Adrian Wojnarowski : The end of the KG era

[CoachBo]

Yawn.

Wojo has swung and missed more than he's hit anything lately.

He's the Howard Kurtz of the NBA.

[gpap]

No, it is not saying something. You are completely ignoring that our complete core (Rondo, KG, Pierce) was playing last year. You say we had a change to make the playoffs, yet Pierce, Allen, Stiemsma and Pietrus were all injured. Bradley, Green, Wilcox etc. weren't even playing and the rest of the bench was nonexistent (it scored a combined two points in game 7).

This year, we had a complete team with a much better bench that was actually producing but one of our core players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. The only thing this year proved was how much valuable Rondo is to this team.

You completely ignored Rondo. They couldn't make it out of first round because one of our best players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. If you take Rondo out of the Celtics, obviously they won't do good. Just like if you take LeBron out of the Heat, Durant out of Thunder, CP3 out of Clippers, Kobe out of Lakers etc.
None of those teams will do as well without their best or one of the best players.

If you are going to just start ignoring the most obvious things to try to prove your decision, then I can alter the reality to prove my point too.

Its like taking a² out of the Pythagorean Theorem (a²+b²=c²)
[/quote]

Last year, we had a healthy Rondo and we still couldn't get past Miami in the Eastern Conference finals. I also don't think Rondo has the same effect on the Celtics that a Durant or Lebron has on their respective teams. Rondo is talented but I don't think he's an elite NBA player.Regarding injuries, that's something to pin on Ainge 100%.

It's the GM's job to foresee injuries and provide the team with proper depth as injuries happen to all teams.

Regarding Pierce and KG, my feeling is if you bring them back, at this point they are nothing more than role/bench players.

Bringing them back is not necessarily a bad idea, BUT you can not rely on them to carry you. You need younger, more atheltic players in their prime to replace them in the starting line up.

I am not necessarily saying we should axe Pierce/KG. But, if we play our cards right, I also don't think our team will be an embarrasment without them.

[badshar]

No, it is not saying something. You are completely ignoring that our complete core (Rondo, KG, Pierce) was playing last year. You say we had a change to make the playoffs, yet Pierce, Allen, Stiemsma and Pietrus were all injured. Bradley, Green, Wilcox etc. weren't even playing and the rest of the bench was nonexistent (it scored a combined two points in game 7).

This year, we had a complete team with a much better bench that was actually producing but one of our core players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. The only thing this year proved was how much valuable Rondo is to this team.

You completely ignored Rondo. They couldn't make it out of first round because one of our best players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. If you take Rondo out of the Celtics, obviously they won't do good. Just like if you take LeBron out of the Heat, Durant out of Thunder, CP3 out of Clippers, Kobe out of Lakers etc.
None of those teams will do as well without their best or one of the best players.

If you are going to just start ignoring the most obvious things to try to prove your decision, then I can alter the reality to prove my point too.

Its like taking a² out of the Pythagorean Theorem (a²+b²=c²)

Last year, we had a healthy Rondo and we still couldn't get past Miami in the Eastern Conference finals. I also don't think Rondo has the same effect on the Celtics that a Durant or Lebron has on their respective teams. Rondo is talented but I don't think he's an elite NBA player.Regarding injuries, that's something to pin on Ainge 100%.

It's the GM's job to foresee injuries and provide the team with proper depth as injuries happen to all teams.

Regarding Pierce and KG, my feeling is if you bring them back, at this point they are nothing more than role/bench players.

Bringing them back is not necessarily a bad idea, BUT you can not rely on them to carry you. You need younger, more atheltic players in their prime to replace them in the starting line up.

I am not necessarily saying we should axe Pierce/KG. But, if we play our cards right, I also don't think our team will be an embarrasment without them.
[/quote]
So it is Danny's job to look into the future to see if Rondo and Barbosa will go down with ACL?
We were not supposed to rely on Pierce and KG to carry us, unfortunate circumstances put us in that position.

[gpap]

So it is Danny's job to look into the future to see if Rondo and Barbosa will go down with ACL?
We were not supposed to rely on Pierce and KG to carry us, unfortunate circumstances put us in that position.
[/quote]

I don't think  losing Rondo and Barbosa killed our chances this year.  It was lack of size. Against the Knicks, we got BURIED on the glass and I mean buried. Tyson Chandler and Kenyon Martin looked like Bill Russell against us because we literally had no size.

Basketball is still a big man's sport. This small ball stuff that Doc does, just doesn't work.

So, Ainge should've provided the team with more size and he didn't.

Now regarding Rondo, Barbosa and Sullinger, all of those injuries happened before the trade deadline. Ainge could've addressed the voids left behind with those injuries at the trade deadline and he didn't.

He acquired Jordan Crawford and Terrence Williams, none of which did anything for us.

[indeedproceed]

Not that it needs saying, but each year is rough, and for Garnett and Pierce, that goes doubly so. When you leave a demoralizing playoff loss and begin to heal the psychic wounds and the physical ones, the last thing you want to do is think about starting all over again. That was true for me when I was 16 in highschool, and it was true for me in college. I imagine in a grueling grinding season like the NBA, and for a guy way closer to 40 than 30, that goes more than double or triple any kind end-of-season doledrums I ever felt.

And for a guy like Garnett whose competitive fire makes anything I ever had look more like a match next to an inferno than anything else, I imagine the old itch will still come when training camp rolls around. Maybe he'll answer it, maybe he won't, but nothing he says now or doesn't say short of an outright commitment to play, or official retirement, means anything.

Is going to be long summer.

[bobbyv]

No, it is not saying something. You are completely ignoring that our complete core (Rondo, KG, Pierce) was playing last year. You say we had a change to make the playoffs, yet Pierce, Allen, Stiemsma and Pietrus were all injured. Bradley, Green, Wilcox etc. weren't even playing and the rest of the bench was nonexistent (it scored a combined two points in game 7).

This year, we had a complete team with a much better bench that was actually producing but one of our core players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. The only thing this year proved was how much valuable Rondo is to this team.

You completely ignored Rondo. They couldn't make it out of first round because one of our best players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. If you take Rondo out of the Celtics, obviously they won't do good. Just like if you take LeBron out of the Heat, Durant out of Thunder, CP3 out of Clippers, Kobe out of Lakers etc.
None of those teams will do as well without their best or one of the best players.

If you are going to just start ignoring the most obvious things to try to prove your decision, then I can alter the reality to prove my point too.

Its like taking a² out of the Pythagorean Theorem (a²+b²=c²)

Last year, we had a healthy Rondo and we still couldn't get past Miami in the Eastern Conference finals. I also don't think Rondo has the same effect on the Celtics that a Durant or Lebron has on their respective teams. Rondo is talented but I don't think he's an elite NBA player.Regarding injuries, that's something to pin on Ainge 100%.

It's the GM's job to foresee injuries and provide the team with proper depth as injuries happen to all teams.

Regarding Pierce and KG, my feeling is if you bring them back, at this point they are nothing more than role/bench players.

Bringing them back is not necessarily a bad idea, BUT you can not rely on them to carry you. You need younger, more atheltic players in their prime to replace them in the starting line up.

I am not necessarily saying we should axe Pierce/KG. But, if we play our cards right, I also don't think our team will be an embarrasment without them.
[/quote]
Ray and Pierce were injured. Rondo carried us as far as he could

[badshar]

No, it is not saying something. You are completely ignoring that our complete core (Rondo, KG, Pierce) was playing last year. You say we had a change to make the playoffs, yet Pierce, Allen, Stiemsma and Pietrus were all injured. Bradley, Green, Wilcox etc. weren't even playing and the rest of the bench was nonexistent (it scored a combined two points in game 7).

This year, we had a complete team with a much better bench that was actually producing but one of our core players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. The only thing this year proved was how much valuable Rondo is to this team.

You completely ignored Rondo. They couldn't make it out of first round because one of our best players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. If you take Rondo out of the Celtics, obviously they won't do good. Just like if you take LeBron out of the Heat, Durant out of Thunder, CP3 out of Clippers, Kobe out of Lakers etc.
None of those teams will do as well without their best or one of the best players.

If you are going to just start ignoring the most obvious things to try to prove your decision, then I can alter the reality to prove my point too.

Its like taking a² out of the Pythagorean Theorem (a²+b²=c²)

Last year, we had a healthy Rondo and we still couldn't get past Miami in the Eastern Conference finals. I also don't think Rondo has the same effect on the Celtics that a Durant or Lebron has on their respective teams. Rondo is talented but I don't think he's an elite NBA player.Regarding injuries, that's something to pin on Ainge 100%.

It's the GM's job to foresee injuries and provide the team with proper depth as injuries happen to all teams.

Regarding Pierce and KG, my feeling is if you bring them back, at this point they are nothing more than role/bench players.

Bringing them back is not necessarily a bad idea, BUT you can not rely on them to carry you. You need younger, more atheltic players in their prime to replace them in the starting line up.

I am not necessarily saying we should axe Pierce/KG. But, if we play our cards right, I also don't think our team will be an embarrasment without them.

Ray and Pierce were injured. Rondo carried us as far as he could
[/quote]
*Rondo and KG carried us as far as they could by themselves

[TripleOT]

So the Clips don't pull the trigger on the KG trade, and Jordan goes for a robust 3.7ppg and 6.3 rpg in the playoffs, losing minutes to a washed up Lamar Odom.  And Bledsoe barely gets on the court, 15 mpg, to score 6 ppg. 

KG plays the best of any big in the playoffs, and leads in rebounds per game at a hefty 13.7 while putting up more points per game than Bledsoe  and DJ combined.  The Clippers were stupid to not pull the trigger on the trade, but that'show most teams operate.  They play it safe, and that's why Ainge probably won't get anything for either KG or PP.

It's funny how Rondo catches so much flack, but a PG like Chris Paul escapes criticism even though he can't get his team out of the first round.  Shouldn't a top 5 player, with a good team, always get his team out of the first round?

One thing Rondo can do that many players can't is elevate his game in the playoffs.  When teams lock in, very few players can impose their will on a team in a game and a series.  Rondo can and has, many times.  Yes, he's benefited from playing with veteran HOFers, but the guy is a franchise PG. 

[BballTim]

No, it is not saying something. You are completely ignoring that our complete core (Rondo, KG, Pierce) was playing last year. You say we had a change to make the playoffs, yet Pierce, Allen, Stiemsma and Pietrus were all injured. Bradley, Green, Wilcox etc. weren't even playing and the rest of the bench was nonexistent (it scored a combined two points in game 7).

This year, we had a complete team with a much better bench that was actually producing but one of our core players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. The only thing this year proved was how much valuable Rondo is to this team.

You completely ignored Rondo. They couldn't make it out of first round because one of our best players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. If you take Rondo out of the Celtics, obviously they won't do good. Just like if you take LeBron out of the Heat, Durant out of Thunder, CP3 out of Clippers, Kobe out of Lakers etc.
None of those teams will do as well without their best or one of the best players.

If you are going to just start ignoring the most obvious things to try to prove your decision, then I can alter the reality to prove my point too.

Its like taking a² out of the Pythagorean Theorem (a²+b²=c²)

Last year, we had a healthy Rondo and we still couldn't get past Miami in the Eastern Conference finals. I also don't think Rondo has the same effect on the Celtics that a Durant or Lebron has on their respective teams.

  If not beating the Heat is your measuring stick for Rondo you should also use it for a healthy trio of Durant/Westbrook/Harden. Whatever you think it says about Rondo, it says the same thing about all three of those players.

[eugen]

Wrong descriptions for an expereicned columnist... KG era?! Doc era maybe have some sense.

[fairweatherfan]

Not that it needs saying, but each year is rough, and for Garnett and Pierce, that goes doubly so. When you leave a demoralizing playoff loss and begin to heal the psychic wounds and the physical ones, the last thing you want to do is think about starting all over again. That was true for me when I was 16 in highschool, and it was true for me in college. I imagine in a grueling grinding season like the NBA, and for a guy way closer to 40 than 30, that goes more than double or triple any kind end-of-season doledrums I ever felt.

And for a guy like Garnett whose competitive fire makes anything I ever had look more like a match next to an inferno than anything else, I imagine the old itch will still come when training camp rolls around. Maybe he'll answer it, maybe he won't, but nothing he says now or doesn't say short of an outright commitment to play, or official retirement, means anything.

Is going to be long summer.

My gut says KG will be able to be talked into one more run with Rondo and Pierce, and Rondo and Pierce will be willing to try and talk KG into one more run.

But, if the team trades or releases Pierce it takes the decision out of KG's hands and he'll get traded or, more likely, hang it up.  KG's not the type to go mercenary for one last year, especially not with a ring already.

To me, it feels like it comes down more to Danny than to KG.  But as always, we don't really know.

[j804]

If Pierce and KG really do leave, then we can all get ready to cheer for a team that will suck for the next 10 years and will be nothing but an embarrassment.

"You forgetting someone?"

No I am not. I am a big Rondo fan and I was one those who didn't want to trade him for Chris Paul, but Rondo is not LeBron who can single-handedly take his team far into the playoffs. Sure Rondo steps up his game, but a team with just Rondo will be just like a team with one superstar, like it used to be before the superteams began to come forward.

In this league, you need MULTIPLE superstars to win. You can't do it alone, unless you are playing a team like the Bobcats every game.

  I could easily see him taking the current team to the ecf, the supporting cast would be clearly superior to what he had to work with last year.

Ughh we would have been playing Indiana right now

[KGs Knee]

When is the end of the Wojo era?

Now that is something I'd like to see.

[badshar]

No, it is not saying something. You are completely ignoring that our complete core (Rondo, KG, Pierce) was playing last year. You say we had a change to make the playoffs, yet Pierce, Allen, Stiemsma and Pietrus were all injured. Bradley, Green, Wilcox etc. weren't even playing and the rest of the bench was nonexistent (it scored a combined two points in game 7).

This year, we had a complete team with a much better bench that was actually producing but one of our core players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. The only thing this year proved was how much valuable Rondo is to this team.

You completely ignored Rondo. They couldn't make it out of first round because one of our best players, Rondo, wasn't even playing. If you take Rondo out of the Celtics, obviously they won't do good. Just like if you take LeBron out of the Heat, Durant out of Thunder, CP3 out of Clippers, Kobe out of Lakers etc.
None of those teams will do as well without their best or one of the best players.

If you are going to just start ignoring the most obvious things to try to prove your decision, then I can alter the reality to prove my point too.

Its like taking a² out of the Pythagorean Theorem (a²+b²=c²)

Last year, we had a healthy Rondo and we still couldn't get past Miami in the Eastern Conference finals. I also don't think Rondo has the same effect on the Celtics that a Durant or Lebron has on their respective teams.

  If not beating the Heat is your measuring stick for Rondo you should also use it for a healthy trio of Durant/Westbrook/Harden. Whatever you think it says about Rondo, it says the same thing about all three of those players.

Harden didn't show up and choked in that series. Westbrook was ball-hogging like crazy. Durant barely got to touch the ball. Scott Brooks completely failed at using his bigs to destroy the Heat down low.