hence, their depth has diminished. Brown and Rozier have shown some promise, but they haven't played enough to be an important part of their depth.

Red Auerbach used to say a team needs 8 solid guys to win a championship. They had that with Red's old dynasty teams, and with the '07 team as well. They aren't there yet with this team.

Same for Cavs .......look at anytime LeBron is out ...sick or Resting ......they can t win to save their tails ...... they are like 3-16 when LeBron is out.   Cavs would be 6-8 seed at best .....no coach , it would be a night mare ...like Heat .....when Bron is gone.

He IS the Cavs

[mgent]

So the only teams who have been able to beat us when healthy are CLE, SA, HOU, OKC, and Detroit?

Is anybody really bummed out by that?

Yea, I'm bummed out about HOU, OKC, and Pistons.  We shouldn't lose to those teams.

... the Celtics shouldn't lose to Houston? The team with the best record in the league since Thanksgiving? They have a 29-9 record on the year, which is better than the healthy Celtics' win percentage (.763 vs. .750).

OKC and Boston are pretty much on the same level: playoff teams that will regularly beat up on the dregs of the league, but not do anything significant in the postseason.

And just for the record, the Celtics beat Houston if Horford doesn't miss a wide open layup at the buzzer.

[Granath]

So the only teams who have been able to beat us when healthy are CLE, SA, HOU, OKC, and Detroit?

Is anybody really bummed out by that?

Yea, I'm bummed out about HOU, OKC, and Pistons.  We shouldn't lose to those teams.

... the Celtics shouldn't lose to Houston? The team with the best record in the league since Thanksgiving? They have a 29-9 record on the year, which is better than the healthy Celtics' win percentage (.763 vs. .750).

OKC and Boston are pretty much on the same level: playoff teams that will regularly beat up on the dregs of the league, but not do anything significant in the postseason.

And just for the record, the Celtics beat Houston if Horford doesn't miss a wide open layup at the buzzer.

...and if the refs hadn't stolen that game from the Cs. The officiating in that game was terrible (Harden alone shot 50% more free throws than the entire Celtics team).

[CelticPride2016]

Thanks for all the quality responses.

It's interesting all the various teams have been mentioned. It can be useful to compare and contrast teams over many years. Toronto is clearly above us. That is why it is important to beat them. We do not have to prove we are better than them, but rather that they are not better than us.

Our team is always going to improve. That is the Butler Celtics way. Smart picked it up several notches. Isaiah has fallen a bit down to Earth and his teammates watched his back. That is the Celtics Tradition or Celtics Pride that has been in place for sixty years.

Jae attacked us internally with the things he said on Twitter. I think that's why we were a bit sluggish and probably why he is currently slumping. Maybe I am reading too much into it, but a part of how I watch these games is like a soap opera probably.

Utah is starting to emerge. We beat them. They are in their first year of becoming a semi-menace. Toronto has more experience than us. But if we face them in the playoffs, I will not worry. It will not be year one playoffs with Isaiah with a bad back just happy to get wailed on by the Cavs. Those games weren't too bad for a sweep.

Last year yet again we were banged up. We won a couple games. It wasn't as good as winning a series, but we got our first playoff wins. I would simply assume if we are reasonably healthy, we are getting to the second round. We have had some big wins. Beating Memphis twice was huge. We beat the teams we should. 23-14 is not bad at all and we still have an extra three home games to make up. We are winning on the road.

Rollie has a new thread talking about how injuries are unfortunately a big part of the game. It's true. That's why you have to think hard before trading for Cousins. What if you give away all the assets and he gets a major injury? The Knicks went for Amar'e Stoudemire and that's precisely what happened and they were stuck with him.

The Big Baby 2009 team is what we're looking for. We want to be able to overachieve if with bad luck one of our best players is out. Cleveland could be banged up. We could make it to the Finals. If teams like the Clippers and Rockets have a fighter's chance at a title, I think we do too.

Some big ifs have fallen into place. Smart can play point guard and is nailing his free throws.

Olynyk is looking very serviceable lately. He needs to maintain this and hopefully he is just slumping with shooting and doesn't have an inherently broken shot like an RJ Hunter. Amir is stepping it up. We complained and he got a lot better.

Horford is scary bad at shooting layups. We can talk forever and about everything.

We need Jae to get back to his old self.

[CelticPride2016]

adding zizic during season would be a disaster-it would be a free pass to the foul line-nobody could adjust to nba that quickly

...

crowder  has lived under the sword of damocles being linked to trades -he loves boston -loyalty should cut both ways  but i'm from a different celtics era at least the press and management  seemed not to publicize  the want to trade
-the industry of rumors and the net are so immediate and pervasive,so insidious,so exagerating
always needing to be fed-ditch the twitter during the season

red claws play a 1 oclock game can be watched live

Thanks for the info. You would know better than me. My expectation then is Zizac will be signed and join the team in the off-season. I do hope Danny trades for a solid center for this year's chances.

Players slump. It is good to see guys like Green and Rozier acting professional with their chances. Phil Pressey had that ability. You can never have enough quality role players just happy to be on the team who won't complain if they don't play much.

It must be quite the balancing act for Brad and Danny to keep everyone happy. The shorter contracts might help. Humphries, Bass, Sully, Turner, now Amir, Jerebko and Green perform with little future security, yet are still positive and buying in so to speak. They are savoring the moment.

And Crowder is the one with the long contract. He might not be the best choice to express locker room concerns, insecurities or whatever in public. Trades are part of the game. Trade rumors don't have to be part of it. Players shouldn't let it get to them so much.

I'd like to see some video of these fans Jae said were cheering on Gordon Hayward. I never saw it. The sooner it's forgotten, the better. I think Jae slumping and eating humble pie is a sign he feels awful about the whole thing.

I wrote before it happened that I hate the money part of it. I have mentioned Crowder having the most security. These guys have to remember they are living a fantasy life as millionaires playing a sport. The reason why James Young, Zeller and Jae Crowder need to take their lumps with a smile is because they are extremely wealthy and we are not.

He opened a can of worms, but it is early enough in the season to blow over harmlessly.

Soon there will only be a month to go for the trade deadline. It is like this every year.

If the top picks are all guards and small forwards, I expect Danny to trade the Nets pick. But that is about next year, not now.

[CelticPride2016]

The Hawks have won six in a row. I guess that is the kind of treadmill we want to avoid. The Wizards used to be one of the top future ranked teams. Now they are floundering.

The Rockets are interesting. They could be the quintessential regular season titan, yet ultimately a playoff poser.

As for the Clippers, I can't see them as anything better than an underachieving loser team full of overrated divas. They did have the drama of a racist owner. I don't blame them for that year. They have Doc Rivers and the same stars yet never seem to pose a true threat. I see them fail year after year in the playoffs.

It looks like the Celtics are still adjusting to the new players and roles. It might look like Al Horford has been here a decade, but it doesn't seem as fluid as the 2008 team gelled.

Brad scares me sometimes with three guard small ball. I'n not saying never do it, but it's risky.

We are waiting on Jaylen Brown. We are waiting for Olynyk to put together a twenty game stretch where there is nothing to complain about. Rozier has to adjust to his Phil Pressey role. Zeller will probably be moved or if not, it's coming down to Amir Johnson. Rollie said what he did about Zizac, and so it looks like that option is out.

It'd be nice but probably impractical to hope Mickey emerges out of nowhere and somehow becomes a blocking machine. He would be the bridge center. I'm not asking him to cover Marc Gasol.

Noel seems perfect, but I also saw a lot of other quality defensive centers are available. It makes sense that Noel comes to Boston. I give that a 50-50 chance of happening. I don't think that would be an outrageous rumor. Or roll Bogut dice. Those are not the only quality centers alleged as available.

Danny will do something or I'll be very surprised if he stands pat for center. It's too bad Zizac isn't ready. Maybe we can count on him next year for Jaylen Brown minutes at a minimum. At some point one imagines Jaylen will get Marcus Smart minutes. Jae needs to calm down.