The "we're old" complaint

[twinbree]

While this complaint isn't inaccurate, it seems largely irrelevant to me.

You think the fact that your three highest paid (and logically best) players are 34, 35, and 36 years old, while your starting center is 33 years old and so fragile that he contemplated retirement is inaccurate and irrelevant?

We are old. That's both accurate and relevant.

(I read the post, I just think the starting point was off)

No I think it is accurate observation but irrelevant in terms of figuring out how to move forward. I think we have a high talent level with glaring holes. Even in our Title season our core was old. Heck the pieces we added to put us over the top were Posey and PJ Brown.

I think KG, Ray, and Paul are capable of playing at a high enough level to start and win, but JO is not. We need a center to make the system that Doc runs work and I am beyond dismayed that Danny either doesn't realized this or can't remedy it.

Yeah that's what I think too. If only we had some quickness and athleticism at center it'd really help our frontcourt out. JO at this point is not a good complement to KG at all.

[winsomme]

It's not like Danny has a lot of options at the minute (to acquire a legit C).

The trade coffers are pretty bare.

Not sure why we couldn't get Gortat or Varejao.  JOs expiring adds to either team's considerable cap space. We have 2 #1's and a high #2 (NJ) to dangle.  Also, Bradley or JJJ may have a little add-in value.  I don't think I'd want DA to do this (hurts the rebuild too much), but if he thought a defensive/rebounding center would be a difference-maker for this team, either Gortat or AV are legit.

I would take either would certainly give up a #1 pick to get them. The rebuild options out there are way more suspect that actually giving our current core another shot at a Title...

I would just give this season a little more time.  If we are actually as bad as we have been playing Gortat or Varajeo are not going to turn it around. 

I think we have a good team, its just that Paul and KG are out of shape from spending the summer negotiating, they should get it back.  Maybe sign Pryz when he comes out of retirement.  But keep those picks unless something great comes along at the deadline.

I think this team is so dependent on defense that it gets exponentially worse when it can't stop dribble penetration.

and to do that the way we have in the past, we need a real center.

[Tone]

Either way this team is old and we need to get younger

[winsomme]

Either way this team is old and we need to get younger

long term, sure. this year, I don't think so.

this year we need a center...younger, older, what-have-you...he needs to be able to play the position.

[SHAQATTACK]

KG , should play in the YMCA "SENIORS" league.  

[Fan from VT]

Either way this team is old and we need to get younger

long term, sure. this year, I don't think so.

this year we need a center...younger, older, what-have-you...he needs to be able to play the position.

Thing is, when we put the big three together the first time, the thought was also that we needed to get younger long term, but not now. At some point, that time actually does become "now," but it never seems like it actually is "now," because all the players look the same and they were good last year...but they are at an age where at any year, they will hit a wall and drop off. It kind of looks like we may be there, where a small upgrade isn't going to really help. I mean, sure, if by fixing the center position you mean adding dwight howard, or nene, or gasol without giving anything up, then yeah probably we can still be young enough to win. But how do we get anything? good centers just aren't shopped for the scraps the c's have to offer.

[Tayo]

The Celtics may be old, however Ray Allen is still shooting well above the league average from beyond the arc, inside the arc and at the line, as he has done throughout virtually his entire NBA career.

 -- can't say the same for the other Celtics, especially when you factor in our captain's abysmal field goal percentage (currently @ .372), though it is interesting to note that Ray Allen's league leading 3 point percentage of .577 means that each 3 point attempt he takes shooting that well is worth 1.731 points! That means Ray Allen's 3's are currently the 'most valuable shot' in the league, which doesn't hurt considering he has made more NBA 3-pointers than anyone else, ever.

Kobe Bryant, by comparison is shooting only .254 from beyond the arc which means his 3's are only worth .762 of a point, which is lower than Kobe's current free throw percentage of .835 so technically it is better for Bryant to stick to mid-range jumpers or to get to the foul line.

Now, I'm not saying that shot selection is everything because the Celtics are currently ranked 8th in effective field goal percentage compared to the Lakers at 10th though their record is way better than ours. This team is definitely lacking in defense, rebounding (offensive and defensive boards) and second-chance points.

Age might be a factor, though in that case it seems that only Paul Pierce and Kevin Garnett seem to be suffering despite the fact that they are both younger than Ray.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/stats.html

http://espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/teamstats/_/sort/effectiveFGPct

[LB3533]

If Ray scored 20 last game against the Pacers, we would have been right in that game at the end...even with Rondo a no show.

We also didn't get anything from our bench except for Bass who was mediocre.

JO was abysmal on offense.

Our rebounding continues to stink up the joint.

[Q_FBE]

How about the we are out of form complaint? That is more appropriate. KG, Paul, and others will not continue to suck. The others will continue to work hard to earn playing time. Doc will put out the best teams based on situational matchups that have the best chance to work to the Celtics advantage.

The onus is on the players to execute and do their jobs.
The onus is on the coach to find the best situational matchups.
The onus is on the GM to scout out trading opportunities.

The other 29 teams have exactly the same onusses as the Celtics.

I am not buying this we are old. We are playing poorly.

[Tgro]

Either way this team is old and we need to get younger

long term, sure. this year, I don't think so.

this year we need a center...younger, older, what-have-you...he needs to be able to play the position.

I actually agree with this. I think it begins there.

A serviceable center would be like the fountain of youth to us.

Remember last year when we came out of the gates guns a blazing and had the best record in the NBA until about the beginning of January??? Well, Shaq was healthy then and with his presence, the rest of the Celtics were able to do what they do best. We looked like true legitimate contenders. This was just 12 months ago! These "old" dudes were playing some awesome basketball!

Only 1 thing really changed....

Remember when things got bad? When Shaq got hurt and when Perkins got traded. Heck, we played decent with a platoon of Krstic, Erden and O'Neil sometimes because even that was better than what we have now. But it was steadily getting worse because our center situation kept getting worse too. We went from having depth at center to having nothing at center! 

We lost the playoffs with O'Neil starting. I really think he punked us this season because after his operation and rehab, he came back not looking too bad. His playoff performance showed promise. In fact, he made it look like the offseason may make him healthier and even better. I remember hearing just a couple of weeks ago that this was the first time in a few years he's playing without any pain. He made it seem like he was going to play better than he has in 3 or 4 years. So what does he do instead? He plays totally lethargic, flatfooted ball and we go down in flames.

We have no inside presence at all and we can't stop anybody in the middle either.

I think if you give us one serviceable (and by that I mean efficient and better than O'Neil) center and we start playing better. At that point you can work on fixing the other pieces but I do think we're going down in flames unless we get a semi-decent center because we're too easy to defend and we're too easy to score on. Both of those reasons have to do with lack of center.   

[winsomme]

Either way this team is old and we need to get younger

long term, sure. this year, I don't think so.

this year we need a center...younger, older, what-have-you...he needs to be able to play the position.

I actually agree with this. I think it begins there.

A serviceable center would be like the fountain of youth to us.

Remember last year when we came out of the gates guns a blazing and had the best record in the NBA until about the beginning of January??? Well, Shaq was healthy then and with his presence, the rest of the Celtics were able to do what they do best. We looked like true legitimate contenders. This was just 12 months ago! These "old" dudes were playing some awesome basketball!

Only 1 thing really changed....

Remember when things got bad? When Shaq got hurt and when Perkins got traded. Heck, we played decent with a platoon of Krstic, Erden and O'Neil sometimes because even that was better than what we have now. But it was steadily getting worse because our center situation kept getting worse too. We went from having depth at center to having nothing at center! 

We lost the playoffs with O'Neil starting. I really think he punked us this season because after his operation and rehab, he came back not looking too bad. His playoff performance showed promise. In fact, he made it look like the offseason may make him healthier and even better. I remember hearing just a couple of weeks ago that this was the first time in a few years he's playing without any pain. He made it seem like he was going to play better than he has in 3 or 4 years. So what does he do instead? He plays totally lethargic, flatfooted ball and we go down in flames.

We have no inside presence at all and we can't stop anybody in the middle either.

I think if you give us one serviceable (and by that I mean efficient and better than O'Neil) center and we start playing better. At that point you can work on fixing the other pieces but I do think we're going down in flames unless we get a semi-decent center because we're too easy to defend and we're too easy to score on. Both of those reasons have to do with lack of center.   

Yes, thank you. TP.

A real center could transform this team. The defense would improve exponentially which would give us our swagger back and that would lead to better scoring.

When Shaq was healthy this team was powerful. When Perk was healthy this team was powerful.

it is crystal clear. this team needs a center to function properly. I just wish Danny agreed or was able to make it happen.